The LotRO thread.

[Kulamata]

Again, this is NOT a call to leave Istaria, and I continue to subscribe to Hz.

I was admitted into Lord of the Rings Online beta. After about 8 hours of "testing" it seems congenial in the way Hz is. I'm on Melendor (?) server. Ran into a member of Axe and Anvil today; yup Order's A n A. Small world.

[Chaldor Itieles]

I was in the Beta of LotRO long time myself, but left as VG started.

Quests in LotRO are one of the best i've seen so far. they are all bound togeter in nice storys, and it makes fun to follow the quest line.
negative is for me a) the instance based system which not allows a seamless world. Well its miles better then GW, because not evereything is managed in instances.
b) the crafting system is how far i got into it only a "gimmick". its not really complex, and most times u loot good enough things so u dont need craftedthings.
Good is, that u need to interact with other crafters that support needed ressources, but bad that there is no functional marketing system, so u need to get direkt contact.

[Nosdracir]

Only some quests are instanced. This can actually lead to some problems in non-instanced quests (e.g. Constable Bolger) when there's a queue of groups waiting to start it and someone walks up and grabs it out of order, or when someone wanders into the middle of the quest battle without realizing it's someone else's quest and not just random mobs. A lot of the big mob camps are non-instanced and end up an interesting free-for-all with multiple groups attacking in waves to clear the camp and get a turn at whacking the leaders for their quest goal.

Crafting is definitely nothing like HZ was, but the best crafted items (purple) are better than the best loot at any given level, though they are rare. I hunt undead in the swamps of the Lone Lands just to get the drops that increase my chance of getting a crafting crit when making opal necklaces for my guildies. I also keep careful tabs on the auction house to find bargains for uncommon and rare crafted items that are better than my looted equipment. Also, good loot is always bind on equip (or on acquire if a quest reward), but crafted items generally don't bind.

If you're on Meneldor and see Ingo the Man Captain and his personal herald "Harold Redshirt", wave and yell "Istaria Forever!"

[Varangaard]

The noninstancing of certain quest targets is fortunately alleviated by LotRO's "first dibs" credit system. Which means, the first individual or fellowship (their term for group) to damage a mob will get the kill credit when the mob dies.

An outsider can wander into a middle of a boss fight and kill the mob, even doing the majority of damage, but the kill credit will still go to those who initiated combat. Kill stealing is thus impossible. Continuing to fight someone else's claim rewards you with nothong but some experience (which usually pales in comparison to quest reward exp).

Of course, this creates the opportunity for a ranged party to dominate a field and take all the kill credits until their quest is done.

The biggest problem comes in noninstanced quests where your opponents are spawned for the quest. Fortunately I haven't met too many of these. I can only recall a quest in Ered Luin where you have to save a lynx cub by killing eight or seven hendrovals (predatory birds) that get spawned at quest activation. If some passer-by kills one or more of these, you may be in trouble trying to complete the quest.

edit: Ah, naturally I am on the EU server. If anyone else is there, shout out in this thread.

[Nosdracir]

They've fix the hendrevail (Sindarin interior plural - geek geek geek) quest so that once they spawn, killing any 8 hendrevail will fulfill the quest, even if some oaf like me wanders into the aggro and kills one that attacks him. You can wander down to the dour dwarf city and knock off a few birds for credit, then come back and have the lynx kitten come out of it's den and into your arms.

The LotRO devs are responsive to user complaints/criticism/suggestions. The problem quests are being fixed like this.

[Sibbe]

edit: Ah, naturally I am on the EU server. If anyone else is there, shout out in this thread.

*waves* yeah, me, called gharion over there

[Geryonn]

Kulamata, quick question. I preordered LotR, and recieved a code to register. I'm assuming this is not the same as the beta invite. Is there a specific message they send with the beta invite? Just so I can keep my eye on the emails I get from them in the future. Thanks!
-Geryonn

[Kulamata]

Yes, it is different. I received 3 messages, each with a unique key; one for the stress test (which went amazingly smoothly), one for my preorder, which will allow me into the open beta a week or so before the open beta is fully open, and the third a closed beta invitation.

