Dragon Confectioner - Will we ever get it?

[Shur]

I have to ask, are there any plans at all to add a dragon confectioner class?

For the past two years, i have hardly logged in at all because i find that the new DP fade timers have destroyed the fun i got out of hunting, and i am rarely in the mood to just sit around and craft.

My main beef is that the current system forces me to pick between the lesser of three evils:

A) Only hunt until i die once, then spend 28 hours doing something else while i wait for the DP to fade. this leaves me personally with a maximum of about 45 minutes hunting each day, as that is the longest i can go without some factor causing me to die.

B) hunt until i have enough points that the penalty becomes a severe problem, then find some way to spend my time waiting for the 1+ hour penalty timer (usually end up calling it a day and logging off, since a 20% debuff kills crafting capability as well). this means that for day 1, i have as much hunting time as i can stand, punctuated every 45 minutes by a longer and longer penalty cooldown.

C) run to a biped to get food and eat my penalties away.


Of the three, C is absolutely not an option, for various reasons i have made plain in the past and are not open for discussion here. that leaves A) maximum hunt time of 45 minutes per day, or B) suck it up and deal with the monster penalty cooldowns.

B is fine if i only want to hunt once every other week. gives me a solid day of hunting before the penalty becomes truly debilitating, but by the time i have enough points for the penalty to be a serious problem, it will be two weeks or more for them all to fade.


So i have to ask, will this problem ever have a solution? Will i ever be able to get food without debasing myself before a biped? If so, when?

This is a tolerably critical question (to me anyway) as my sub is up for renewal on the 28th, and my decision to renew will be based on the answer to my questions.



PLEASE NOTE: The purpose of this thread is to inquire as to the possibility of a Dragon Confectioner class. My play-style is NOT the subject of this thread, and i will not debate it in this thread. I merely gave a truncated version of it in order to illustrate why i feel a Dragon Confectioner class is needed. I know i am not the only person who feels this way, even if i am the only one who feels this way and still stuck around after the change went through. Please keep responses related to Dragon Confectioner class ideas or queries. I won't hesitate to report anyone who tries to derail this thread.

[lightning claw]

First WOW reporting is kinda harsh but meh what ever

I agree with you about running to a ped every time i need to go to the Islands every time i need to hunt there, there is at least 6-13 points involved often i do not get the comps i need and wind up trading for them with the comps i do get but that a nother topic

as to a whole new school .... i would beg you not to pursue this. For the following personal reason. I hate crafting. Only reason i finally took up lair shaping is the fact i am completely out of room and need a place to dump stuff. thats it that the only reason why i craft.

with that being said ... let me ask you (thow are numbers are small there are players that feal the same way and despise crafting) we did it cause we needed to only! why on earth would u want to force another evil school down our thoughts ? We use 2 times as many resources to craft our structors than peds do if this is a trend a drag confectioner would need to craft 3 times as much as peds do witch is unacceptable imo

so i hope and pray that ambrosia is put back in other wise i vote leave sleeping evils lay

ether way somthing should be done about this i do agree just not a hole new school requiring mass amounts of resources and leading even more players hating the death point system

[Ladydragon]

we wouldn't need a dragon confectioner class if we could hunt deer and sheep to remove our dp's. I know we can gather venison and mutton from the sheep, so we should be able to eat it too.

I personally wait it out. I tried the naka food and it was slow in removing dp's and I really am not willing to spend the money. There are plenty of bipeds to keep the confectioners working, dragon's should hunt.

Other than that... everything else is fine.

[AmonGwareth]

Giving Dragons the ability to create their own food completely short-circuits the purpose of the Confectioner revamp... that is, to create dependencies between crafters and adventurers.

So in a word, no, there are no plans to add Dragon Confectioner or to give Dragons the ability to create their own food.

[Shur]

ah. i suppose there is no such thing as a dragon craft player eh?

[AmonGwareth]

ah. i suppose there is no such thing as a dragon craft player eh?

