Windows 10 - Do I (We) Want it?

[Darkwing_Duck]

So far, loving 10. Runs Istaria beautifuly. (Havn't tried duel logging yet however. ) netflix is a tad slow, but it runs. Might try running it with the app later, but so far no complaints.

[Aaelefein]

While Istaria continues to run (also have not tried dual log-ins yet) I can say wit absolute certainty that I will NOT be accepting the free upgrade on my other two PCs.

My Issues:
- Unable to postpone/pause/delay or schedule updates
.....This is important when it sucks up one's entire bandwidth making anything else that requires internet use impossible
- Related to the above - no indicator when there is an update being downloaded or that there is an update ready to be installed
- Finding start up to be considerably slower than the Win8.1 I had on this machine and maybe even worse than Win7 on my older machines (Disk operations are off the chart and routinely take up 100% for the first 7-10m split between various windows components and McAfee)
- Unable to remove some 'apps' or even sure if I have completely turned them off (Cortana and OneDrive being the ones most interested in completely removing/disabling) and as indicated in the below example, location services.
- Do NOT like the consolidated listings in task manager - can't identify exactly what is using a particular resource. Example:
Service Host: Local System (15)
- Application Information
- Background Intelligent Transfer Service (WTH is this?)
- Computer Browser
- Geolocation Service (thought I had disabled this - apparently not and no idea what other app is using it)
- IKE and AuthIP IPsex Keying Modules (And this is what?)
- IP Helper
- Microsoft Account Sign-In Assistant
- Server (A bit vague)
- Shell Hardware Detection
- System Event Notification Service
- Task Scheduler
- Themes
- User Manager
- User Profile Service
- Windows Management Instrumentation
- Windows Update

This is just one example and there are others with multiple listings but the data is all combined under the heading so can't tell what specifically is using say the network, disk, or CPU resources.

IMO there is just too much background items both running and transferring who knows what data to who knows who. Every iteration of Windows just keeps on adding a bunch of BS your average user doesn't need which leads to over-sized software, excessive bugs and I have to admit - dumber users. I knew a lot more about computer software/operation when it was MS-DOS and Win 3.1 and to get things accomplished than I do now. It's like cars, GPS systems and oh so many things out there nowadays - make it more complex to the point the end user just simply accepts it with no idea of the ramifications (built-in obsolescence, data-sharing, always online requirements, etc.)

Oh, and one more thing - there is something with explorer that I had an issue with in 8.1 also (not Win7) - when I'd go to a website and in the middle of scrolling down the page it would suddenly stop and it would be from a couple to twenty or more seconds before I could do anything in that window again. Computer is idle and wasn't the internet as I would test it on another PC or even in another window/site.

Okay - done ranting (maybe I should have put it there, but felt for those that haven't done it yet to maybe think about it again. My other two PCs will definitely be staying with Win 7 Pro

[Dracillion]

If upgrading or installing Windows 10 on a computer with a dedicated graphics card, disable your onboard. There is a known Intel board issue floating around that will cause phantom displays amidst other things and there is no known easy fix for this post install.

[Guaran]

While Istaria continues to run (also have not tried dual log-ins yet) I can say wit absolute certainty that I will NOT be accepting the free upgrade on my other two PCs.

My Issues:
- Unable to postpone/pause/delay or schedule updates
.....This is important when it sucks up one's entire bandwidth making anything else that requires internet use impossible
- Related to the above - no indicator when there is an update being downloaded or that there is an update ready to be installed

True, the default behavior is to update automatically, then usually reboot at 3am. You can completely change the way this functions, and make it manual again. Or just change the automatic reboot portion.

- Finding start up to be considerably slower than the Win8.1 I had on this machine and maybe even worse than Win7 on my older machines (Disk operations are off the chart and routinely take up 100% for the first 7-10m split between various windows components and McAfee)

That's weird. Mine is fast. It could be you need more system ram. My recommendation is 8gb minimum for windows 8 or 10. You can get by with 4gb but it's slower. 2gb or less and the machine is so slow its unusable. (Even with windows 7)

- Unable to remove some 'apps' or even sure if I have completely turned them off (Cortana and OneDrive being the ones most interested in completely removing/disabling) and as indicated in the below example, location services.

All settings in that regard, cortana, windows updates, etc. can be found in the lower right corner of the screen. They consolidated a lot of settings into this one place. It looks like a little squarish chat bubble. Click that. inside there, you can set security and privacy options. You can enable - disable Cortana, by enabling or disabling the privacy settings. I think Cortana would be really cool, but for now I didn't allow it access to everything it wanted, so it disabled itself.