The process is quite smooth. The usual info to fill in on the reg form, but at the bottom is a bit of genius. Along the lines of "If you've received a key and don't know what to do, fill the key in here, and push the magic carpet button". And it works.

[Frith-Rae]

Chaldor: They now have up Auction house system, so you can easily buy/sell with characters across the land so you don't have to meet face to face. Also have a mail system as well for trading. So it really helps that craft interdependency work .

Chaldor and Nos: I dont know how you can say the system isn't as "complex" or as "good' as Horizons, or how its a "gimmick". Horizons crafting wasn't really complex. I see absolutely NO difference in how the crafting works in Horizons and right now in the beta stress test for LOTR. Both gather materials, go to a machine, click a button, stuff made. Horizons is "more complex" in that maybe you have more items you have to collect - but considering level 6 bronze bars in Horizons and bronze bars in LOTR are pretty much made exactly the same - we can't really compare a Horizons craft item 2 years out to a beta low level craft item.

And its not only purples that are better than quest drops. I was in the stress test, as my first experience playing LOTR and by level 8 I had already crafted me light armor (from the very first basic recpie I get for it) that was better than anyhting i had gotten from a level equivalent quest drop by about 15-20 armor points.

The craft system of LOTR is designed so that you can craft items of comparable and higher quality than regular quest rewards (can't speak for instance/group rewards, I didn't get that far lol), and sell them at the auction house to actually make money off your craft. And its already working that way, since I saw it by level 8 XD!

Its also created to make crafters interdependent on each other, because several craft schools require you to get basic resource items from other people. That is also working as intended at ths point becauwse I coudln't make a sword as a scholar (yes they can make swords), because I couldn't mine and therefore would have needed to buy/trade for the bronze I required.

Now wether you think this is good or bad is your call. I'm not making a judgement call on this one. I hate crafting so hey. Wether they continue to carry through with their statements in this also remains to be seen.

But saying Horizons is more complex just doesn't make sense to me. Saying its a gimmick in LOTR when you can make things better than quest drops and therefore actually has a purpose, when Horizons' crafting is far more of a "gimmick" if you want to think of these things that way - also makes no sense.

Wether you like it or not or wether its "better" is another statement entirely. Which again isn't what I'm saying or not saying .

[C`gan]

Amanjelor the elf on Meneldor.

This is another Wow/EQ clone like Vanguard. Not my cup of tea.

I really do HATE the whole game system that gives little info for too much fluff in quests. The redeeming part of lotro is that you can double click on the ring beside the quest and actually get info that helps you figure out where you're supposed to be going.

For a stress test, you'd think they'd at least put in somewhere obvious to do bug reports as well.

Couldn't even get to the point of figuring out how to pick up a craft class. At least I did that in Vanguard.

[Deth]

Bug reports are easy. I figured that out with no problem. It is /bug.

As to a craft trainer. I think if I remeber right the Human/Hobbit side sends you to the craft trainer as a quest if you just get all the quest that are availbe or it may be down the main line. The Elf/Dwarf side is not as complete quest wise quite yet and do not think that side will send you to a craft trainer.

[Fyrentennimara]

I was accepted into LOtRO beta also. I played it for 46 minutes and shut it off. I can't stand it. I think I'm just expecting it to live up to the community of Hz with the playablilty of WoW and that's just not going to happen. I also wouldn't give VG a shot if I were paid. I've seen many, many reviews on that one and could never give it a fair shot. I don't think Warhammer will do it either.

[Kulamata]

No, I don't think we'll see a full replacement for Hz. Hz was too far ahead of the pack, and the imagination was too free for us to see anything better.

As for the LotRO community, there were a lot of complaints on the forums; it seems that the open (Free!) stress test pulled in a lot of the Blizzkid types. Otherwise the community on Meneldor seems fine. As for the playability of WoW? So far to me, it seems the equal at least. Some of the quest lines are much more sophisticated than any I ran across in Wow (bearing in mind I only got to 28 or so in WoW. )

I would not say that it's similar to VG; for me a very different "feel" to the two games. VG I find dull, grindy, monotonous. Not at all the case with LotRO. I've come to feel that it's not worth my while to focus on independent characteristics of a game, but to take it as a whole to see if I enjoy it.

