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  1. #1

    Default patents patents patents

    I know patents help protect the person or company that comes up with the idea.

    but some times i think patents is what hinders us from having more advance tech from being made. a company patents something and it can only go in their products or they just sit on it and never use it and dont open it for use by other companies.

    I remember reading a few months back a article about google and another i think phone company trying to buy a company that was going under mainly to acquire its patents....

    apple patents everything even their doodles on napkins

    I know we need patents, but some times think it goes to far. I remember hearing apple suing over the patent that they patented the swipe to unlock on there iphone...really apple....really

    discuss your thoughts on patents

  2. #2

    Default Re: patents patents patents

    apple's....special.

    Microsoft on the other hand will just run the other guy out of business or buy it outright. rofl.

    so i half agree with you.

  3. #3

    Default Re: patents patents patents

    I think there are more important things in the world to worry about.

    Like whens the next sale going on at the local grocery store?!
    I sure am hungry

    Just a little drunk dwarven bi-ped wreaking havoc in chaos.

  4. #4

    Default Re: patents patents patents

    Everything has two sides.
    Frith-Rae BridgeSol
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    Iea has returned.

  5. #5
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    Default Re: patents patents patents

    Quote Originally Posted by Frith-Rae View Post
    Everything has two sides.
    Some even have more!
    But that discovery I have patented.

    Hurray! Mor
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  6. #6

    Default Re: patents patents patents

    Patents are made so the "first" person that thought them up can get paid for their ideas. No one says that they have to be the ones the produce the item in the long run, but the people that do produce the patented item gets rewarded for thinking up the item first.

    The biggest problem I have with it is, to get something patented, you have to have financial backing these days. You have to have a Patent lawyer, to see if your patent infringes on other peoples. If it might, you have to go to court, to determine where your their patent ends, and where your "new" idea begins.. It usually takes 4-8 months to get a patent these days because of all the hoops you have to jump through to get something through.

    If I could only go back to when I was a kid and patent all the things I thought up... lets see... Heated car seats, that woulda been a nice patent. Windshield wipers that turn themselves on when they sense the windshield is wet (oh yes.. that has been produced). Pickup truck toolbox bed... that is where the regular outside of the truck looks like a regular outside, but the outside opens out to reveal tool boxes... (yes.. that was made too, like.. 5 years after I came up with the idea).

    The problem is. when I came up with those Ideas about 30 years ago, I was like.. 8-10.. and no one took my ideas seriously. Now guess what.. all those ideas have been now produced, and personally I love the heated seats... way love them. Too bad an 8 yr old cant afford all the patent crap.
    Elated that HZ is no longer in the hands of the Infidels.

    Now.. I may have to split my time between 2 games... CS:S and HZ...

  7. #7

    Default Re: patents patents patents

    Mom wants nothing more than to have a bed on a swing. We have automated swings for babies, why not adults? And by extension- use it on a full sized bed. Sadly, it's patented but not being produced.

  8. #8

    Default Re: patents patents patents

    I'm with Frith on this one, everything has two sides.

    Patents are needed so that inventors can get their credit for inventing something, but yet, some people take it way too far in the other direction.

    Same thing goes on in the government. Someone creates a law or idea in government, and next thing you know, a couple hundred years later, it is being used to absolutely re-tar-ded lengths, and has been mistranslated up, down, and 500 ways in the wrong directions.

    Or, how about lawsuits? Okay, so if you do something dumb that causes damage to another person, or another person's property, the other person deserves some payment for the damage in the form of a lawsuit. But to sue for complete accidents? Or, how about when someone does something stupid, hurts themselves and then sues you for failing to stop them from hurting themselves?

    Like, if some guy breaks into my house, cuts himself while smashing in my kitchen window, and then sues me for his medical bills/pain-and-suffering/whatever he can tack on...

    That's another good example of a necessary thing (lawsuits) being taken in absurd directions.

  9. #9

    Default Re: patents patents patents

    if you follow endgadet and cnet news you will read about many patent lawsuits mostly apple after every one

    http://news.cnet.com/8301-1035_3-573.../?tag=mncol;2n

    So why is Apple picking fights with everyone?
    Apple believes the Android operating system has copied a lot of what makes iOS special, and it's looking to defend its turf. Late founder and CEO Steve Jobs took a hard line when it came to defending its patents, and like other technology companies, Apple has been aggressive in protecting its intellectual property.
    But the lawsuits are increasingly seen as a way for Apple to halt the momentum of Android. Google's operating system already dominates the market, and there doesn't seem to be any slowdown to its growth. Because Android is free to use, any company can pick it up and use it to power one of their products. That's meant a proliferation of low-cost devices, getting smartphones into the hands of budget-conscious consumers.
    It's widely believed that Apple went after HTC first because it had enjoyed a lot of early success with its quick adoption of Android. The legal action was seen as a shot across the bow of Android and a warning to other supporters. In addition, HTC's patent position was weaker than some of its larger peers, including Samsung and Motorola Mobility.

