So, I decided to give Horizons another chance..

[nefariousd]

I get an e-mail from Artifact the other day that, to me, sounds like a plead for people to give Horizons another shot. I played it when it went live, but left because of the bugs. I figure, "What the hey, maybe they fixed stuff?". Wow, was I wrong.

I should start by saying, I have a pretty good system. I can run Doom 3 at 1600x1200, on High detail, with 4x AntiAliasing and maintain 60+ fps, thanks to a GeForce 6800 GT. I've got 786mb of DDR system ram and an xp2600 processor. I shouldn't have trouble with the otherwise standard graphics in Horizons, and yet, the game runs more horribly than any other game or application than ive run in the past few years, spanning several system configurations. That's, well, pretty bad. Things are fine once I first load the game up, and the loading increases quickly over time and preformance degrades greatly. I checked task manager on a hunch during one of these hissies fits (as this is really the only thing i can do with my subscription for the moment is load and crash), and, "Hey, neat. 1,800mb of memory used up. Artifact sure is awesome with these memory leaks".

I feel like *such* a sucker for having shelled out 12 dollars for this utterly terrible, worthless piece of waste product. I feel honestly and deeply bad for the people who continue playing this game with hope for a brighter future, because you are all getting conned by, and lets be real here, its no mystery, a shady, poorly managed game house. You're all paying for a sub-standard, unrealized, bug-laden sham of a program, and the situation isn't likely to improve.

To all the other poor schmucks who got suckered into trying Horizons again: I feel your pain.

[Drachnyen]

ya, im having a bit of the same feeling. got the e-mail, said what the heck... i never touched this game after beta, and the way it ended. but i figured that in the 9+ months its been in retail something had to ahve changed.. and I was kinda dissapointed to see that its pretty much the same thing.

Thankfully Im on the 7 day trail thingy, so unless they put on one helluva fireworks display inthe next 6 days im canceling the account.

[nefariousd]

Ah, cute. Now I can't cancel my subscription. Hats off, Artifact. The slickest proffessional conartists this side of the gaming biz.

[Ashtoreth]

Thank you for sharing that with us.

I'll have to admit, I'm a poor *** for playing Horizons, but I really can't help it. I don't feel any pain either. Horizons runs poorly on my system, but then again most of the modern 3D games also do.
I'm with my friends, and I'm having fun playing Horizons. So I must be an idiot...

Anyway, I really don't see the purpose of your post, under an attractive title even. Except maybe to poison this newly formed forum, which leads me to theassumption that you're one of the regular trolls/bile-spewers that make a living out of this.

I might be wrong, in that case I thank you again for sharing your utterly terrible, worthless piece of waste product 'opinion' with us.

Sincerely..

[Drachnyen]

I take it you never beta tested this game?

although his post may have been harsh and a little more blunt then required, his points are still valid ones. The entire course of beta was alot of talk about the improvments, the "un released content" (which NEVER exsisted BTW), the talks of how all the memory leaks, the graphical errors, the constant CTD's were fixed in their "in house testing".

Then release hits and the game is EXACTLY the way it was when it left beta, no changes, no updates, no new "previously useen content" none of that. And now the same kind of talk of improvements, tweaks, fixes, and everything else are being thrown about in the same manner as they were in beta.

Im glad you and your friends enjoy the game, thats great. however you can't honestly say that this game has no major problems what-so-ever, and that only minor fixes are needed. The game im looking at today is nearly a carbon copy of the what i saw in the last few days of beta. the same graphical errors are occuring, the same out of sync combat etc etc. the only thing i see diffrent is that resoruces were added/relocated, and new mobs were added, and old mobs were moved around... other then that, it has changed little in my eyes, and I seriously hope that some major changes will come along. This game has always had wonderful potential from day 1 of the concept. however that potential has been buried somewhere, and we're left to play only this husk of what could have been a top 10, if not top 5 MMORPG

[IndigoStar]

I quit the game last december I think.

And for me the game seems much improved, I had horrible performance when I quit, unplayable etc...

Today it played smooth, combat animations /spells were much nicer without lag. It was actually an enjoyable experience. Portaled all over the place, and never bogged down in a couple hours of playing... I also had everything turned on high. and decent /nice framerates though I couldnt' remember how to turn on the fps display...