[Thamoris]

I was accepted into LOtRO beta also. I played it for 46 minutes and shut it off. I can't stand it. I think I'm just expecting it to live up to the community of Hz with the playablilty of WoW and that's just not going to happen. I also wouldn't give VG a shot if I were paid. I've seen many, many reviews on that one and could never give it a fair shot. I don't think Warhammer will do it either.

Have you seen my review on Vanguard here in the forums? Don't believe the crap you read on the more common forums. Most of those are dominated by WoW players that go out of their way to bash Vanguard. The other half are jadded gamers expecting to relive their Eq1 days..literly.
It really is a good game. It has everything Horizons has and more...cept Dragon characters. It's starting to clean up really nice too. Vanguard is simply too hard for folks raised on console games and WoW. Most of your Eq and Uo vets love the game ...though some impatient with the bugs. Horizonz vets are perfect for Vanguard ...the bugs are nothing compared to what yall deal with daily here and it's easier to play than Horizons is. Just alot harder than WoW. MY 7 year old can max level in WoW.

Though...their is a period for some...if deeply involved in a game ..where they won't like any other game than the one they are emotionaly attached too. I reccomend to just start off slow...play a little here and a little there with without many expectations. Let whatever new game you decide to play ...gently pull you in. Don't force the issue and try not to compare it to Horizons. Take it for what it is at face value and concentrate on doing what you enjoy the most.

Most importantly..have fun. That is the bottom line...no matter what game we play. Just be willing to endure a week or two where you might actualy hate your next game ..then one day..wake up..log in..and go " omg..this is so awesome !" ..I had no idea...I know this because it all happened to me.just like that.

[Thamoris]

No, I don't think we'll see a full replacement for Hz. Hz was too far ahead of the pack, and the imagination was too free for us to see anything better.

As for the LotRO community, there were a lot of complaints on the forums; it seems that the open (Free!) stress test pulled in a lot of the Blizzkid types. Otherwise the community on Meneldor seems fine. As for the playability of WoW? So far to me, it seems the equal at least. Some of the quest lines are much more sophisticated than any I ran across in Wow (bearing in mind I only got to 28 or so in WoW. )

I would not say that it's similar to VG; for me a very different "feel" to the two games. VG I find dull, grindy, monotonous. Not at all the case with LotRO. I've come to feel that it's not worth my while to focus on independent characteristics of a game, but to take it as a whole to see if I enjoy it.

Vanguard a grind? lol..Horizons was the King Grind of grinds..How can you find Vanguard a grind?...See..a game..any game...is what you make it. You make it a grind..it will be a grind. Given the fact there are tons and tons of quests and 4 completly different avenues to level your character....there is not grind unless you make one. ( Adventure, craft, diplomacy, harvesting )

I agree with you take on Horizons though. It really was way ahead of it's time and will truely go down as the greatest shame ( lost potential ) in mmorpg history. Much like the Subaru Brat car back in its day...if yall can remember that car. It bombed...people just were not ready for a4x4 car/truck combo thing. American Eagle is another example. Now 15 years later...people are buying 4x4 suv car types left and right. Horizons could have been..should have been...the ultimate sand box game. I gave it 3 years of my life..don't regret it either...BUT...Vanguard is the next best thing imo. It's everything Horizons is cept the muli-classing and dragons....which no game has.

[Kwinn]

I've heard that Hz players going to Vanguard like because it reminds em of Hz a lot, excluding multiclassing and dragons. That right there is a good enough reason to keep me out. I need a break from Hz.