- Do NOT like the consolidated listings in task manager - can't identify exactly what is using a particular resource. Example:
Service Host: Local System (15)
- Application Information
- Background Intelligent Transfer Service (WTH is this?)
- Computer Browser
- Geolocation Service (thought I had disabled this - apparently not and no idea what other app is using it)
- IKE and AuthIP IPsex Keying Modules (And this is what?)
- IP Helper
- Microsoft Account Sign-In Assistant
- Server (A bit vague)
- Shell Hardware Detection
- System Event Notification Service
- Task Scheduler
- Themes
- User Manager
- User Profile Service
- Windows Management Instrumentation
- Windows Update

This is just one example and there are others with multiple listings but the data is all combined under the heading so can't tell what specifically is using say the network, disk, or CPU resources.

IMO there is just too much background items both running and transferring who knows what data to who knows who. Every iteration of Windows just keeps on adding a bunch of BS your average user doesn't need which leads to over-sized software, excessive bugs and I have to admit - dumber users. I knew a lot more about computer software/operation when it was MS-DOS and Win 3.1 and to get things accomplished than I do now. It's like cars, GPS systems and oh so many things out there nowadays - make it more complex to the point the end user just simply accepts it with no idea of the ramifications (built-in obsolescence, data-sharing, always online requirements, etc.)

Oh, and one more thing - there is something with explorer that I had an issue with in 8.1 also (not Win7) - when I'd go to a website and in the middle of scrolling down the page it would suddenly stop and it would be from a couple to twenty or more seconds before I could do anything in that window again. Computer is idle and wasn't the internet as I would test it on another PC or even in another window/site.

Okay - done ranting (maybe I should have put it there, but felt for those that haven't done it yet to maybe think about it again. My other two PCs will definitely be staying with Win 7 Pro

The taskmanager is different for sure. I use the processes tab, it's just what I am used to. i use that even on windows 7. It groups tasks into a few categories, which I kind of like. But you might need to scroll to find something. You can customize the way its all displayed. With a little toying around, you will probably find something you like.

It definitely took me a couple days to get used to some of the changes, but I am liking it. Be patient with yourself, you will get it.

[Aaelefein]

True, the default behavior is to update automatically, then usually reboot at 3am. You can completely change the way this functions, and make it manual again. Or just change the automatic reboot portion.

My understanding here is that the only control you have over the new Windows Updating system is the time of any auto-restart you want. Have not found a way for the task bar to show when there is an update in progress (being down-loaded), or any other indication there is an update being download other than trying to find it in task manager under the Network Tab.

That's weird. Mine is fast. It could be you need more system ram. My recommendation is 8gb minimum for windows 8 or 10. You can get by with 4gb but it's slower. 2gb or less and the machine is so slow its unusable.

I've got Intel i7-4820K @ 3.70GHz CPU with 16GB and while not a top of the line vid card, it's got 4GB of ram as well.

I have an NVidia video card which as far as I know is up to date, and using McAfee Live Safe Internet Security (Not fan of it, but it came with the PC so never got around to changing out to Norton's). Since I didn't get my Win10 upgrade until almost a month after release, I'm going assume some of the issue as I heard about concerning security software and video cards has mostly been remedied (excepting the built-in stuff you already mentioned)? Since I don't use this computer for anything but gaming, actually considering dumping McAfee entirely and sticking with Windows Defender only. It's not like I keep the computer on when I'm not playing.

All settings in that regard, Cortana, windows updates, etc. can be found in the lower right corner of the screen. They consolidated a lot of settings into this one place. It looks like a little squarish chat bubble. Click that. inside there, you can set security and privacy options. You can enable - disable Cortana, by enabling or disabling the privacy settings. I think Cortana would be really cool, but for now I didn't allow it access to everything it wanted, so it disabled itself.

Yeah, found that the day after it upgraded. It might look nicer and more organized, to me it seems like you actually have less control over the things that are most important - specifically those things that transfer who knows what data and location; and as mentioned above, only whether the restart is automatic (at which time) or manual. I clicked off all those sliders dealing with Cortana, OneDrive and what location services/apps I could find - and I still find those items showing up in Task Manager using network resources on occasion. Not a lot but it's there.

The task manager is different for sure. I use the processes tab, it's just what I am used to. i use that even on windows 7. It groups tasks into a few categories, which I kind of like. But you might need to scroll to find something. You can customize the way its all displayed. With a little toying around, you will probably find something you like.

It definitely took me a couple days to get used to some of the changes, but I am liking it. Be patient with yourself, you will get it.

That's the biggest issue I have is how it consolidated stuff under a single heading which makes it exceedingly difficult to determine precisely what process is using system resources.