My system isn't the best ati 9700 pro, 1 gig ram 2.54 GHZ proc, but not the worst either..

Did have a couple of issues with how things are now that I will be posting on though :D.

All in all it is better, but not sure if I will keep playing it or not, need a bit more time I think.

Indi

[Penumbra]

Thank you for sharing that with us.

I'll have to admit, I'm a poor *** for playing Horizons, but I really can't help it. I don't feel any pain either. Horizons runs poorly on my system, but then again most of the modern 3D games also do.
I'm with my friends, and I'm having fun playing Horizons. So I must be an idiot...

Anyway, I really don't see the purpose of your post, under an attractive title even. Except maybe to poison this newly formed forum, which leads me to theassumption that you're one of the regular trolls/bile-spewers that make a living out of this.

I might be wrong, in that case I thank you again for sharing your utterly terrible, worthless piece of waste product 'opinion' with us.

Sincerely..

Actually, this OP made a very useful set of statements. You see, I got the same e-mail and decided to check out the websites and stuff once more.I quit after all the bugs, boredom, and bungling and thanks to this thread, I now know that they still exist, plus it looks like he can't unsubscribe now.

I was actually considering resubscribing after that heart-felt plea for players to come back. Now I know not to.

What I really admire is your fan-boi conviction in that the other person was a troll and made a useless post. It turns out that you are the troll, in fact! LOL@YOU. I'll stick to Eve-Online. At least it works and it looks good, plus it isn't desolate like my friend tells me Horizons is - he still has an account unfortunately. Thanks Artifact for wasting everybody's time.


Penumbra

[Drachnyen]

I'll stick to Eve-Online. At least it works and it looks good, plus it isn't desolate like my friend tells me Horizons is

Ya, im personaly taking a break from EVE for a little while.. probably untill Shiva hits.. you can only kill so many carebears ya know?? [6]

so this 7 day trial came at a good time when i had nothing better to do

[bigswifty]

perhaps some context is in order for you to understand why someone would post such things and "polute" the new boards, obviously you folks still subscribed have not seen the note from bowman so here it is in full....

?Horizons just isn?t for me.? ?This game has too many bugs.? ?There must be something more to do than kill wolves.? Friends in Horizons: I know that you have made a choice to discontinue playing Horizons: Empire of Istaria. The choice you made was a personal one; and you made it for one or more reasons. In some way Horizons did not hold your interest, you became dissatisfied, and decided it was not worth your valuable time or money to remain part of the Istarian community. I?m writing today to invite you back. I?m inviting you back because I have confidence. Confidence in the game and confidence that whatever attracted you to Horizons in the first place is now better, more robust or more interesting. Unsubscribed players offered me many reasons why they chose not to continue playing. I can tell you with complete confidence that a vast majority of these reason and issues have been fixed. Horizons offers an extraordinary amount of new content that satisfies both crafters and adventures, in groups, guilds, and as soloists. Here are just a few examples of what Horizons now offers subscribers: · A new combat system provides better feedback to group members and takes much better advantage of your client hardware to help eliminate combat latency; · New buildable structures that range from Tier 1 to Tier 5 and provide storage and added functionality to the owner; · Guild Communities provide vast areas for your Guild to develop and settle. · New monsters and creatures ranging from level 1 to level 120 that challenge and reward the brave; · The Realms of Chaos and Order provide populated worlds to meet new friends, sell your wares and share the Istarian Experience; · New regions of Istaria continue to be discovered and require your exploration; · Crafting schools now have access to Tier V and Tier VI materials, and a richly expanded range of techniques and formulae; · Our developers continue to optimize all aspects of the technical game. We have addressed many of the reasons crashes to desktop were commonplace. · A new series of quests provided by the Trophy Hunters provides coin and experience to the courageous. · The Istarian world now has a logical progression for both adventures and crafters from Tier I to Tier VI as a player moves from west to east. · In-game events continue to move the Istarian story forward: Both the Dryad and Satyr races were freed through direct player involvement ? and are now playable races; the Dragon Rite of Passage allows the magical transition from Hatchling to Adult Dragon enabling the only ?flyable? character among MMOG?s. The Elven city of Feledan was freed ? again through player involvement ? resulting in a new, beautiful racial city. · There are now over 2,500 plots of ownable property located throughout Istaria ready to be owned and developed. · We continue our commitment to a cooperative Istaria with new content, new adversaries and new resources. · The visual and musical world of Istaria continues to impress even the most jaded of gamers. · You need not remain in the game for hours at a time accomplish and be rewarded ? unless you want to. · Our crafting system is well known to be one of the most intricate and vigorous of any MMORPG available. Here is my proposal to you:

