Discussion of Half Giant Racial quests :)

<Dangit> hey guys
<Dangit> you guys in the mood for serious discussions?
<WyrmCult> Sure
<Dangit> well was just going over the forums and the race sections are pretty bare. so I figured we could get them started
<Dangit> maybe go over some ideas for racial quests. things like that
<Dangit> so if you guys are willing I would like to take each race in turn and maybe hash a few ideas for them
*** Signoff: RaistyNoSleep (Ping timeout)
<Dangit> so what do you think?
<Lunhilde-sciencingAFK> im in the middle of an experiment
<Korsh> Fine by me. Mostly those discussion regarding races are pretty thin though because aside from abilities there really is no difference between them
<Lunhilde-sciencingAFK> but in short doesnt sound like a bad idea
<Dangit> well maybe we can change that through the quests.
<Korsh> When Dryads hit as hard as half-giants there's no much more that needs be said. heh
<Lunhilde-sciencingAFK> Korsh: the rest of the difference would be fluff
<Lunhilde-sciencingAFK> and what dangit said
<Dangit> while we cant change the starting stats. maybe we can add differences
<Dangit> much like the dragon quests for abilities, we could get some racial ability quests
<WyrmCult> Well, really the first thing i would be interested in knowing is what the rewards for racial quests would be. If they are just going to be simple $ and XP rewards they won't be used much(unless they are oobah). I'd think racial quests would only work well if they gave special equipment or weak(but racially unique) abilities
* Lunhilde-sciencingAFK remembers this discussion before
<Korsh> Well to start I'd like to see not one racial ability but multiples. One every 10-20 levels. Some can be as minor as a stat boost while tohers should be more in-depth like the single one we have currently
<Lunhilde-sciencingAFK> with elves it all got boiled down to bows and i got told to sheddap ;)
<AA0> I'm in and out, but will throw ideas around
<WyrmCult> I agree Korsh. Perhaps a slight increase to HtH damage for Saris(sharp claws), for example
<Lunhilde-sciencingAFK> yah, same as AAO here.. and speaking of out, off i go again :)
<Korsh> Right or a STR bonus for H-G's
<Dangit> okay, so lets start with Half Giants.
<Dangit> What could be some good Racial ability quests for them?
<AA0> what korsh said, increasing str per level
<AA0> or maybe a short term burst of strength ability
<Korsh> That'd be great. I'm sure we could come up witha host of abilities we'd like to see... the real question is what would the quests themselves be.
<Korial> 5 minute duration, 30 minute recycle, +1000 inv capacity, - 15 spd
<Dangit> well , lets work on a list of abilities , then we can customize teh quests around them
<WyrmCult> How about 'Hurl Boulder' a weak but instantly mastered racial 'pull' ability
<Korsh> Should be something more detailed than a kill x of y. Fed-Ex would be ok for a couple of them if it's talking to NPC H-G leaders who give you more backgroyund information or racial lore.
<Dangit> oh yes, racial lore must be part of any quest :)
<AA0> I like the hurl boulder, capacity or strength bursts
<Dangit> So far I have Hurl Boulder- Racial pull ability, Increased strength per level or a temp boost in str / cap
<WyrmCult> Also maybe a weaker version of Berserk Rage(Much weaker, higher level quest) and the 'Earthquake' ability would also seem to fit
<Korsh> One interesting quest might be to gather a certain series of resources or items that can only be found on a given Named NPC. One drops per kill and H-G's as a race need to gather 100 of them to complete something. That something could be facilitating the return of the H-G god (forget his name) and he rewards his children for their efforts with a special new racial ability. ;-)
<AA0> it would seem a health stat would be in order really... since they are the only race to start with 60
<Daedra> howdy folks
<WyrmCult> Good point AA0
<Nanain> hiya hun
<Dangit> okay boost to health as well.
<WyrmCult> Maybe a Half-Giant version of 'Concentrate Blood'...
<Dangit> Not familiar with Concentrate Blood, Bloodmage ability?
<Korsh> I'd like to see Giant's Daze be an automatic hit. It's the only racial ability currently with the possability of missing / failing.
<WyrmCult> Yep, does 100 damage but raises max health by 200 points. Not good to use while fighting, but great right before... :)
