Istaria.... The Ghost Towns

[Justa Mirage]

You know something will be mentioned in the next Herald report

Boy.... Istaria is a ghost town now... I bet they didn't realize that 80% of their plot system were under the 1600 sq. m. size.

Went to Morning Light, entire town gone. Dalimond, gone. My own community I live in, gone.

They found out the hard way that all the existing elder players already own the plot they want, and have an Alt account whose sole purpose is to buy and raze property when the time comes.

So in effect they just rewarded those that could be home that day, to free buildings, structures, novians, all in the name of cleansing so they can resize plots.

It's a shame too but I guess a necessary evil.

I had reports from a few players how they stood in Bristugo, commenting on the huge amount of traffic the game had with players that they had never seen before discussing which communities had already been "downsized"

What really gnaws at me, even though you KNEW this would happen, are those poor new players who don't have a huge cash income, don't have an organized guild, and would benefit from a few of these "pre build small plots with buildings" getting mowed over by organized guilds and players with "Greed" written all over it. Who can be the first players / guilds to get to the community first and totally wipe it before some other player guild does.

I would not be surprised if players made entire community maps of what was for sale, what structures were on them, and "plans of attack"

How do I know this is true? My own neighborhood...

next to me, a plot with a tier 2 consigner and pawnbroker, gone. Another plot with a large human house, gone.
BUT!!!
The plot with christmas trees, pumpkins, skeletons and graves, and a few snowmen... STILL THERE!!!

So it only proves that "cleansing" goes only so far as to "what the greed of the community wants" and it won't reduce community lag. Plots with planned structures and scaffolding with no novians in them, will still be there, along with festival structures

And now comes the big question.... after all of this is done, will the communities that are now ghost towns get the plots resized.

[Takora Drakan]

Well it had to be done. It saved the devs time to go to every plot and press the nuke button to remove the strucutures. The players can get at least the novians, and novians can be easy replaced.

And now the devs can make bigger plots an noone has to buy a 25x25 tiny plot.

It seems people have always to complain, to many tiny plots, they are not happy, the devs make bigger plots, also not happy. Get my point?

[Deth]

How is it greed to exactly what they wanted done? They wanted the plots cleared so they could more easily know which ones the community did not want. No all those smaller plots can be removed and replaced by bigger plots that in the long run mean more subs for the game. I do not see it as greed going out and make use of resources that are made available. The only thing different I could have seen done was maybe releasing the plots in waves but other then that that's only thing different I would see done differently. In the end all that is happening are the resources are moving from one plot to another with some loss. Other wise it not like the people that brought them can go and sale them. Hopefully this will mean more buildings will pop up in better areas that they could be put to better use.

Also I do not think The game is a ghost town because all these plots that the owner ahs left just becuase the buildings are gone, it's a ghost town becuase the players are gone. Hopefuly with these new bigger plots more people that did not have a plot will now get a plot in more tighter communitie. Yes some places may remain empty but that levels them open for when new groups move in. It will leave them places to buy and make their own. But will just have to wait and see I guess.

[Barrak]

I didn't even know this was active now... was there announcement about it? I know they were planning on starting the reclaims yesterday, but I never saw anything in-game (at least on Blight) or here. Maybe I missed it...

[Zexoin]

It seems people have always to complain, to many tiny plots, they are not happy, the devs make bigger plots, also not happy. Get my point?

When snowfall or Wolf's paw or Kerrrl's lair in Genevia or any other key plot will be gone you'll be the first to cry.
They already removed the Brist connie. A kind person decided to rebuild it. They removed the Jman (or expert ?) woodworking shop in Harton valley. I don't think this one is going to be rebuilt, even though it was used by _many_ people on the shard.
Get my point ?

[Justa Mirage]

Zexoin keyed in on the big part of my rant I forgot to add...

I understand Deth your position and it is mine too, Istaria needs to be cleaned up, resized and reopened under new management.

A lot of plots were small but used by the community for the buildings they contained by dead accounts.

Boon: Istaria is clean from dead accounts and structures

Bust: Many useful structures to crafters and adventurers lost until resizing and new ownership decides to rebuild useful structures.