I am not sure what you mean by this. Confectioner is designed to provide goods for ALL players. So giving Dragons the capability to reduce DPs would, while serving lore, break the inter-dependency we wanted when we created it.

[Shur]

read lightning claw's post. not every dragon player would choose to level up a dragon confectioner class. Plenty would rather continue buying food from someone else. Giving dragons the ability to create food simply means that for those of us who do not like the flavor of biped-teats, we can get food from another dragon instead.

[AmonGwareth]

read lightning claw's post. not every dragon player would choose to level up a dragon confectioner class. Plenty would rather continue buying food from someone else. Giving dragons the ability to create food simply means that for those of us who do not like the flavor of biped-teats, we can get food from another dragon instead.

Choosing to refuse food from other players because of how you've decided to roleplay your character is just that, a roleplaying decision. Not a design one.

[Shur]

I'm not asking for inter-player dependency to be thrown out, I'm asking you, the developers, to consider that one of your race options is absolutely unique, and that forcing that race to rely on the cookie-cutter races does nothing but water down that uniqueness, and ultimately sours the experience for any who play for that uniqueness.

[velveeta]

having my hatchie rely on peds for food does not sour my playing experience, shur, nor do i feel any less unique - just saying......

[Dragonboy]

To be absolutely honest… I love it that my dragons are allround and only have 2 crafting schools to level. There is a big BUT however. I am not entirely sure how large the RP community is that Shur represents on this forum, but I can totally understand that some would rather make their own food.

As it is now dragons can harvest huge amounts of fish already, salt rocks are no problem either. All that needs to be added to the current Dragon Crafter school would be:
1. A new confectioner skill unless we keep using Ingenuity skill.
2. A new confectioner ability unless we keep using Ingenuity ability.
3. The ability to harvest various spices
a) Adding some forms to craft food (biped use also allowed of course) for example:
b) Raw fish with some salt rocks and higher tier would also require some additional spices.
4. Raw meat with some salt rocks and higher tier would also require some additional spices.
5. We would also need to have a draconic location at which we can craft the food.

I know I wouldn’t care about about not having 10-15 different appetizers, main courses, side dishes and deserts and I doubt Shur or any other dragon who likes the idea would care about having so much variation. The variation should only have to be making appetizers or deserts requiring less raw materials and spices, which would make them Little / Small / Large dishes all on serperate timers. It doesn’t even have to be better then biped food as long as it is similar.
As a side note. I also wouldn’t mind having the lair chamber give the tavern bonus, this would give an actuall ingame purpose to the chamber other then small amount of storage.

[Frith-Rae]

to create dependencies between crafters and adventurers.

Shouldn't that read between crafters and dragon adventurers? Cuz any biped adventure COULD go level up themselves and provide their own food? Thereby creating dependences between noone there - they're bipeds - they can make their own food. They HAVE that option.

So really its between bipeds and dragons...

Cuz dragons like me who are broke have no options but to sit and wait (outside of finding a very nice naka who will give me food for free..).

[Shian]

You can always find RP ways around mechanics if there is an RP reason for not wanting biped food.

Tenkako doesn't like biped food, but she does love sitting on thatched roofs because they're comfortable. (No she's not eating.. I don't care what you read in your main chat. It must be some kind of bug...)

Ricar will steal stored food from larders rather than hunt or buy it as he has little regard for naka. (It's from guild storage but hey...It's fun to RP raiding the store rooms under Aug )

I like and support the idea of having a dragon confectioner class. Don't forget we can also harvest spices like mint and star anise!

To this day though, I get the idea to create the interdependency, and it is an idea I support, but hurting the hunters because they have to go sit in a timeout for 45 minutes makes eating and using this system not worth it for me.

[Dragonboy]

I am not sure what you mean by this. Confectioner is designed to provide goods for ALL players. So giving Dragons the capability to reduce DPs would, while serving lore, break the inter-dependency we wanted when we created it.