<Dangit> interesting.
<WyrmCult> When used right before/after 'Blood Shield' it's a great way to freak out your healer... ;)
<Korsh> Another similar to health might be increased 'toughness' or natural armor. Simple fact is something that big, heavier bone structure, etc. can shrug off blows better than say, a gnome or dryad.
<AA0> lets not copy abilities from classes though..
<Dangit> okay. so boost to health, str, range pull, cap, .
<Korsh> Might manifest as a natural crush resistance?
<WyrmCult> Well, not direct copy, just as a guideline
<AA0> right now my racial ability is a horrid version of pertrify
<WyrmCult> Yeah, Half Giants and Crush Resist would seem a match. Kind of like Pierce ward and Dryads....
<Dangit> actually maybe a crush resistance or how about a flame resistance? Giants from the Ur lord series used flame as a purifier, :)
<Korsh> Have to be some sort of lore to back that up, but sure. ;-)
<WyrmCult> Could always go Norse about it and offer Either fire OR ice resist... (considers renaming guild to Fenris Cult...)
<Korsh> Fiends already have Ice don't they?
<Dangit> think they do
<WyrmCult> Yeah, was mostly kidding, sorry. ;)
<Korsh> I dunno... anything is nice but i really want to see lore intensive quests. ;-) Particularly one that adds a religious dimension. HZ has always been a bit disappointing to me in it's lack of dieties.
<AA0> lore is really needed, but you need to have an ability first before adding the lore to it
<WyrmCult> It would be nice to be a little more involved in the storyline than 'The WA stole your plot and killed your server'....
<Korsh> How about the ability to jump? ;-)
<Dangit> okay. lets take this list. str, cap, health, range pull, resistance.
<Dangit> now who here has a list of the NPCs in Mahagra?
<WyrmCult> I'm thinking the big problem is stepping on class abilities. A self-based AoE stun would be awesome for a HG, but then what about the poor STMD
<Korsh> Bah... afk a moment, brb
<AA0> I'd hope new npcs are made, like historians around the world in racial towns
<Korsh> A stun would be awesome... it's even supported already by the effects of Giant's Daze. ok, now really afk
<AA0> the historians would talk about the history and endurances half giants have had to talk and how its able to give them what they have
<AA0> and each one would have multiple paths depending on the link you click
<Dangit> what if there was an NPC in Mahagra, call him a Chieften.
<AA0> that'd work
<Dangit> or not a chieften, but a Chieften advisor, and he advised teh chieftens of the past
<WyrmCult> 'Huskarl' was a traditional name for Norse military advisers/bodyguards...
<Dangit> Yeah but that is used a lot for the Norse guards in DAOC just that name brings flashbacks :(
<WyrmCult> Ahh, never played that one...
<WyrmCult> Sounds like i didn't miss much... ;)
<AA0> the name is just small details ;)
<Dangit> okay, So this adviser has secrets.
<Dangit> lets work with upgrades to str.
<AA0> there could be a 10 boost to current every 10 levels, like a dragon
<Dangit> what if the advisor gave a quest similar to the test of str quest in the Test of the Gifted quest?
<AA0> I was thinking that for the quest too
<Dangit> He would give you an item and you had to walk from Mahagra to Kira?
<AA0> something that overburndened you by so much or something
<Dangit> or even from the center of Mahagra to the Ice tower?
<WyrmCult> That sounds good, i like the idea of giants dragging huge boulders around to get strong.
<AA0> hm, how about...
<Walter> Bah, people don't need more strength! :)
<AA0> a quest to go to the tower, talk to the person at the base then make you way to the top :)
<AA0> that person would give you the boulder
<Dangit> hmm, stairrobics :)
<Walter> Haha
<AA0> thats one annoying walk :)
<Dangit> that would be neat :)
<Walter> I never noticed how much extra STR that mithril jewelery gives you.
<Dangit> okay, here is a question, at what level would you think this should be available
<Dangit> 10? 20?
<Walter> Somewhere around 10-15 would be cool.
<WyrmCult> In my dream world every race could have a quest every 10 levels, but i don't imagine that would improve the DB performance any...
<Walter> We need more availability for people to find these quests too, though... I had no idea that half of the quests existed in the game till I was past being able to use any of them for any benefit.