1. Resubscribe to Horizons: Empire of Istaria; Activate any of your characters or create a new one; Connect with your friends & catch up on the latest news and events; Explore the new Istarian landscape; Experience the vast amount of changes and additions for yourself; Enjoy the game.

I can?t guarantee that you will be satisfied ? everyone has different expectations for what creates an enjoyable game experience. I can guarantee that you will find a new, greatly improved, on-line world that provides subscribers with an immersive and detailed experience worthy of your commitment of time and resources. The staff and developers of Horizons have listened to subscribers ? both what they enjoyed and what was challenging about the game ? and have worked diligently to meld our values and advance Horizons within its original framework while acknowledging to and overcoming the challenges inherent with a game of this scale. I know we have accomplished our goals and have set some very ambitious targets for the future: · Raising all crafting and adventuring school levels to120: · The addition of Dragon Lairs and other racial structures; · Promoting the Ancient Rite of Passage for Dragons; · Providing Blighted Equipment ? with its own special features ? as loot: · Adding many new formulae, techniques and crystals. Now all we need is you. Please, consider Horizons: Empire of Istaria again. Sincerely, David Bowman Artifact Entertainment P.S. We have retained all your characters? inventory, skills and schools. The resubscription process will grant you full access to the game. If you have not been to Istaria since our shard consolidation you will now find yours character(s) in the realm of Chaos or Order: Order for role playing characters and Chaos for non-role playing characters. If, for some reason, you need a CD Key to activate your account, click here. Also, be sure to take a look at our new community site. Thank you, I hope to see you in Istaria.

[Lunhilde]

I am planning on keeping my posting to a minimum here, though I can't explain quite why I picked this thread to put one of those minimal responses on..

.. none of that letter is really a lie. The subscription issues I suspect are stil stemming from a switchaway from IBill.

Likely the invitationwas premature.Fixes are still going in weekly, if not announced updates. But a lot of people will say "It always has been premature"... no need to repeat. I'm not a beta player but I've read enough to understand what people went through.

Anyone who has been following from the outsideand *actually* being a "troll" since beta knows the hell the game and the company have gone through. It's pretty amazing it's still around, and has a new chance again to boot, with all of the venom that flies around. But it's backed up by a lot of people who despite the issues that burn everyone else, enjoy the game. It's going to happen. Goose/gander, trash/treasure, whatever.

This is my first online MMO "community" I have ever been involved in. I've played another MMO, but never bothered with forums and the like.

I'm told that Horizons' community is one of the most outspoken ones around though. So all of these things, I take in stride.

There's no need to feel sad for people who play an enjoy this game (as I may feel sad for people who play and enjoy EQ, perhaps, because to me a 40.00 expansion a month is a money-sink and an account that can become so monetarily valuable people will try to steal it, or you will be hunted down and pestered by people who want to buy it from you,is just stress inducing). People who came post-beta have a different image of what the game was meant to be, and enjoy the different image. Many of us also respect different opinions. We'e all allowed to have them. We are different people.

But the players who have hung in since release, some if not many would agree with that letter on many points. This does not make them fanbois or anything of the sort, it is only because they witnessed it. Sure, sometimes added things break old things, we got to watch that, and got to watch it get fixed -- with what is now a very small developer/programmer staff. There are not banks of dev's sitting around drinking coffee anymore (if there ever were), and everyone knows new content = new bugs or repeats of old ones whose ixes got broken by added stuff.

