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Thread: Looking for Lair Advice

  1. #1

    Default Looking for Lair Advice

    I have read lots of lair threads and looked at some pics and I'm ... confused

    I've seen more than one dragon say that it's best to make floors have multi-access routes, so you could theoretically rearrange one floor without deconning the whole lair. Having done and redone (and redone) my lair several times, I'd love to set up something like this.

    I have a 5x5x6 lair on Blight. Can someone give me some advice on how to set up this multi-access? Is it something as simple as having a series of spirals that connect all the way to the bottom, with an access opening for each floor?

    Has someone got a similar sized lair that they have done this in that I could look at? I've played around with graph paper and the Excel spreadsheet in other threads and I just can't get a layout that works for me
    Barrak Stonebreaker - dwarf Knight of Creation
    Cerul - dragon hatchling
    Blight Server

  2. #2

    Default Re: Looking for Lair Advice

    The lair in the crafting calculator does this. You just put a series of corridors that go to multiple entrances so everything stays connected.

  3. #3

    Default Re: Looking for Lair Advice

    The crafting calculator has a lair in it? Hmmm...

    *runs off to update*
    Barrak Stonebreaker - dwarf Knight of Creation
    Cerul - dragon hatchling
    Blight Server

  4. #4

    Default Re: Looking for Lair Advice

    Hmmm looks like it dosen't (there's a file around here called Lair pieces and calc 2007).. lemmie see if I can find that lair I saw that had tons of corridors in it. Looked just like the one in the calulator though but I can't for the life of me remeber who's it was.

    Bah. Can't find it. Basically, you can go about it a number of ways:

    1. Use many spirals to make multiple pathways to the same place. That way when you find something you like and you don't need to decon any more, you can put silos in thier place.

    2. Have a path going up the middle, putting all your structures to the outside so you can decon.

    3. Have the path running the perimeter of your lair, so you can switch stuff around.

    A 5x5 is a difficult size if you're building with the intention to move stuff around IMHO as lair pieces are either 3x2 or 2x2. Maybe have the enitre left/right side be corridors to leave the entire inside movable? I've never had a lair of that size -seems ungainly to me.

  5. #5

    Default Re: Looking for Lair Advice

    That's pretty much what you need to do Barrak, what I did with my lair at first (no where finished mind you) is start with a three way at the entrance then made corridors out to either end, after that I put in 2 spirals and build corridors/rooms connecting the two spirals all the way down.

    You can also create "secret" levels with this method, by building a series of 2 seperate spirals down how ever many levels you want then connecting them on the bottom and building the upper areas connected to only one spiral. Once you're done delete the connections on the first floor to that spiral and now you have to go down to get back up!

  6. #6

    Default Re: Looking for Lair Advice

    Quote Originally Posted by Tcei View Post
    You can also create "secret" levels with this method, by building a series of 2 seperate spirals down how ever many levels you want then connecting them on the bottom and building the upper areas connected to only one spiral. Once you're done delete the connections on the first floor to that spiral and now you have to go down to get back up!
    Err... or when building you can hit rotate on a spiral and the bottom will move up. My first lair I had a few chambers you had to go up to get to, but as it was a 3x6, I really didn't have the luxury of building around anything.

  7. #7

    Default Re: Looking for Lair Advice

    Quote Originally Posted by Shian View Post

    A 5x5 is a difficult size if you're building with the intention to move stuff around IMHO as lair pieces are either 3x2 or 2x2. Maybe have the enitre left/right side be corridors to leave the entire inside movable? I've never had a lair of that size -seems ungainly to me.
    Are you saying a 6x4x6 would be better? Seems like from a layout-wise, 5x5 gives you more options.

    *edit* typo
    Last edited by Barrak; June 25th, 2008 at 05:43 PM.
    Barrak Stonebreaker - dwarf Knight of Creation
    Cerul - dragon hatchling
    Blight Server

  8. #8

    Default Re: Looking for Lair Advice

    Quote Originally Posted by Shian View Post
    A 5x5 is a difficult size if you're building with the intention to move stuff around IMHO as lair pieces are either 3x2 or 2x2. Maybe have the enitre left/right side be corridors to leave the entire inside movable? I've never had a lair of that size -seems ungainly to me.
    I love 5x5 lairs. They work perfectly fine for me.

    I can't help much with your issue, Barrak, but might I suggest that you use something that will let you see your layout outside of the game, such as an excel spreadsheet with your lair layout on it? Dunno if you are doing that already or not... but it really help see how everything will end up fitting together far better than the game every could. Maybe that way you could avoid the trouble of having to re-arrange rooms in the first place... though I don't know why you're doign that, so it might not help. XD

    Planning my lair out saved me a ton of trouble; I've been able to make a layout that uses no spirals, has an average of 3 corridors per level, and one of every t5 machine set up in such a way that I can upgrade them, one at a time, to t6. I never could have done that in-game.
    <----clicky!

