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Thread: Talk to the Team: Knight of Creation

  1. #121

    Default Re: Talk to the Team: Basic Schools (Levels 1 to 10)

    Quote Originally Posted by Guaran View Post
    Thanks.

    Any new models for the weapons or shields?
    For now it is only a concept, posted here for feedback, art assets would only be created if the concept goes further and implementation starts.
    The schedule might be tight, but there is always time.

  2. #122

    Default Re: Talk to the Team: Basic Schools (Levels 1 to 10)

    As a player working on developing a KNOC, I'm going to try to address each aspect of your post, Amon, or as many parts as I can think of to give a response to.

    First on the ticket the abilities for 'Specializations'.

    This, is a brilliant idea. I like the idea of being able to 'specialize' myself with chosen gifts from Istara herself based upon my favored combat style. It certainly would make KNOC versatile in survivability or damage output. Truthfully, since I'm a defensive player, I'd likely use one paw specialization and shield specialization. I like having an extra chance to avoid damage of any type. I'd like to refer you back to my previous post on ideas as well, please consider some of those as well.

    On the one paw slash specialty. I can't rightly think of anyone using shortswords... in fact, I've never seen any player use a shortsword, unless it was in a pinch and it was all they had. It's always been broadsword or longsword when it came to sword and shield, namely for the greater damage.

    I don't really have anything to say about the two paw slash ones, but Claymore and Longaxe sound like brand new weapons entirely! I know I don't have any formulas to make those!

    This leads me to ask, however, how would they rate, comparatively to the bastard and two handed swords for the claymore? What would the base damage stats be? How would the Longaxe compare to the current two paw axes we have? Would these be a 'single type' style weapon or would they have upper and lower tier versions, i.e. bastard sword... lower tier, two handed, upper tier.

    Shield specialization. Would we have options in this category? For example, the regular shields were revamped a number of years ago with the Tower Shields possessing the greatest armor value, but lowest block rate, medium shields were in the middle, and small shields were given the lowest armor value, but the highest block rate.

    From the looks of it... I think 'round shield' would count as a 'medium shield' and I suppose I can see that... but... why eliminate the small shields from that category? Personally, whenever I use a sword and shield, I always go with Longsword and Small Shield, because it gives the best balance between defense (much higher block rate) and offense for me.

    Now, onto Weapon Enhancements, I don't really see anything wrong here, except for the 'Energized Weapon' inflicting a mez. Considering the fact that I 'main' a Sorceror, a Mez isn't something that should be cast by an 'Energized' effect. A Mez is meant for a crowd controlling character. A KNOC is meant to be a 'damaging' character, they inflict a mez with their weapon, it'll be broken pretty quickly when they continue their attack.

    For 'Energized Weapon' perhaps a stun, 'interrupt' effect (Bind Weapon comes to mind), or even debuff effect similar to what a dragon's Lightning Breath would do (penalty to strength and dexterity and have a chance to dispell buffs) would be better. Other than that, I like the way those Weapon Enhancements look.

    Now for Shield Enhancements. I have very little to add here, but consider your 'of Spikes' bit. Why not make it go all the way? Make it reflect all types of attacks, melee, ranged, and spell! It would certainly make any foe think twice (if they actually thought things out anyhow...) about attacking the KNOC and would give them a powerful defensive tool.

    Lastly, Item Enhancements. Again, I have very little to add here as well. Why not, again, go all the way? Enable the KNOC to Conjure Armor, Ward, Resistances, or Ethereal Armor!

    The ward part would grant ward against ALL types of attack, magical and otherwise; resistances, same thing, but obviously, this would need to be tightly controlled. Perhaps you could try comparing some of the other ward/resist abilities other classes have or spells that can be crafted to give yourself a better idea of how to 'balance' it. There's a lot of room to determine what would be fitting.

    Ethereal Armor, well, there's certainly there's not enough options in game to protect one's self from Ethereal Damage. Can never have too much regular Armor as well!

    All in all, I like the proposed changes here, beautifully done!