There shall always be a dramatic difference... There shall always be a huge canyon between bipeds on 1 side and dragons on the other.
That is the nature of the game and nothing will ever going to change that...
1. Forcing dragons to ask bipeds for tools/spells so they can finish their (A)RoP or Drain Bolt quest lines (these 3 just came to mind, there is probably dozens more) is not going to change that.
2. Forcing dragons to eat food made by a biped which I cannot imagine a dragon would find tasty is also not going to change the difference.
And with all due respect, but a 50-100 ton dragon eating max 1 kg of chicken in a meal and it actually makes a difference?!?
From a slight realistic point of view it would have to be a whole deer (raw or cooked) to make the difference that right now a desert or side dish would make.

The whole playing style between bipeds and dragons is different. I am not going to say that 1 is better then the other since I have too little experience playing both to comment, but it is the truth. And forcing a constant one sided inter-dependencie is really starting to get annoying.

In the old days bipeds would be happy to have Promote Vitality or True Grit cast on them, right now they have all kinds of food which does the same stuff, but last for 2 hours instead of the 30 min. buff we can give them.
Being interdependend is fine, but Amon can you please tell me in what way bipeds actually need dragons except for being easy to level cargo mules alts?

[Shian]

There shall always be a dramatic difference... There shall always be a huge canyon between bipeds on 1 side and dragons on the other.
That is the nature of the game and nothing will ever going to change that...

They could change the lore... So that players don't have that mindset of 'I'm against bipeds'.
Not that that'll happen , but it just seems counter productive to have a game that by lore, the living races don't have very good relationships between another. Ask any Half-Giant or Fiend... (sorry VI for inheriting such a quandrum...)

1. Forcing dragons to ask bipeds for tools/spells so they can finish their (A)RoP or Drain Bolt quest lines (these 3 just came to mind, there is probably dozens more) is not going to change that.

Can always ask a Helian instead for said tool? *shrug* I kinda like the "let's ruin a biped tool" mentality :P There's people with plenty of alts that can have the dragon hand you the tool instead?

And forcing a constant one sided inter-dependencie is really starting to get annoying.

I've served as a tank once...
They need us for Star Anise?... wait no they don't. *sigh*

[StalePopcorn]

Is there any reason why there can't be dragon-centric recipes instead? I am no RP-er so forgive the suggestion for those that love that style of play and if this sort of thing "just isn't done in the Dragon world", but what about:

"Helian's Lava-Baked Venison"

"Helian's favorite food was always a whole deer encased in a crystal lattice, dipped in the impossible temperature of a lava flow. The cooking time being less than 3 seconds, the lava quickly removes the outer layer of deer leaving the insides hot and steaming. The crunch of a dragon biting through a lava-baked Venison is a sound that sends shivers down Istarians of smaller stature."

and...

"Cows Well Hung"

"The Scourge of Barasavus required enormous quantities of food after his many battles with the lesser races, and one of his favorites was Cows Well Hung. This involved a whole cow carcass left to cure over a lava pit, the smoke and ash naturally preserving the hide while gently cooking the cow. Often this took weeks to mature, but crafty confectioners found ways to greatly speed up the process while maintaining the taste and leathery texture of the meat. "

"While Lunus the Mighty outright refused to purchase any made by the naka-duskael (he once proclaimed that he could smell their scent on the food, which ruined the dining experience), there have been many reports by Confectioners of disappearing produce, punctuated by the flapping of wings and what some have described as a rather evil laugh."

Would anything like this help? Might be a much better chance of getting Dragon-centric recipes added, since a Dragon Confectioner isn't on the agenda.

(song reference: *sings* "We will fight for <pause> Bovine Freedom <pause> and hold our large heads high... We will run free <pause> with the Buffalo, <pause> or dieeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee )

[velveeta]

heeheeheehhheeeee
cows well hung

i love aussies

bovine for you but cow bout me? will you heifer forgive me?

[Dragonboy]

Can always ask a Helian instead for said tool? *shrug* I kinda like the "let's ruin a biped tool" mentality :P There's people with plenty of alts that can have the dragon hand you the tool instead?