<AA0> I'd think the quest would increment, increased str every 10 or 20 levels
<AA0> not the same quest each time though
<WyrmCult> I agree Walter. I'd love to see the old 'Destroyed House' lootable quest idea adapted to these. Elves get a quest when hunting elven undead, and so on...
<Walter> That'd be great, Wyrm...
<AA0> had an idea for a health quest
<Dangit> okay. so lets say we did them every 20 levels, starting at level 10.
<Dangit> and added +10 to str each quest
<Dangit> 10, 30, 50, 70, 90, that would be +50 to a HGs sr
<Dangit> err str
<Korsh> back
<Dangit> would +50 be over balancing?
<AA0> I wouldn't say so
<Korial> I'd say +50 would be insignificant at 100.. :/
<Walter> ThatNot at all
<Korsh> Not really... as Walter pointed out it's just a drop in the bucket at higher levels.
<AA0> might add 3 points of damage..
<Walter> +50 is not insignificant; really.
<Korsh> In fact one might almost argue it's INsignificant. heh
<Walter> That's an extra 4 stat points to some crafts.
<Dangit> okay. not bad then
<Walter> And I'm at ... a bit over 1500 str fully buffed; every bit counts.
<AA0> if you are doing multiple racial quests, 50 is good
<Walter> I'd love to get an extra 50 power going on my human.
<WyrmCult> I'd settle for a +5 to my speed, but that's probably out of the question at this point. I already only run at full speed with my interface turned off...
<Korsh> Ok, so hat for lvlels 20, 40, 60, 80, 100?
<Korsh> hat = what
<Walter> Oh, and Mhedon is my official **********!
<Walter> Never realized how powerful a shield is till fighting him.
<WyrmCult> I've been head down in 'Evil Genius' for a week, who or what is Mhedon? Named nasty somewhere?
<Walter> Named Mith Golem.
<Korsh> Named mith golem
<AamerKhan|ChaosHerald> thats the 7500 HP one right?
<Walter> 9.6k I think.
<Dangit> ack
<AA0> over 9k
<WyrmCult> Ahh, haven't had the honor of tangoing with him yet, i spend all day trying not to get smacked by 'Brecah' while i'm mining...
<Dangit> just lost power here
<Walter> Time for food... bbl.
<AamerKhan|ChaosHerald> ahhh
<Korsh> ello David
<David-FixingQuest> Hello
<AamerKhan|ChaosHerald> Howdy David
<Dangit> Hi david, we were just talking about quests :)
<Dangit> racial quests
<AA0> I never got an answer to our cobalt suggestion last night, david ;)
<Korsh> Dangit here was just leading us in an interesting discussion of racial quests. :-)
<Dangit> So you guys want to continue?
<David-FixingQuest> AA0: cobalt wasn't up for discussion last night ;-)
<AamerKhan|ChaosHerald> Sure
<Korsh> Surely
<AA0> it should be..
<David-FixingQuest> We have a series of racial quests planned...
<Dangit> :)
<Dangit> More ideas never hurt
<David-FixingQuest> we have been busy getting our core work done first :-)
<David-FixingQuest> dangit: of course not, just letting you know we're already heading that way :-)
<Korsh> Are they going to help differentiate races a lil bit? My single biggest pet peeve with HZ is the whole "Dryad hits as hard as a H-G" thing. Just makes no sense. lol
<Dangit> cool, :)
<AA0> obsidian was hard and it got fixed... cobalt is harder, but never got fixed..
<Dangit> okay. So if we used the concept of the Str test, and made the HG walk up the ice tower with the boulder for +10 str. what could we get teh HG to do for the second part?
<AA0> how about slay a boulder golem, and do something with its remaining pieces
<Korsh> A Named Boulder golem
<AA0> mhedon! lol
<Dangit> so up the tower would be lvl 10, this would be level 30 quest. what are the boulder golems in that range?
<Korsh> Give it a special drop that needs to be returned to the quest giver
<WyrmCult> The problem with linking quest to named... anyone ever hear a dragon whine about 'Tiatha' not being there? Because ignorant or mean 'peds hunted her for the crystals?
<Dagda> only every 3 or 4 days
<Dangit> Wyrm, what if it was like teh lost patrol quest? the named only popped if you have the quest and in that area?
<AA0> dragons are also in a massive rush for their rop...
<Korsh> Good point, but still. I tend to think it should be tougher than the average golem for a quest.
<Korsh> That'd be better
<WyrmCult> The patrol quest worked fine for me, so it seems like the way to go. That or like 'Talon the Possessed' for the RoP, must be activated by the quester