Short Term: a pain for Crafters / Adventurers having to pay portal fees to get to machines they need to use (or vaultkeepers)

Long Term: Bigger plots with possibly higher tier structures on them, and business as usual.

[Takora Drakan]

When snowfall or Wolf's paw or Kerrrl's lair in Genevia or any other key plot will be gone you'll be the first to cry.

I rarley used such "key" plots so I won't cry about them. On Unity there where even less shops around and I also got around. So don't tell me please about what I will cry.

And it's not the first time such reclamations happen, other people will rebuild them or not, you have to live with that.

[Nisse]

I don't think this one is going to be rebuilt, even though it was used by _many_ people on the shard.
Get my point ?

As I've said before elsewhere, our community's got a wonderful spirit. We can come together and help rebuild the lost shops. With (I don't know this for sure) many people high in craft than when these were first built, we could even attempt bigger and better things--together.

[Zexoin]

I rarley used such "key" plots so I won't cry about them. On Unity there where even less shops around and I also got around. So don't tell me please about what I will cry.

And it's not the first time such reclamations happen, other people will rebuild them or not, you have to live with that.

Oh yes, I forgot that our all-mighty shard herald can decide what is usefull to the community or not.
(OMG harrasment ban ban ban !)

As I've said before elsewhere, our community's got a wonderful spirit. We can come together and help rebuild the lost shops. With (I don't know this for sure) many people high in craft than when these were first built, we could even attempt bigger and better things--together.

Well, Nisse, I must say that I've been kinda disappointed by our community in the past few month. Maybe that's why I'm being so bitter about this. If its spirit were so wonderful, the key plots wouldn't have been touched. That's my opinion though, but with the low population of the shard I don't think that some of them will be rebuilt, only if the plot communities become much more attractive than they are now. It might be the case once plots are resized, but I doubt it, except if the devs put 75x75 or higher, which is not likely to happen.

[Nisse]

I was speaking from the memories I've had of the past. If our community's that bad these days, then I'm sorry.

[Takora Drakan]

Oh yes, I forgot that our all-mighty shard herald can decide what is usefull to the community or not.
(OMG harrasment ban ban ban !)

I wonder what my statement has to do with me being Shard Herald Zexion? And where have I decided please what is useful to the community? I hope you can explain me that.

[Deth]

Nothing against you personally Zexoin but it is post like this that have been turning me off to the community lately.

Oh yes, I forgot that our all-mighty shard herald can decide what is usefull to the community or not.
(OMG harrasment ban ban ban !)

We are almost like a group of people that have spent to much of the winter trapped together in a cabin and cabin fever has set in. I know before EI/PMI/OH what ever you want to call your self I never saw all the harsh talk and such others talked about. Ever since they took over and left I have started seeing a lot more of the dark underside of the community. I sometimes wonder if that has not kille dmy desire to log in.

[LOVWYRM]

my dear Lady friends, PLEASE!!!

The manner you both discuss this serious and kinda sad subject,
is as useful as a fishbone in the throat.


I go with Justa concerning this topic

[Raptress]

As bad as it seems that someone would raze a previously useful plot for novians, wouldn't that plot have just been cleared prior to reclaims anyway? We all knew plot reclaims were getting reinstated and are necessary so there are still free plots available (Does Chaos even have a single free lair?). Yes, they will need to be rebuilt, but these plots will likely be resized as well and could easily be more useful than before once completed again. As for rebuilding, I know I personally would be happy to help build up a useful plot for use by the community. I would treat it as a community project, not just helping someone build their own plot.

Why can't this be an opportunity for community building instead of being angry at people for taking novians?

[Smaug]

My understanding of how reclaimation was to work was, any plot with structures on them would remain. So you would of hoped someone with not alot of money could of bought the small plot with a house and maybe a shop on it and kept the shop open.

Thats not gonna happen now.

Smaug

[Justa Mirage]

Raptress, perhaps it is just a timing issue... Virtrium hopefully won't sit idle after this and make good on the promise to make plots / lairs available for auction on the 25th as planned.

Some spots where players were dependent on these machines but now have lost the access to them, will have to wait until:

Auctions are established

Someone buys the plot

That someone is "willing" to restore the useful machine... because... it is their plot and they can do anything they want with it.