While I went Lunus back on Unity for the reason that bipeds being lesser then me. While I have in fact grown soft through the years and dont really mind asking bipeds for items or using biped food. I merely used those examples to show that we already need bipeds for multiple items, however I still hope to find out what bipeds need dragons for except as mules...

Is there any reason why there can't be dragon-centric recipes instead? I am no RP-er so forgive the suggestion for those that love that style of play and if this sort of thing "just isn't done in the Dragon world", but what about:

"Helian's Lava-Baked Venison"

"Cows Well Hung"

Would anything like this help? Might be a much better chance of getting Dragon-centric recipes added, since a Dragon Confectioner isn't on the agenda.

Nice ideas Stale, while I would prefer making my own food instead of a biped the ideas are very nice.

[Silverblaze]

I have to ask, are there any plans at all to add a dragon confectioner class?

For the past two years, i have hardly logged in at all because i find that the new DP fade timers have destroyed the fun i got out of hunting, and i am rarely in the mood to just sit around and craft.

My main beef is that the current system forces me to pick between the lesser of three evils:

A) Only hunt until i die once, then spend 28 hours doing something else while i wait for the DP to fade. this leaves me personally with a maximum of about 45 minutes hunting each day, as that is the longest i can go without some factor causing me to die.

B) hunt until i have enough points that the penalty becomes a severe problem, then find some way to spend my time waiting for the 1+ hour penalty timer (usually end up calling it a day and logging off, since a 20% debuff kills crafting capability as well). this means that for day 1, i have as much hunting time as i can stand, punctuated every 45 minutes by a longer and longer penalty cooldown.

C) run to a biped to get food and eat my penalties away.


Of the three, C is absolutely not an option, for various reasons i have made plain in the past and are not open for discussion here. that leaves A) maximum hunt time of 45 minutes per day, or B) suck it up and deal with the monster penalty cooldowns.

B is fine if i only want to hunt once every other week. gives me a solid day of hunting before the penalty becomes truly debilitating, but by the time i have enough points for the penalty to be a serious problem, it will be two weeks or more for them all to fade.


So i have to ask, will this problem ever have a solution? Will i ever be able to get food without debasing myself before a biped? If so, when?

This is a tolerably critical question (to me anyway) as my sub is up for renewal on the 28th, and my decision to renew will be based on the answer to my questions.



PLEASE NOTE: The purpose of this thread is to inquire as to the possibility of a Dragon Confectioner class. My play-style is NOT the subject of this thread, and i will not debate it in this thread. I merely gave a truncated version of it in order to illustrate why i feel a Dragon Confectioner class is needed. I know i am not the only person who feels this way, even if i am the only one who feels this way and still stuck around after the change went through. Please keep responses related to Dragon Confectioner class ideas or queries. I won't hesitate to report anyone who tries to derail this thread.

Non derailing part of the post:

I do not want a dragon confectioner. I do not require a dragon made way to remove deathpoints. I do not think we dragon players will ever get one.

I have a few solutions to the problem.

None of these discuss tactics, player skill, or tell anyone their opinion is wrong.

1. Take the time to look at craft schools and completely flesh out a blanaced version of Dragon Confectioner with skill gain per level, recipes, etc. Submit on suggestions.

2. Play a biped to level ones own confectioner to 100.

3. Find a dragon who has spare fish fry's, pies, and ambrosias. No bipeds needed. (pleasse note, I haven't played in a while, if some of those items are attuned they are obviously NOT an option. My mistake, I apologize in advance.

[Ashuran]

Giving Dragons the ability to create their own food completely short-circuits the purpose of the Confectioner revamp... that is, to create dependencies between crafters and adventurers.

Fail.

What Frith said... all bipeds can make their own food if they bother to level confectioner. Only dragons are forced to be dependent.

I don't think dependency is the issue, I think the original intent was to make confectioners more useful, and allowing dragons to make their own food cuts into that usefulness unless: 1) only dragons can eat dragon-made food and/or 2) dragon 'cooking' is every bit as painful and annoying to level and make as the biped variety.