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  3. #123

    Default Re: Talk to the Team: Basic Schools (Levels 1 to 10)

    Quote Originally Posted by AmonGwareth View Post


      • Conjure Spikes

        • Available at levels 19, 39, 59, 79, 99
        • of Spikes - Damage Shield vs incoming melee/ranged attacks


    How would this work? The "Spikes" in the name makes one picture something like Cloak of Thorns. Which does damage back to the attacker, while the player does still take damage. Or is it more like Mytical Ward of Istara, which reduces incoming damage? Or is it an ablative shield, that absorbs a portion of incoming damage and then fades?

    Quote Originally Posted by AmonGwareth View Post

    • Summoned Item Enhancements (5 Tiers of Each)

      • All require keyword: summoned_item
      • Conjure Strength
        • Of Strength - +Strength

      • Conjure Dexterity
        • Of Dexterity - +Dexterity

      • Conjure Power
        • Of Power - +Power

      • Conjure Focus
        • Of Focus - +Focus

      • Conjure Health
        • Of Health - +Health
    These seem a bit boring, but I take it they are effects on top of the existing effects? Summoned Item applies to what, a sword or shield? Could I summon both Vampiric Weapon and Conjure Strength? Need more clarification as to what "Summoned Item" these would enhance.

  4. #124

    Default Re: Talk to the Team: Basic Schools (Levels 1 to 10)

    So, I'm loving the sounds of possible new abilities. My alt is set up already for KNoC.. would love to see some of this implemented. No complaints so far.

  5. #125

    Default Re: Talk to the Team: Basic Schools (Levels 1 to 10)

    These seem a bit boring, but I take it they are effects on top of the existing effects? Summoned Item applies to what, a sword or shield? Could I summon both Vampiric Weapon and Conjure Strength? Need more clarification as to what "Summoned Item" these would enhance.


    They aren't meant to be flashy. Rather, they were added to provide the KNOC player some capability to boost stats like you would on a regular crafted item. Summoned Items, as I mentioned in my reply above, count as either a weapon or shield.

    Note that these effects don't actually install onto the summoned items, they are simply buffs that can only be cast if you have a summoned weapon/shield active.

    Yes, you could have both Conjure Vampiric Weapon and Conjure Strength active at the same time.

    How would this work? The "Spikes" in the name makes one picture something like Cloak of Thorns. Which does damage back to the attacker, while the player does still take damage. Or is it more like Mytical Ward of Istara, which reduces incoming damage? Or is it an ablative shield, that absorbs a portion of incoming damage and then fades?


    Don't know yet, haven't done any more thinking about it than what you have seen.

    Litarath, thank you for the feedback. The one thing we have to keep in mind (we being the devs) is that we can't take too much away from other schools that a player might join and master abilities in or that other players in a group might offer.
    "Alea iacta est" -- Julius Caesar

    Toot shouted, voice shrill, "In the name of the Pizza Lord! Charge!" (Jim Butcher's Dresden Files)

    "Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will spends it whole life believing that it is stupid." -- Albert Einstein

  6. #126

    Default Re: Talk to the Team: Basic Schools (Levels 1 to 10)

    Yeah there is no need to make the spikes overpowered.

    Part of what will make a class particularly useful, are group buff aura's. I think many classes could be improved if some kind of group aura was added.

    Some group aura's we have, some good, some not so good:
    Healer:
    Illustrious Stand +162 attack skill vs aegis
    Aura of health group aoe hot.

    Paladin
    aura of light +25% damage vs undead for group
    aura of command + attack skill for group

    Druid
    Aura of the Bear +strength for group
    Aura of the Mongoose +dexterity for the group
    Neither of these stack with Dragon Promote Vitality, that needs fixed.

    Sorcerer
    Group Power Aura - group power buff

    Reaver
    Group Ethereal Blade - 1 attack does ethereal damage
    This really needs put back the way it originally was, a 1 minute group buff. Thought thinking about this one, it's not technically an aura.. Perhaps add an aura to Reaver for say 15% chance damage is Ethereal for the group. We would finally see people playing in Reaver again.

    And there are more. Fixing those with issues such as the druid aura's would encourage people to play in Druid. Most do not.