<Dangit> okay. so lets say at level 30 the advisor tells you of a spot where a rock that lives has been bothering the travelers. and sends you to the place to take care of it
<AA0> I see no problem with named mobs, this is not a quest that has to be done asap
<Korsh> Controversial idea that would only hurt me, but still: What about for 50 (or some of them) make it a crafter quest? Adv only H-G's would be out of luck but only the well balanced H-G (craft + adv) gets the full range of benefits.
* Lunhilde-sciencingAFK scrolls back, tries to read, gives up
<Korsh> Maybe make the crafting quest at 30 so adv types wouldn't have to level crafter up too much to benefit.
<Lunhilde-sciencingAFK> Save one point: Walter - yes - shields are indeed the bomb :)
<Dangit> Korsh, crafter quests would be a whole new area. this would be just racial.
<Dangit> wouldnt matter if you are crafter or adventurer
<AA0> quests should be any level
<AamerKhan|ChaosHerald> yes dont mix them please
<Korsh> Well... killing a Named mob can be said to be a Adv quest so there'd a crossover here
<AA0> you can group to do it
<Korsh> Yes that's true.
<AamerKhan|ChaosHerald> However I would like to see solo only quests too.. like the scout the 4 locations
<Lunhilde-sciencingAFK> or
<Lunhilde-sciencingAFK> hm
<Lunhilde-sciencingAFK> Well, like that
<Lunhilde-sciencingAFK> can go with groups still
<zerbot> how do you spell neither?
<AA0> remember, these are optional quests... you don't have to do them
<Dangit> for ease, I think just allowing groups would be the way to go
<Lunhilde-sciencingAFK> if everyone has the same quest. but i wouldnt see anything wrong with that cause its not forced grouping
<zerbot> did i spell it right?
<Lunhilde-sciencingAFK> People if not forced to grouo will go solo
<AamerKhan|ChaosHerald> that would work
<Lunhilde-sciencingAFK> I believe so zerbot
<zerbot> ty
<Lunhilde-sciencingAFK> neither neither.. yah hats it
<Lunhilde-sciencingAFK> Either that or we all mis-spell it ;)
<Korsh> Ok, so that's 30 - 50?
<Dangit> 30.
<Dangit> what would 50 be?
<Dangit> I have a funny idea
<Korsh> Yea, meant now what for 50? ;-)
<Lunhilde-sciencingAFK> Also, will depend on game immersion at that point... I mean, if the NPC encourages it to be a solo quest, and you're into it and playing.. you'd certainly try it solo first
<Lunhilde-sciencingAFK> Whether groupiong would work as a default or not
<Dangit> similiar to the boulder. but this time you get a bunch of gnomes in you pack. and have to take them to New Rachival.
<Dangit> random gnome comments could be given as you go along :)
<AA0> thats testing str? or restraint?
<Lunhilde-sciencingAFK> ... on your way youre jumped by hungry renegade dragons, noo!
<Dangit> well here an idea. Unlike the boulder quest you could remove these guys from your pack
<Lunhilde-sciencingAFK> :D
<Dangit> losing out on the quest and you couldnt repeat it :)
<Lunhilde-sciencingAFK> yah, thats one thing i dont see any of
<Lunhilde-sciencingAFK> Quest failures.
<Lunhilde-sciencingAFK> Can just cancel and redo.
<Lunhilde-sciencingAFK> Never actually fail anything that ive seen as of yet
<Lunhilde-sciencingAFK> ...
<Lunhilde-sciencingAFK> is there failable quests?
<Dangit> So if they get too annoying and you drop them, then you fail, and cant do it
<Lunhilde-sciencingAFK> .. imagine someone failing a quest and getting some awful title tag, LOL
<Korsh> lol... hauling Gnomes. pretty hilarious. I'm afraid the RP Cops will scream on order though.
<AA0> the gnomes are poor, and need transport
<AA0> refugee gnomes
<Korsh> I know one: Must quest to find that rare and exotic creature... the female Half-Giant player. :-P Think I've only met one since the game went live. lol
<WyrmCult> Heh
<Lunhilde-sciencingAFK> Ive seen a couple
<Korial> that's ok Korsh... one of the gnome racial quests is to take a kidnapped HG to New rach for final testing on a HG-powered gnomian war machine :)
<WyrmCult> I knew one.
<Lunhilde-sciencingAFK> My main issue with the female half-giant toon -- their head isnt quite straight
<Lunhilde-sciencingAFK> They have a gentle tilt to their neck, like an eternal "Huh?" .. it looks silly
<Nanain> ooo a lava oastic I cant attack..kinky
<Korsh> lol... that i like korial
<Lunhilde-sciencingAFK> blue name?
<Lunhilde-sciencingAFK> greet it, see if it has a body part to wave :)
<Dangit> brb guys

