Storm Disciple Quests for Delta 158

[StalePopcorn]

Hi folks,

As mentioned in the delta 158 post, I'm interested to know what people think about the idea behind the new Storm Disciple quests, and whether people prefer a continous theme for quests (i.e. 5 different quests available at different levels i.e. 10, 20, 30, 40, but with a central theme continued with each quest) or whether they prefer each quest to be a completely separate mini-story all it's own.

Or (c) "any quest is a good quest"

Regards,

Stale.

[Teto Frum]

In this quest starved realm of endless grinding, I pick c.

[Hraefn]

Teto's answer is pretty good. xD

Other than that though, I always love stories and the more the better in my opinion. Of course, really good ones are always nice when they're drawn out a little more...

How about [d]? A little of all of the above?

[Sigi]

a + b
ok, I know it is asking too much ...
but one storyline for all quests which each have their own little sub quests and stories sounds good doesn't it

[GalemThawn]

C is actually not good. Simple 'Go Kill' quests are not good quests.

I haven't seen the Storm Disciple quests (I've never done any of the monk schools and so have no skill).

It's good to have quests that are completely separate from other stories, and quests that continue the same storyline through progressive character levels.

My favorite would be quests that have continuations.

[Deth]

Yes from being a dragon and having all kill X of X does not really count as a quest. SO I would say do it right the first time and have it have some story. Be in a mini story or an over arking story. Even if it is just here is the task every monk before you has needed to do.... Kind of story that is fine.

[Teto Frum]

Well I dont count those kill 50 of anything actual quests, they are just grinding with direction. I'm talking actual quests that have a couple parts to them, and send you multiple locations. Those are quests , these kill X for days are not what id even consider quests.

[AmonGwareth]

Neither do we and that is why we don't add them much. When there are "kill X" its in context with something else. For the record, some of the storm disciple quests do have you killing stuff, but there is more than "Hey, go kill X just because". And they build up in size and scope as the storm disciple gains in levels.

[Velea]

Well I dont count those kill 50 of anything actual quests, they are just grinding with direction. I'm talking actual quests that have a couple parts to them, and send you multiple locations. Those are quests , these kill X for days are not what id even consider quests.

Every quest in any game everywhere breaks down to a simple "Go do something" at it's most basic level. While I agree that the Kill Tasks are very basic in nature, and do not have storyline behind them usually, they are still quests. They still required someone time to write, still required someone time to set up the spawns, and still required someone time to ensure they were balanced. A quest is, at it's most basic level, a means of introducing content to players, whether that content is storyline or just a means of guiding players to where is appropriate for them.

The are not what we're trying to create more of as quests, of course, because the game has enough of them to satisfy that.

You don't have to count them if you don't want to, but they still count, in other words.

[LaughingOtter]

"Quest" is an industry term for any task players complete in order to earn a reward. I personally don't like that usage, because it sees no difference between a single-step "Kill X of Y" and a 90-step epic with storyline and multiple interactions & choices.

While single-step quests are usually disappointing or boring, they don't have to be that way. Chaining a series of them together with a coherent story and an involving plot can produce a wonderful game experience. The Burning Archer quest was done this way. It also makes it a lot easier to troubleshoot quest issues - you only have to restart this one section, not the whole thing.

Even WoW has started recognizing that players want storyline and meaning in their quests. The Wrath of the Lich King expansion's primary story line, for example, takes players through the events that took Arthas Menethil from a noble prince and paladin to a despicable champion of evil. One of the most powerful sections of the story, the culling of Stratholme, recreates Arthas's decision to slaughter an entire city rather than try to cure the plague ravaging the people living there. Players have literally been in tears playing through it - yet, when you look at the requirements for completion, it's a "kill X of Y" with an escort step.

I wouldn't say that 'any quest is a good quest', but I would agree that 'more good quests of any kind will always be good'.

[Drevar]

I would like to see more single arc quests that span multiple level ranges. IE start at 20, next part at 40, 60, 80, and 100, or whatever stepping is used.

Use some of the already available tech to spice up the rewards, like the equipment set tech. At 20 the reward is a storm disciples bracelet, at 40 a necklace, 60 a ring with set bonuses. At 80 you trade in the bracelet for a newer upgraded one, and at 100 trade in the old necklace. Something besides the puny xp and next to useless coin that accompanies most current quests.

Off topic from the Storm Disciple quests, but I would also like to see more upgradeable quest reward gear in general, whether crafted or just given. I would love to be able to take something like the old regal weapons and upgrade them to level 80 stats through a quest. New items, of course wouldn't be based on retired items.