    So what could we give to Knoc as a group aura? They are a sword/shield user with ability to summon things. So something along those lines:

    Summoned Sprites
    -5% chance to hit on incoming spell damage
    A slight glowing effect just above the players head, a few tiny dots slowly rotating around. Creatures who eat magic, summoned from the realm of "x"

    Aura of Banishment
    5% chance on melee hit to banish the targets armor for 3 seconds.
    -or-
    5% chance to banish targets' weapon for 5 seconds. Target cannot use melee or ranged melee weapons for 5 seconds, and if its a caster with a staff, they lose the buffs the staff gives them for 5 seconds. They could still cast spells, just be weaker. Actually they could still melee attack too, but it would be unarmed attacks and do damage related to the mobs unarmed skill. I like this version of this aura the best. It's fresh and new, fits with the class, and would encourage new tactics.

    Things like this. So the existing proposals are pretty good and interesting, but lets try to find an aura option as well.

  7. #127

    Default Re: Talk to the Team: Basic Schools (Levels 1 to 10)

    Being able to summon elementals is always a fun thing. since it's a summoning class.. maybe summon things like a wolf and water spirit at lower lvls, choose one of 3 types. later you can summon up to 2 creatures (a wolf and a golem, higher lvls than before.) maybe in 80+ levels summon up to 3 creatures total, for 1 hour. fire elemental, wind elemental, spirit elemental, Ice.. you get the point.. things that already exist in the game (or make up special mobs for these) These would be companion fighters for the caster only. Can be set to attack anything that attacks you, or set to peace mode, or set to attack anything you attack (choices in a sub-menu) they can die if you let their life run down during battles. But, will require healing or potions to reset their health during battle. similar to summoning blood dolls maybe.
    Last edited by Malicore; April 11th, 2017 at 08:43 PM.

  8. #128

    Default Re: Talk to the Team: Basic Schools (Levels 1 to 10)

    Amon i will keep it short and sweet.

    Love all the ideas... please revamp knoc
    Last edited by Calyndrell; April 13th, 2017 at 10:43 AM.
    Gwain Drago - Mystic Paladin
    Arzel - Knight of creation/Battlemage
    Aurakvoar - Ancient Lunus

  9. #129

    Default Re: Talk to the Team: Basic Schools (Levels 1 to 10)

    Overall I have to say I like it - I'm glad some of the ideas that I and others submitted were tossed around and seemed to have gained some solid form. :)

    A little idle thought here re: the different weapon enchants.

    The fire seems solid - damage + DoT is always good. Blessed seems fancy and useful, especially if the undead boost is considerable. Vampiric seems like a no brainer, considering.

    It does make me kinda wonder about the other two, though. A %chance to mez? Would it proc after the hit, so you could maybe mez and quickly dis-engage, or is it just kinda like a "Mini-stun" so to speak?

    And then there's ice - is the slow a movement slow or an attack slow? Movement seems a little iffy as a melee proc effect, and attack.. well.. Dispirit being so low-hanging and powerful via Cleric always made slows (i.e. Ice Disciple's entire line of punches!) kinda underwhelming, at best, to be honest. I wonder about somethin' a little more unique here that's still nicely ice-themed that might make it a tad more usable.

    At a glance, I'd imagine Vampiric + Deflection/Spikes, with situationally Ether, would probably be kinda bread n' butter!

    All in all, though, it adds a HUGE bump of uniqueness to KNoC and really pushes the feel of the entire school, which I think is great. This is exactly the kinda nuance that prestiges need to set them apart and keep folks maining them!

  10. #130

    Default Re: Talk to the Team: Basic Schools (Levels 1 to 10)

    I was thinking more on this and whilst I do like all the Ideas i can't help but think that the summoning of elementals sounds more a conjuror rather than a knight of creation. to be honest I would love to see a few more conjuration spells added to the spell line, ice hammer and flame spear are a little lonely. I always thought the "Energy saber" should be a conjuration but the Battle mage has that one.
    Gwain Drago - Mystic Paladin
    Arzel - Knight of creation/Battlemage
    Aurakvoar - Ancient Lunus

  11. #131
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    Default Re: Talk to the Team: Knight of Creation

    Keeping it short as well, I LOVE the revamp idea. Please implement it! :)
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  12. #132

    Default Re: Talk to the Team: Knight of Creation

    The elemental portion of KnoC didn't work out so we're had to revisit it a bit. We've come up with a separate idea to make the Knight of Creation into more of a true Tank (with Taunts and all). Some of the original concepts involving specializations are still present, though we have revised them a bit. Here's the breakdown of what we're thinking at the moment. Your feedback and ideas are welcomed.