  10. #10

    Default Re: patents patents patents

    So this is really a rant about Apple and not patents...

    Don't blame Patents for Apple..LOL.

    But on the other side - Apple is also sued hundreds/thousands of times a year.

    So again, two sides to everything. (except for those things that have multiple sides, which Sigi has patented..lol )

    I have no issue with Apple defending what it considers its own intellectual property because I have no issue with anyone ELSE being able to do the same. Right of one, right of all.

    (And besides all this, I do think the other os phones copied heavily from the iphone model else they wouldn't all have to look the friction same, have the same slider-unlocks, and all that jazz that apple did first).

    My gripe - why cant people come up with their own pure ideas instead of just borrowing what someone else has already done as the model for their own?

    The slider on my android phone is CRAP and doesn't even SLIDE half the time. I can thinkn of umpteen hundred other ways they could unlock screens than that stupid slider. But no - they cant be original so when my phone is feeling wonky I cant even ANSWER the DANG THING!

    ITS A PHONE!

    LOL to keep from *cry*
    Frith-Rae BridgeSol
    Great Elder of Keir Chet K'Eilerten
    Iea has returned.

  11. #11

    Default Re: patents patents patents

    no this is not a rant about apple. that article was just the most recent patent battle on cnet. heres another where cnet talks about a company made solely to buy patents then sue companies based on the patents they bought

    http://news.cnet.com/8301-13579_3-57...?tag=cnetRiver

    Digitude Innovations--a company known more for obtaining patents for the purpose of suing other companies for royalties than making products--appears to have acquired two Apple patents it's using to press for royalties or product bans from other tech companies, according to a TechCrunch report. Digitude is reportedly using the patents against Amazon, HTC, LG, Nokia, RIM, Samsung, and Sony.

  12. #12

    Default Re: patents patents patents

    Quote Originally Posted by Frith-Rae View Post
    My gripe - why cant people come up with their own pure ideas instead of just borrowing what someone else has already done as the model for their own?

    The slider on my android phone is CRAP and doesn't even SLIDE half the time. I can thinkn of umpteen hundred other ways they could unlock screens than that stupid slider. But no - they cant be original so when my phone is feeling wonky I cant even ANSWER the DANG THING!
    You seem to be saying that coming up with purly original ideas is no big deal. I'd like to see a list of those umpteen hundred other ways you claim you could think of. Exaggerated number aside, what about 10 ways? Would they be recognizable to the general public as being purly your own ideas? Would they be more useful than what they would replace? How would they be implemented?

    I'm sorry but it bothers me a little when people seem to think that it's a simple task to come up with (and implement) purely original ideas. Especially if you want the general public to recognize it as being an original idea.
    Avatar is of my character Akrion, snipped from Hrae's Hoard of Creatures by the excellent moss loving artist Nambroth. <3

  13. #13

    Default Re: patents patents patents

    Well you do have a point - original ideas are impossibly hard.

    Eh, to me, given the example I was giving - just pressing the top button (which you have to press anyway to turn the screen on/off regardless - also on Apple) should be a valid way to answer and then/also unlock yoru screen.

    I did not mean it had to be some revoulationary idea - but neither does it have to be such a direct ripoff of the apple style. They want to prove just cuz its Apple doesnt mean its awesome - but then ripping off the "first slider" and putting it on all subsequent touch screens that arent apple..doent make Apple seem less awesome LOL .

    Just beucase something is new doesnt mean all the rest HAVE to copy. Sometimes something equally as simple, if "old hat" could work just as well .

    (and yes I do think it is beyond craptastic that it is OK for someone to start a business based on frivolous/setup lawsuits...)
    Frith-Rae BridgeSol
    Great Elder of Keir Chet K'Eilerten
    Iea has returned.

  14. #14

    Default Re: patents patents patents

    Quote Originally Posted by Frith-Rae View Post
    Eh, to me, given the example I was giving - just pressing the top button (which you have to press anyway to turn the screen on/off regardless - also on Apple) should be a valid way to answer and then/also unlock yoru screen.
    Not trying to push this thread too far off topic, but just to comment on this idea: This would cause many problems when the phone is in your pocket. A simple button press to unlock the phone and allow for any number of other accidental button presses. A situation where one may accidently pocket dial some random person from non-flip phones could become a situation where one flashes their phone memory with a smart phone. Often times new ideas that become really popular are repeated because they tend to be among the best ways to achieve something (it's also usually cheaper).

    This is exactly the same thing regarding new MMOs seemingly copying features from WoW. While they could just be copying said feature because it's something WoW does, they could also be doing so because it's a really refined and well executed idea and to come up with a new idea that can work just as well is extremely difficult (and as a result, expensive).