And MMO is a living thing in that way. It grows, but it alsoit scrapes knees, it gets hurt sometimes, is subjected to bad haircuts when it's time for class pictures... that sort of thing.Returning willdepend ultimately on what someone primarily disliked about the game. If you dislike that it is Horizons and liked beating HZ up after school on the playground hill at 3:30, then short of the whole game re-written with a different engine, there's nothing that will ever satisfy. The gameisstill what it is. Beyond that, work is actively being done to the point where people can see it in the next patch; so it is growing and maturing.

And on that note, I will go find some coffee. Best of luck to everyone, and remember: the point of a game is to have fun, not to be sad or angry about it.

[Sarogin]

Ah, cute. Now I can't cancel my subscription. Hats off, Artifact. The slickest proffessional conartists this side of the gaming biz.

Nefarious, AE has suspended all billing until the billing problems can be resolved. Seems like you had your mind made up before you decided to giveHorizons another try.

Personally, I'm enjoying the changes to the game. I play on Order. There has been a lot of interest in the plot auctions currently underway. Buildings are popping up like daisies thanks to the resources brought over from the shard consolidation. There have been more server down time than I like in the past couple of weeks, but overall, it's been a good time. More monsters, more high level content, functional buildings, huge tracks of new plots, yep, all in all a good time. Sorry you didn't enjoy it. [:$]

[bigswifty]

just for the record, my posting of the letter does not imply any sort of evaluation of it's truthfulness. it is simply posted for the reference those of you who have not seen it.
personaly I have not played as of yet due to some small account creation issues last night so I amcertainly not in any position to debate its merits, I expect that if I am able to create a trial account and log in I will post my opinions on the state of the game after the trial ends (sooner if things go to heck and I find serious flaws that prevent my playing)

I will say that if I am prompted to enter card info to play the trial, the client will get round-filed and I will post a psudo-rant about that before I block ae emails and never look back, but I am getting ahead of myself on that issue.

I am trying to remain optimistic, but this will be my third time back including beta, so bear with me :)

[Lunhilde]

It's okay bigswifty; I understand. [:)] It can be frustrating and dissapointing. I hope things go well for you and you get to enjoy the game as much as the rest of us (who enjoy the game) do.

[Drachnyen]

I will say that if I am prompted to enter card info to play the trial, the client will get round-filed and I will post a psudo-rant about that before I block ae emails and never look back, but I am getting ahead of myself on that issue.

no reason to get ahead of the issue. I can tell you right now that you ARE required to enter card information prior to joining the trial. it looks like after 7 days you card automatically gets hit with a payment if you havn't cancled the account yet.

so why do I have this unerving feeling that next week the account cancelation process will be bugged again [:S]

[Drakolis]

Seems to me ,AE hasn't fixed many issues yet. Haven't added the advertised features that were on the website when I first joined beta and bought the game. I quit after seeing they had no plans to add these features. So until they had a few of the original features, ill be staying away. I miss my dragon a lot , but not THAT much. I'll come back when you fix your lies AE.

[Beryl]

I renewed long enough to log on, make a dryad, run a few levels to see what (if anything) had really changed.

Nothing has that I can see.

I logged off, cancelled sub, and sent the following reply to Mr. Bowman:

----------------------------------------------------------
David -- I see nothing in your 'come back' email to assure me that the database instability issues have been resolved. Add to this, I see Tazoon.com announcing that they are informed lack of funding means they no longer get support for the community forum that has always been primary. I understand and appreciate the company's desire to shore up their business, but my abject disappointment over your productand subsequent frustration and anger have not abated with time.I am not inclined to return when there is no assurance whatever that core issues with playability are no longer present and when even the baseline community vehicles are broken down on the roadside for lack of funding. In short,you've taught me a valuable lesson about putting my wallet where my mouth is, andI am no longer willing to pay you my hard-earned dollars to find out if I'm right or wrong. Kindly remove me from your mailing list. Thank you.
----------------------------------------------------------

It isn't about venom, it isn't about 'trying to ruin them', it is about being honest in one's dissatisfaction and wishing Artifact Entertainment would be honest in its presentation to past players. They are not being so. This gains them no sympathy from me, especially not dollars.