    Specializations
    1-Handed Swords Specialization (when used gives a buff “1-Handed Swords Specialization”) (Broadsword, Longsord, Scimitar)
    - Power Strike
    - Critical Strike
    - Multistrike
    - Riposte - On Parry, a power strike like attack that can be performed directly after a parry (not tied to power strike cooldown), +Taunt


    1-Handed Axes Specialization (when used gives a buff “1-Handed Axes Specialization”) (Hand Axe)
    - Power Strike
    - Critical Strike
    - Cleave - Has a chance to cause a bleed when in Red Stance
    - Riposte - On Parry, a power strike like attack that can be performed directly after a parry (not tied to power strike cooldown), +Taunt


    2-Handed Swords Specialization (when used gives a buff “2-Handed Swords Specialization”) (Bastard Sword, Claymore)
    - Power Strike
    - Critical Strike
    - Wrathful Strike (left-to-right sweeping attack) (greater damage like multistrike)
    - Riposte - On Parry, a power strike like attack that can be performed directly after a parry (not tied to power strike cooldown), +Taunt


    2-Handed Axes Specialization (when used gives a buff “2-Handed Axes Specialization”) (Dane Axe, Battle-Axe)
    - Power Strike
    - Critical Strike
    - Cleave - Has a chance to cause a bleed when in Red Stance
    - Riposte - On Parry, a power strike like attack that can be performed directly after a parry (not tied to power strike cooldown), +Taunt


    Shield Specialization (when used gives a buff “Shield Specialization”) (Small, Round, Tower, Spiked, Blade)
    - Shield Stance
    - Shield Slam - On Block, Attack that does crush damage and has a chance to stun your opponent
    - Deflection - On Block, deflects the enemy’s attack and causes the next attack by the player to do 50% greater damage
    - Brandish - Wave shield about threatening the opponent (taunt) and +Block for next attack
    - Absorption Shield - When used gives a buff “Protection”, can be used on self or an ally or can make it AoE with self cast and weaker shield version apply to nearby allies
    - Defensive Wall - +Block (large amount), -50% outgoing damage


    Other Abilities:
    Taunts
    - Shout - Shouts at a target, +Taunt
    - Roar - AoE Shout, +Taunt
    - War-Chant of Istara - Aura that pulses and performs a taunt each time. -25% outgoing damage while active, -25% incoming damage


    Tank
    - Defend Other - Intercept attacks directed at friendly target, Monster does -25% less damage, -25% incoming damage, -25% outgoing damage
    - Blessing of Istara - Buff that gives bonuses to Parry, Block and Armor, +10% outgoing damage
    - Combat Focus - Short term buff that lowers recycles on abilities, letting the player taunt more often
    - Toughness - Short term buff that increases armor, but reduces outgoing damage
    "Alea iacta est" -- Julius Caesar

    Toot shouted, voice shrill, "In the name of the Pizza Lord! Charge!" (Jim Butcher's Dresden Files)

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  13. #133

    Default Re: Talk to the Team: Knight of Creation

    Almost look like a new class :D

    I like what i read :D

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  14. #134

    Default Re: Talk to the Team: Knight of Creation

    All in all.. It is starting to look like a usable and more interesting class now. Though I still wish he could have the benefits of a few summoned creatures to help hold a better tanking position, but we can't have everything :) Everything I read so far, seems to be a great improvement.

    - Absorption Shield - When used gives a buff “Protection”, can make it AoE with self cast and weaker shield version apply to nearby allies

    I agree with this version, I think would be more beneficial than the "
    When used gives a buff “Protection”, can be used on self or an ally"

  15. #135

    Default Re: Talk to the Team: Knight of Creation

    Since we are going for a tank, or possible tank class, why not give it an aura that puts intercept attacks on all the mobs within range?

    So the mobs all pretty much attack the knoc, 100% (or near to it) while it is being used. Should also come with +1500 armor, -1500 strength. So the tank tanks but can't do damage himself, but the rest of the group attacks.