I'm 100% behind racial differences and I agree with Korsh dryads hitting as hard as Half giants is just annoying.

Racial quests are something I have been hoping to see for some time and am glad to see that AE have plans to do them already.

However I think the base racial benefits we get for being Half giants should be relplaced. Make giants daze auto hit. Make the health increase a percentage based thing maybe +105% health.

Every 10 or 20 levels for quests is a good idea. I would prefer more often (10) than less.

You have identified the main two stats which would be best to raise by quests I would also consider cold/ice resistance considering our home land.

I like the idea of racial abilities as well however they are useless to the pure crafter and you need to try and cater for both

Some Quest ideas.

Level 10
Reward type: Health
Increase: +20
Quest Type: Kill
Details: NPC applies a Low non removeable dot to the player then spawns a creature just outside town that has to be killed. If the player fails (ie dies) they don't get the ability and can not retry.

Reward type: Strength
Increase: +10
Quest Type: Fed ex
Details: NPC dumps enough bronze bars to put you at 99% then sends you to a NPC craft trainer who uses bronze bars (blk maybe) In mahgra who gives you a recipt to take back and get the reward.

Reward type: Ability - Head clap
Effect: 2 second stun, 30 sec to-hit and evasion debuff
Recycle: 5 mins
Quest tyle: Talk/Fight
Details: NPC tells you about a Hermit in the mountains. You meat the hermit and he explains he knows of a technique he is willing to teach you but it takes practice to get right if you accept the quest you gain training head clap which makes a cool sound when it lands. He tells you to goto a near by area and practice using it in combat. After you have landed it 5 times
you are prompted to return and recieve the full ability.

IMO these quests should be non retryable and failable

My only reservation is this will lead to more cookie cuttering but thats unavoidable.

Good ideas Karl... I particularly like Head clap! heh

I had another idea for an ability..Bionic jump..just lets a giant jump as high as any other race and has the cool sound effect

I like the ideas of increased strength and health. But let's address the other racial ability, giant daze. The effect is okay for levels 1-30, say, where a 15% debuff and 35% delay increase will make a difference. At higher levels, it does nothingIMO. The area of effect is great, not as big as the golems Earthquake, but very nice sized at 8.

How about improving the Daze part of it? To me, this implies a stun. How about at level 50, it would become a 3 second AoE stun, much like Thunder. At level 100, make it 10 seconds likeOgre's Cry(of course I'd like to have their 30 second recycle time and an added round of damage).

We could hunt ogres of the appropriate levels for the ability (or something that uses stun attacks).

NIce to see that they're considering racial improvements, other than dragon's. I'm rather jealous of all their Improve This or Improve That quests. Why does 1 race out of 11 get 90% of the work? ( I know they're the signature race of HZ and they are broken, but maybe because it's that they get TOO much). Give some love to the other races.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Domtar Earthson

NIce to see that they're considering racial improvements, other than dragon's. I'm rather jealous of all their Improve This or Improve That quests. Why does 1 race out of 11 get 90% of the work? ( I know they're the signature race of HZ and they are broken, but maybe because it's that they get TOO much). Give some love to the other races.

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Linked over here from the Suggestion forum on Racial quests.

Such an odd remark knowing full well Dragons cannot multiclass, do not have abilities that match Istarian lore, cannot use many unique items (regal weapons, Scarab items, Crimson items, etc.), no finishing Scaleforges in field for ease in craft leveling (nor can they build them), generally carry less than bipeds of equivalent level,need the dragon ability quests to approximate a fully teched (armor, jewelry, weapon) biped, . . . :: sighs ::

Oh, if Half-giant strength increases, Dragon strength must also, per Istarian lore.

Well, back to Suggestions.