Drev

[Teto Frum]

I'm not complaining about having to kill stuff, and am more than happy when a quest asks me to go kill something in reasonably numbers with(like Amon stated) a purpose. But for the life of me i can't understand how anyone could be a dragon with all those mind numbing kill 50 of x quests, one after a another all game long.

Of course ive also never met a dragon who enjoyed those quests either so they actually sound like quests designed to remove fun from game for players. Think a quest is what you will Velea, it may be too expose content from a developer standpoint as you stated, but i think i speak for most players, we look to quests to create fun.

[StalePopcorn]

OK if I can summarise then:

1. Storylines are an important part of quests, and provide more interest than "kill x of y"
2. Quests, as in most/all games, are limited in the feedback/triggers they can provide - listed here for people who want to know what they are. This is important, because anything outside this would be a major change to the game engine/client, which is BIG, and probably wouldn't be done.
3. In general, items are not available as quest rewards because the Istaria focus is on player-created material. There *may* be some items created in special circumstances (I've submitted some, but it's up to the VI team to decide whether or not to include them - if they appear in-game, you'll know what I mean but there are already "special" in-game stuff, like Crimson Scourge jewelry and Epic Weapons, etc.

The quests I've written so far have tried to strike a balance between telling a short story and sending the player on different tasks, within the limits of the quest engine. I've submitted quite a few so far (last count from December 08, about 40 I think including sub-quests) but these follow central themes. Poor Amon "The QuestMaster" has me on his junk mail list probably, with all the stuff I have been sending him, plus I also stalk him online when he's tired from work bwaaaahahahahaha However, it's up to VI whether these are suitable or not for inclusion in-game.

Drevar - this is pretty much exactly the sort of quests I've been trying to submit, funnily enough - I wanted to give players something to look forward to, beyond getting new abilities when they hit 20/40/60 etc. Hopefully the quests are enjoyable and will be worth doing, but that's for the audience to decide

BTW *very* happy with the posts on this topic, fantastic feedback for a quest-writing-newbie like myself to feel the quest-pulse of Istaria

[LaughingOtter]

Of course ive also never met a dragon who enjoyed those quests either so they actually sound like quests designed to remove fun from game for players.

Teto, nobody ever does something to remove fun from the game. Doing so intentionally would be monumentally foolish. Decisions may have that effect, but it is an effect, not a cause or a driver for change.

The dragon quests were done the way they were because the team was up against a launch deadline and they didn't have time to write good, complex, involved storyline quests. They needed 100 or so tasks, and needed them yesterday. Bad quests are a lot better than no quests, though, and so we have what we have. Why do you think we started revamping them?

[Teto Frum]

Well, what makes a bad quest, it being bad fun i'd say. So knowingly putting bad quests in would be knowingly taking fun out of game, regardless of reasons, justified or not.

I know you guys are working on quests and am glad for it, i don't want to come off anti VI, i'm not. I know VI inherited Istarias problems, most still stem from launch problems, and ownership changes. We are all clearly in agreement those quests and their type aren't fun. Your not making more and are cleaning up old ones, theres really nothing were disagreeing on.

[AmonGwareth]

Great... I think this thread has run its course. StalePopcorn, maybe you want to open a new one for direct feedback on your quests?

[StalePopcorn]

Great... I think this thread has run its course. StalePopcorn, maybe you want to open a new one for direct feedback on your quests?

Yep good idea - please reply to this post with feedback for the quests.

Stale.

[Soraii]

Of course ive also never met a dragon who enjoyed those quests.

*Raises a claw*

I like them, they give me direction when I dont know what to hunt whil eleveling

Granted it may be my history in EverGrin.. err EverQuest... but 100 is not that big of a number >_> Especialy when it's a common mob. Kill 100 Garnet golems took less time then kill 15 massive elm or whatever that level 70 quest was O.o

I had FUN doing the "most evil" level 70 aegror quest, Had fun hunting those and trying to not get myself killed! lol I was VERY dissapointed that that quest got changed when Al was doing the level 70 quests... and the treant one was not changed >_>

All I can say is the kill X mobs quests is basically guided direction when you dont know what mobs to kill, the quests each 10 levels gives you a nice tour around that tiers mobs and gives you a schmorgasboard of what you can kill.

So yeah, *offers a hand to Teto* Nice to meet you

Soraii/Alaysar