    This could also be a tactical type ability, where the knoc can use it and its in effect for 2.5 minutes, 5 min recycle. It would overwrite any specialization in effect as well.

  16. #136

    Default Re: Talk to the Team: Knight of Creation

    That's an interesting idea... A "Turtle" Specialization in a way.
    "Alea iacta est" -- Julius Caesar

    Toot shouted, voice shrill, "In the name of the Pizza Lord! Charge!" (Jim Butcher's Dresden Files)

    "Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will spends it whole life believing that it is stupid." -- Albert Einstein

  17. #137

    Default Re: Talk to the Team: Knight of Creation

    Amon, I'm typing with an injured paw here, so I won't be able to address as much as I'd like to. I'll try to nail key points.

    Question about the 'Riposte'. Will it be unusable or 'greyed out' before a parry? Or will it be usable without a parry, but do less damage or use less effects? Will we be able to clearly see that it's usable?

    Likewise with those 'block' abilities, a similar question applies to them as I had about the 'Riposte'.

    Cleave and Multistrike: Will these be completely unusable unless the proper specialization is active or will we have access to them outside of specializations? I don't like the idea of losing Multistrike or Cleave because of a specialization when literally every other warrior type class uses them without certain specializations.

    I would not want to lose mastered abilities. What about the 'mastered' levels of Cleave and Multistrike? Would those become unusable too?

    Shield Stance is a mastered ability, like with Cleave and Multistrike, I don't want to lose access to it because of a specialization. Will we lose access to it too based off specialization or will we lose it overall as a mastered ability? With my Shaman, Shield Stance has become a critically valuable defensive buff and helps her tank and endure a lot more punishment.

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  18. #138

    Default Re: Talk to the Team: Knight of Creation

    Quote Originally Posted by Guaran View Post
    Since we are going for a tank, or possible tank class, why not give it an aura that puts intercept attacks on all the mobs within range?

    So the mobs all pretty much attack the knoc, 100% (or near to it) while it is being used. Should also come with +1500 armor, -1500 strength. So the tank tanks but can't do damage himself, but the rest of the group attacks.

    This could also be a tactical type ability, where the knoc can use it and its in effect for 2.5 minutes, 5 min recycle. It would overwrite any specialization in effect as well.
    unless this is further examined and setup correctly, it doesn't seem like a very effective solution. Waiting to hear more on it before liking/disliking the idea. This is changing the class from a summoning class, to a tanking (warrior) class.. disregarding the initial purpose of the class. Will have to wait and see
    Last edited by Malicore; June 23rd, 2017 at 12:11 PM.

  19. #139

    Default Re: Talk to the Team: Knight of Creation

    Quote Originally Posted by Malicore View Post
    unless this is further examined and setup correctly, it doesn't seem like a very effective solution. Waiting to hear more on it before liking/disliking the idea. This is changing the class from a summoning class, to a tanking (warrior) class.. disregarding the initial purpose of the class. Will have to wait and see
    From what I can see it's more that it's still about summoning (after all, you have to summon your gear still I'd think) but with the added idea of specialisations to make it a more versatile class. so a tanking summoning class.

    If you mean going pure summoner style, I'd think a rework of conjurer (which is the "base" summoner class) would be a better idea.

  20. #140
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    Default Re: Talk to the Team: Knight of Creation

    This last reworking looks pretty solid. However, it moves KNOC pretty far away from being an arcane/melee hybrid. I would like to see some 'caster element beyond sword/shield summoning. How about:

    - A summoned, independent shield entity that put Defend Other on the KNOC and nearby allies? Give it hitpoints, so that you can adjust the power of it.

    - Alternately, give the summoned entity a version of Distract, for magical attacks instead of melee attacks. No class currently has such an ability - there are only abilities that intercept magical attacks on target allies. Think of it as a magical vortex or web that diverts attacks from the target to the entity.

    - Just give the above ability to the KNOC. It gives the KNOC a clear and taunt-like ability that isn't currently in the game. Given that KNOC is an arcane magical hybrid, the KNOC more readily has access to arcane magical resistances and wards

    I like KNOC being able to summon some kind of separate weapon/shield entity that will off-tank for it in a pinch; I can see that an offensively oriented summon might not be what you envision for KNOC, but would this fundamentally passive entity pass?
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