I am in the hopes that (like before) plot and lair owners will survey their surroundings and possibly erect buildings that will help not only them, but the community in general and possibly ask us to contribute to help rebuild the lost machines.

[Terao]

Out of the Email from VI: On July 22, 2008,
any small plots not owned by an active account will be condemned and either
resized or removed from the world.

As much as may got lost for now, the novians may help rebuilding the one or other helpful place around, the other way everything would have been lost - and I don't think that so many tiny plots would have find a new owner before the auctions.

Our small three members guild plans to aquire three plots, we need 75 x 75 as bare minimum each and we'll place a vault and a complete set of jman shops on them, but we need that size and they need to be near each other - if it's a community or in the wilderness is not the problem. I think others will do the same. Wait for the auctions and what will be build afterwards - then cry for the lost things or hopefully be happy with the new things to come.

[Raptress]

I honestly couldn't remember if the structures were supposed to remain or not. If it is true that reclaimed plots retain their structures, then I will say that I agree razing useful plots is despicable behavior. But it probably happened in the past and will probably continue to happen anytime there are reclaims. However, if these plots were to be razed anyway, as Terao's Vi email snippet seems to say, then I would rather someone have the novians than the plot be cleared anyway.

However, I do stand by the sentiment that it's no use getting up in arms about it. What's done is done. I would suggest that someone makes a list of the plots that are considered "key" and keeps track of whether they are owned, whether that owner is a nice enough person to let it remain a 'community' sort of plot, and the progress on them if so. That way, if someone is looking for a plot and likes to help out the community, someone can tell them what plots/structures are really needed.

[Terao]

Out of the Plot Resizing FAQ:
If plots are resized will they keep the original buildings?
- Answer: If a plot is simply resized, then yes it will keep the original buildings. In order to resize a plot, the new area must fully contain the old area. This is why it is so difficult in many communities to resize plots.
Will some plots be deleted to allow for larger plots? What happens to the buildings/items on plots that are deleted?
- Answer: If a plot is removed from the world then any structures on it will also be deleted. In this case, no novians for those structures will be given, and items stored on the plot will also be lost.
What Happens After Auctions?

If a plot placed for auction is not purchased, The Land and Title Office has a few choices to make. They may place the plot up for immediate sale with the original structures, clear the plot of all structures and place it up for immediate sale, or condemn the plot.

Plots that are condemned are subcontracted to the Gnomish Construction Guild to have all structures removed (they are actually shrunk for use by gnomish children in their play rooms), and the The Land and Title Office will de-zone the plot (remove it from the world). In some cases, a new (and larger) plot may be zoned in the previous area and placed on the market for sale.

Sounds for me that quiet some plots will be deleted, or for easier rezising will be cleaned from structures, the one or other way would have killed a lot of those plots, too.

[Frith-Rae]

exactly..

If noone had grabbed the novians for those unowned plots, then those buildings just would have been evaporated into nonexistance - and you'd be at the same point you are now.

Now, I'm not happy about novian farming as a rule - but yet at the same time much of me goes "why do I care?? It doesnt' effect me nor the new person buying the empty plot - why does it matter??"

And IF (though it doesn't look like it to me) those unowned plots "kept" their shops and such, if noone touched them, and then they got bought - the tone in these posts sounds as if the new owner didnt' decide to keep the "helpful" buildings - instead decided to take the novians and build what THEY wanted - you guys would then call them out for "Ruining a good community plot" that..well..wasn't really for everyone else.

Don't get me wrong - I LOVE plot buildings who build not only for what they want but what is helpful for the area, and what it needs.

But at the same time, we don't want to turn that into some type of "community entitlement" to what's on the plot - owned and decided upon - by the individual.

What I'd suggest is wait till the process is over - find out who buys whatever plot in whatever community that use to have something that is now missing - and talk with the new plot owner. Offer to help them build whatever structure the community could really use - for free - even if its just a small tier I or whatever.

But It doesnt' sound like those free community use buildings (basically what they were up until a day or so ago) were going to be remaining after plot reclamation anyway, so...there's no real loss here.