[bigswifty]

[img]/Web/Themes/default/images/icon-quote.gif[/img]bigswifty wrote:
I will say that if I am prompted to enter card info to play the trial, the client will get round-filed and I will post a psudo-rant about that before I block ae emails and never look back, but I am getting ahead of myself on that issue.


no reason to get ahead of the issue. I can tell you right now that you ARE required to enter card information prior to joining the trial. it looks like after 7 days you card automatically gets hit with a payment if you havn't cancled the account yet.

so why do I have this unerving feeling that next week the account cancelation process will be bugged again [img]/Web//emoticons/emotion-7.gif[/img]

well if thats the case then I will not be taking DB up on his offer, I have a personal policy to not give out my card info unless I make a purchase, i do not give card info in case i might decide to buy something in the future, nor will I enter card info into a system with known bugs knowing full well I might not be able to unsubscribe in time to avoid charges (as several users have reported)

it's a shame realy, I realy wanted to give HZ the benefit of doubt, I guess it wasn't meant to be.

I guess i shouldn't be supprised knowing AE's track record to date, I do sincerly hope that these guys eventualy gravitate away from shooting themselves in the foot at every turn or they will end up going the way of E&B.

at any rate I got the privlege of spamming the new forums for a day so I guess I can be happy with that :p

Theres no longer any reason for me to hang out with you folks, fun as you all are, I hope the best for you all, and for those of you who are fully enjoying playing in the HZ world I wish all the best to you and your favorite pastime.

Rock onfolks :)

[Goriax]

The memory leak is annoying but the workaround I've been using is to relog every few hours. Annoying but not really a killer. I've had worse problems in other games. Some people reported virtually eliminating their memory leak by changing video drivers. I haven't tried that.

If you're getting bad performance you might want to check your graphics settings. Many people seem to think "my system is uber I"ll put all my graphics settings at max" which is a very very bad idea.

My system is a GF Ti4200, 1 GB memory, 3.02 GHz and I typically get 20-40 fps. I usually go around with the clipping plane set pretty far out (near the max), shadows off, ground clutter off, most textures around medium (terrain low because I can't see the difference) viewing few other player characters, and most other settings around medium. Sometimes I get up to 60 fps and sometimes in town it goes into single digits but only if there are a LOT of players there. The memory leak is worse if there are a lot of players -- especially if my graphics settings are set too high (it seems most sensitive to textures). I usually crank them down before going into popular towns. I've gone on many large group expeditions and done fine -- just have to not be too greedy with my graphics settings.

Oh, as it should go without saying shut down other applications before launching it.

If you think HZ is a resource hog wait until you see EQ2. My system was chugging on their character creation screen. SoE was smart not to have an fps meter.

The list of bugs and annoyancesAE hasfixed since December is huge. If you don't think so you didn't play then or don't remember. Yes that dang memory leak is still there but a lot of the other problems are not. In fact, the memory leak isn't as bad as it was then either although I agree it's a pain sometimes.

[Vahrokh]

Lunhilde you wrote one of the best posts I ever read on a Hz board.
Congrats, they exactly reflect the common thoughts of many players, including me.

We came after the promises. We came after the lies. We came after.
We saw a decent product, with many highlights and defects and still we accepted that.

Everyone liked something enough to let him subscribe even with the outstanding problems.

I.e. some knew of the defects (and for sure are all but happy about them!) but liked multiclassing and hone a single character too much to be halted by the bugs.

Some knew of the defects but liked to be able to level up in solo and were fed up of forced partying too much to be halted by bugs.

Some knew of the defects but loved "visual" housing or crafting in general too much to be halted by the bugs.

Some knew of the defects but loveddragons too much to be halted by the bugs.

So to each one his game. We still like it because we accepted it in his bad state since the beginning because of the aspects we liked, so the regular problems don't make us throw a fit. Sure all would it to be perfect and smooth.

But it is not. And cannot be. We are fine with it. We knew it. We are in peace with it.

Sorry if others cannot cope.
Less sorry and almost pissed at those that cannot cope and feel the need to let others feel like morons.

[Phillip]

the problem is Vah, that those "some" don't add up to duking it with the bill.

those with legitimate reasons, if their voices heard, and things done accordingly, we would have ourselves a great game. you know it, i know it, everyone and their grandmas know it.

those with legitimate reasons have been around long enough, or longer than most. they have every right to post as such, for it's the reality and truth, is what this game need most.