  9. #9
    Member C`gan's Avatar
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    Default Re: Looking for Lair Advice

    The original Excel file referred to here was posted by Tympest. I made some minor modifications to it and Tagath added some calculators to it. If you look under Tympest's thread, stickied in the main Dragon forum, you'll find the file.
    C`gan Weyrsinger, blue Tagath's rider, WorldProjects Team Lead Emeritus
    Tagath, blue Lunus "for the breath weapon"
    Located in sunny Acul on Trandalar, Order shard

  10. #10

    Default Re: Looking for Lair Advice

    Quote Originally Posted by Favoran View Post
    I suggest that you use something that will let you see your layout outside of the game, such as an excel spreadsheet with your lair layout on it? Dunno if you are doing that already or not... but it really help see how everything will end up fitting together far better than the game every could. Maybe that way you could avoid the trouble of having to re-arrange rooms in the first place... though I don't know why you're doign that, so it might not help.
    A layout would help. Or maybe a list of what you want in your lair? Everyone has a different lair and what one person likes, another may not so to you at least have one started?

    Planning is essential. It took me an hour of planning to figure out how to get all the libraries together in one spot without any corridors. There's no way I would have been able to do it if I had not worked with it a number of different ways. Maybe that's why you need to rebuild so much?

  11. #11

    Default Re: Looking for Lair Advice

    Ok, I found the spreadsheet and it's great

    I also sold the 5x5 lair and got a 4x6 instead, but I lucked out and can use the entire top level, where the other one was about half unusable. So it's actually got more usable sq. footage than the 5x5 I had before.

    Thanks for the advice everyone
    Barrak Stonebreaker - dwarf Knight of Creation
    Cerul - dragon hatchling
    Blight Server

  12. #12

    Default Re: Looking for Lair Advice

    Oh, and reading over some of the replies, it seems like I am wanting to rebuild all the time. That's not the case. But I wanted the lair to be flexible enough that if lair chambers or transmutation chambers get added in the future, I could maybe put one in without redoing all 7 levels
    Barrak Stonebreaker - dwarf Knight of Creation
    Cerul - dragon hatchling
    Blight Server

  13. #13
    Member C`gan's Avatar
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    Default Re: Looking for Lair Advice

    If you look at the different rooms in the spreadsheet, you'll immediately notice some very important details.

    First off, size can and does change per tier. The higher the tier, the larger the chamber may take up.

    Secondly, the connection points change per tier.

    So, it's not as feasible to upgrade a lair once built as it is to upgrade on a plot, where tiered crafthalls and silos have the same footprint, for example.
    C`gan Weyrsinger, blue Tagath's rider, WorldProjects Team Lead Emeritus
    Tagath, blue Lunus "for the breath weapon"
    Located in sunny Acul on Trandalar, Order shard

  14. #14

    Default Re: Looking for Lair Advice

    Quote Originally Posted by Barrak View Post
    Ok, I found the spreadsheet and it's great

    I also sold the 5x5 lair and got a 4x6 instead, but I lucked out and can use the entire top level, where the other one was about half unusable. So it's actually got more usable sq. footage than the 5x5 I had before.

    Thanks for the advice everyone

    Oooooh lucky. Where is this 4x6? I've only seen one other in the game and it's a guild lair.

  15. #15

    Default Re: Looking for Lair Advice

    It's in Dralk, in the area under the floating island. Great location and great size
    Barrak Stonebreaker - dwarf Knight of Creation
    Cerul - dragon hatchling
    Blight Server

  16. #16

    Default Re: Looking for Lair Advice

    Wow! I never imagined one that close to one of the dragon cities would be open/owners willing to sell.

  17. #17

    Default Re: Looking for Lair Advice

    This is on Blight - lots of lairs open
    Barrak Stonebreaker - dwarf Knight of Creation
    Cerul - dragon hatchling
    Blight Server

  18. #18

    Default Re: Looking for Lair Advice

    Best thing is to use t5, or even better, t6 chambers, to work your way down. They are two levels deep, and have lots of exit points. Becomes quite easy then to make alternate routes downwards. I use this layout: T6 Lair by the entrance, then all t6 craft chambers with storages and alternate corridors all converging into a t6 Hall at the bottom. Then I add stuff in whatever nook and corner available.

  19. #19

    Default Re: Looking for Lair Advice

    Problem is, this is a new character - so anything above T2 is out of the question right off the bat

    I'm trying to design it so that there's a few T2/T3 chambers in the first few levels, along with some T4s, then higher tier lower down.

    Or would it be better to just build something, decon it, build it again, etc. to grind up levels?

    The suggestion about using T5/T6 chambers for multi-floor access is a good one - on Blight, right next to the shrine in Chiconis, someone built a lair with all T6 machines in it, along with some public storage. This thing lays out so nice and moving around in it, it feels like a lair, not hallways/rooms stuck together Thanks to whoever built this, it's very handy for us low level crafters

    I'm hoping to emulate a similar feeling in my lair.
    Barrak Stonebreaker - dwarf Knight of Creation
    Cerul - dragon hatchling
    Blight Server

  20. #20

    Default Re: Looking for Lair Advice

    Quote Originally Posted by Barrak View Post
    Or would it be better to just build something, decon it, build it again, etc. to grind up levels?.
    This is where I would say there is always people willing to pay coin for low level lairwork, but not too sure about a non-live shard. On the other hand, constructing/decon gets you lair parts. If you are patient, I would suggest grinding a few levels first. Once you pick what's in your first few entry ways it's stuck there unless you want to decon the whole lair!

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