    Now part of the problem with using other ideas is that sometimes patents will get in the way of allowing you to execute it as well as whoever did it first. An example of this is the Xbox 360 controller's D-pad. It's terrible, but many of the good designs have been patented by Sony and Nintendo. Now this is a good argument to say that it probably didn't need a D-pad to begin with, but it was just an example.
    Avatar is of my character Akrion, snipped from Hrae's Hoard of Creatures by the excellent moss loving artist Nambroth. <3

  15. #15

    Default Re: patents patents patents

    Actually a good example about unique ideas that I learned from personal experience a little over a month ago:

    For the past ~4 months I've been working with various game-related things from understanding working with 3D graphics to putting together plans for what I hope to do. The game idea I had planned out the most and had the greatest amount of work spent on was a Minecraft-like game in a space setting where one can do things such as build ships which can be piloted and walked around in, essentially allowing for the building of large ships that require multiple players to operate. Or the building and operating of a space station. I had a number of ideas planned for this game but while I was researching Voxel engines I happened across this:

    http://blockaderunnergame.com

    Needless to say I couldn't believe it. xD So many specific ideas I had come up with are present in this game and I had talked to nobody about them. But alas it's been in the works for quite some time now. Just goes to show you that your ideas might not be quite as unique as you initially thought.

    In the end it was probably for the better as I would have needed to program an engine from scratch to effectively achieve a game like that. I've already had some loose plans for another game that I've since been working with; a game I hope to sort of try and re-capture the style and feel of older games like Deus Ex which I can actually use pre-existing engines for (in this case I've been working with the Unity engine).

    Anyway, just a personal experience of trying to come up with atleast somewhat unique ideas. x3
    Avatar is of my character Akrion, snipped from Hrae's Hoard of Creatures by the excellent moss loving artist Nambroth. <3

  16. #16

    Default Re: patents patents patents

    I used to have patents, but then I took an arrow to the knee


    Im sorry blue, I had to :P dont send waves of arrows at me.

    In reguards to the OP topic, Original patents and ideas are extremly hard. A good example would be in dealign with purely intellectual ideas such as in physics and mathematics. It is very similar that you have to be VERY careful that your ideas are new, and give credit to EVERYONE whom your idea is based off of. at least in physics, if you reference person A, you are referencing everyone reference A referenced heh. On the shoulders of giants indeed
    Horizons Crafting Calculator Update Team Member
    Code Name: Webdragon
    SysAdmin, Head Developer

  17. #17

    Default Re: patents patents patents

    Akrion is pretty much right on about ideas and how they build off each other. Companies use a presentation of an idea, because the consumer knows and recognizes it. If users are use to pushing a button on a machine to start it, why would I then create a pull string instead for my own? Here's a good example... I just returned to Horizons. They have their "Wonderful" original idea of how to control your character that's ABSOLUTELY different from EVERY other MMO out there. It's, freaking, aggravating! No right click mouse look? I have to use Num keys to look around my character? City of Heroes decided to do something weird with their chat system compared to the standard EVERY other MMO out there... it's a pain to reply to people and talk because of it.

    Following in others footsteps should be a blessing to forge your way to better implementations of things we have. Not a hindrance, and this is where I feel patents fail us as a civilization.

    Patents, from what I see, hinder innovation.

    Congrats, you made a patent and have produced your hot car seat. It burns about 50 bottoms a year, but it's your idea and you're earning money off of it. Another company comes along with a different way of making your hot car seat and it burns 25 less bottoms a year! You sue the pants off them, because it works the same for the most part to the user, therefore they're pretty much stealing your idea. They stop producing their better car seat heater, and you continue with yours. You do manage to get it down to maybe 40 bottoms a year... but it's still worse.

    This is where I sigh and say "I wish we people weren't so greedy, and I wish we worked for each others betterment." I think the world is FAR too over complicated by our laws and legislations, so complicated and protective that we hinder our own growth. However, I know this is stupid foofy thinking and I'm not educated in such matters like others are. Like Finklebody said.... I'd rather worry about the sales in a grocery store... cause I'm hungry.

  18. #18

    Default Re: patents patents patents

    This is why all patents need an expiration date... This way after 20 years of the patent filing, or whatever the law is set at, you can freely use the idea for whatever purpose.
    Elated that HZ is no longer in the hands of the Infidels.

    Now.. I may have to split my time between 2 games... CS:S and HZ...

  19. #19

    Default Re: patents patents patents

    I was having this conversation with a friend actually, and he informed me that all "Informational" stuff was suppose to be released after 7 years. That an idea should be given to the public after that point! ... it doesn't happen that way unfortunately... but... I totally agree.

  20. #20

    Default Re: patents patents patents

    Yea kinda like for patented drugs and generics. A drug company can keep their "singular" rights on a patented drug for 10 years. After 10 years then you get the cheaper, generic.

    However, generics for all the "mirror ingredients" and "same thing", do not always function the exact same way as the "name brand" drug and for some people and for some drugs you'll find you still have to get the "name brand" version.
    Frith-Rae BridgeSol
    Great Elder of Keir Chet K'Eilerten
    Iea has returned.

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