LoTR...sure it has elements that remind me many other games. Granted my only experience in LoTR to date is the Stress Test and sure enough... I bumped into Kulamata . No dragons cluttering up the landscape, none of those beastly holes they call home, no plethera of races, no multiclassing, no mindlessly repetitive quests, no mind numbing con/decon tools to lvl a crafter or kill 40 billion bugs to lvl an adventurer, surprisingly tolerable lag considering it WAS a stress test, all these reasons are plenty to send me packing my bags in Hz. But there is more, a much smoother log in/log out process, a good community... bumped into Tant and Mystif too, excellent quests/storyline, nowhere near the lag, excellent scenery with a lot attention to detail, combat that takes into account basic tactics such as flanking and defilade, crafting that actually makes sense. Yeah I said it, crafting that makes sense. Hz's doesn't, not even close. For example, ya need a sword. Well, if the crafter doesn't have any iron he goes and mines it. That is ridiculous..."Scuse me I gotta go mine some iron, smelt the ore, then I can make yer sword" yeah right! That is 3 separate occupations. LoTR has a school to gathers and processes resources. That crafter then sells the resource to another crafter who actually crafts the item. Now that is a craft system that makes sense.

No Dragons, finally another decent MMO to play and as a bonus, no dragons. I always had a problem with dragons being pals and not prey. Not that I haven't met some damned fine dragon players, because I have. But the majority have their heads in the clouds, or maybe somewhat further south...take yer pick. Well, in LoTR they're on the prey list.

Multiclassing, sure I'm MC'd all to buggery and back again. The system is there and I milked it for all it was worth. Good thing too. As the state of the game currently stands ya damned well better be MC'd to the hilt if ya wanna do anything. But in retrospect I can see the fault in MC. It is human nature to want to achieve, to strive for the upper limits. Hz gave that nature a helluva challenge and many of us took that bull by the horns and rode it to glory. Sadly, in the end it was self-defeating. I'm out of paths to tread. Nothing really left for me in Hz except some small entertainemnt value. I found LoTR refreshing, it revitalized my interest in MMOs and I find it far more entertaining than Hz.

So, in the very forseeable future I will sheath my sword, shoulder my pack and shield and make that long journey to Middle Earth...

[Fyrentennimara]

I'm not seen any reviews of VG from this forum, no. I don't really come here much anymore. Only when I have the wild hair to see if EI/PM....S(??) has done anything with my beloved Hz.

My previous comment about LotRO was my impressions from Beta 1, which sucked considerably. But my husband is now in Beta 2 and I just got my key this morning for Beta 2. From what I've seen things have changed for the better and I will be giving it another shot to suck me in. I canceled my WoW account on Monday(reasons why are discussions for another day, but they are numerous)as did my husband. He's pre- Ordered LotRO and I will be testing to see if I will be also.

As for VG, I might just give it a shot too sometime, depends on if LotRO sucks me in or not. I'm signed up for Warhammer beta and Age of Conan too, I guess we'll see.



Oh! Btw, Kwinn, we Lunus always wished you were food too.*wink*

[Roguar]

So, Kwinn in a fast reply how are the communities in LOTR? I'm slowly comming to the concluesion that it is time to move *Not yet Scions Not Yet* so im starting to look left and right for a new world to call home. If anyone else has an MMO that the community is about the same as HZ please let an old dwarf know

[Kulamata]

Hard to say about the community based on just Beta; so far pretty good. I've fallen in with ex-Horizons players, who've formed a more relaxed branch of Axe and Anvil.

The general "feel" of the game is more like Hz than anything else I've run across. I played VGSoH in beta, and for a bit after release until my closed beta invite came through from LotRO. I know some Hz players there, including guildmates, but I found it a harsher sort of game, and without much charm or wit. YMMV; some like it a lot. I just always seemed to be on a different page. LotRO seems to me to be a better fit for casual gamers, and for families to play on with their children, especially in the Shire. So far, it does not seem to be the sort of game that attracts the hard case hard core or the Blizzkids. If you look at feature lists, it's hard to tell. I think you actually have to play, or get a review from someone with similar tastes to actually tell much. It's the details, and how they that defines fun and atmosphere. (Since none of them have playable dragons.)

[Fyrentennimara]

Roguar, check your PMs.


And I agree with Kulamata.