I would say another issue which was way worse in 8.1 (IMO) is how they are trying to make one's PC experience similar to that of a touchpad device (whether it's a phone or tablet computer). There is a reason I don't own a smartphone or tablet - my old Motorola RZR phone works just fine (over 10 years old now) and why I have 4 computers in the house. If I wanted the tablet experience I'd own a tablet/smartphone - a PC is not a tablet and shouldn't be made to seem/look/feel like one.

And I dread the day when one can only use cloud-based services (such as Office) where you no longer have the disk/program on your computer along with any files you create - or in the latter case, whether you want to or not, copies are stored in this ubiquitous cloud.

Sadly that appears where everything is going - simple easy access with little control. Then again I'm the one who still likes to have an actual hardcopy newspaper to read while having breakfast. Won't find me trying to read a newspaper (or a book for that matter) on a teensy 8x10 screen that is just sitting there waiting to be smudged or have something spilled on it.

[Guaran]

Try this for controlling the windows updates: http://www.howtogeek.com/224471/how-...ading-updates/


You have to turn on a setting called - Metered Connection, which implies you have limited bandwidth, so it allows you to control when the updates download. Completely non intuitive place to look.


Your computers' hardware sounds fine, should be more than adequate. I had another friend who did the upgrade, and noticed slow booting also. He did a fresh install of 10, and it fixed it for him. I suspect that maybe there was some older, non win10 compatible driver, maybe something not WHQL, that was causing the boot to be slower. (Just a theory).


Under the hood, Windows 10 is pretty much just windows 7, but with NVMe, USB 3.1 UASP support native, plus a new and improved DirectX (12). Better support for newer technologies. Without getting too technical, NVMe it is a standard designed specifically for SSDs communicating through PCIe, and enables these drives to reach peak performance with lower CPU utilization. UASP is a more modern data transfer method that finally allows USB to approach the transfer speeds of Sata6G. UASP is about 20% faster the USB 3.1 BOT which is the old transfer protocol.

[Aaelefein]

Try this for controlling the windows updates: http://www.howtogeek.com/224471/how-...ading-updates/


You have to turn on a setting called - Metered Connection, which implies you have limited bandwidth, so it allows you to control when the updates download. Completely non intuitive place to look.


Your computers' hardware sounds fine, should be more than adequate. I had another friend who did the upgrade, and noticed slow booting also. He did a fresh install of 10, and it fixed it for him. I suspect that maybe there was some older, non win10 compatible driver, maybe something not WHQL, that was causing the boot to be slower. (Just a theory).


Under the hood, Windows 10 is pretty much just windows 7, but with NVMe, USB 3.1 UASP support native, plus a new and improved DirectX (12). Better support for newer technologies. Without getting too technical, NVMe it is a standard designed specifically for SSDs communicating through PCIe, and enables these drives to reach peak performance with lower CPU utilization. UASP is a more modern data transfer method that finally allows USB to approach the transfer speeds of Sata6G. UASP is about 20% faster the USB 3.1 BOT which is the old transfer protocol.

Thanks for the link, unfortunately the option to set a connection as 'Metered' wasn't available anywhere, not under Wi-Fi, Internet, or Ethernet (I connect via a router, wired with wireless turned off). The only other option I see atm, well besides living with it and hoping that as the bugs are ironed out the updates become less frequent - is to upgrade to Professional which allows more user control of updates.

I agree there does seem to be some great things about Win10, and I certainly appreciate the help in trying to rectify some of the issues. I am also quite certain that if I had a faster internet connection I probably wouldn't be complaining about it as much as I am. I've got a 768k DSL connection but really only average 2/3's of that. The last thing I want to be doing is spending days to weeks re-downloading everything (ESO 50+GB, Pillars of Destiny 5GB, EVE 10GB) and well the list goes on where I average about 200mb/hr. The last ESO update took me 3 days which also required curtailing any other use of the internet. So for the moment that makes me very reluctant to do a fresh install and or upgrade to professional.

I still feel there is too much mandatory online connectivity required and not enough control/detail on what is/is not transmitted.

Again, thanks for your effort with all of this.

Aaelefein

[Cegaiel]

Whoa, one thing I was upset about was the aghviewer.exe (Frid's tool) didn't work on Windows 10. I tried about once a month just to see if something changed (windows updates) but nada. I was using one of the kids computer's (still windows 7) when I needed it. But their computers automatically upgraded to 10 yesterday and I was sad when I saw that. Decided to try it again today and voila, it works! Could've just been me. But previously when I tried it, it would immediately go to the "Windows is looking for a solution" to fix the crash. I even went to the Windows add/remove option and made sure every possible asp.net version was installed, so that wasn't it. But something cool recently happened

[Veruliyam]

The magic smoke inside has leveled up!