Public Silos

[Mimir]

I returned to the game in late December after a little rest (5+/- years). Only to find that the use of public silo rules (for some) has DRASTICALLY changed.

It seems that one or many think that if they find silos full of processed goods in them everything in them is theirs for the taking. I am not talking a T1 silo of raw ores here, I am talking T6, T5 and T4 silos full of T6 processed bars etc.

The old rule was as I remember it: If a public silo is full of processed goods (excluding a handful left) you leave it.

If you need to use that silo for what you are doing wait or contact the person who has made the goods to move them.

It was suggested in chat that the goods were possibly moved to another silo farther away from the machine or placed on a connie.

I know use public silos at your own risk but...is the game seriously gone down this path of never trust anyone? Are the public silos (thank you to all who open them) going to be locked?

Personally I only allow friends to use my silos.

It will be a sad day when everyone does as I do and lock down every public silo to private use only.

If there is a way to find the silo thieves. Or find the players who activate plots, and generally make the game less enjoyable for the rest of us, wouldn't it would be worth the time to investigate.


Just saying!

[Dhalin]

That's just the way society in general works these days.

This isn't 2005 anymore, where there were still some good people left to be found.

Nowadays, it is all about memememememe and everyone's time is a lot more valuable than it was before (due to the bad economy IRL), so it is a lot more tempting to steal someone else's hard work.

I know it isn't a very good reason, and it doesn't excuse them for this sort of horrible behavior, but... understanding why they do it is better than being left scratching your head.

As for silos, well...

I've never trusted using them in the first place, and I've never even touched T6 at all. I don't like placing <T5 crap in them, to be honest. I avoid that whenever I can (dual-boxing usually) and only use my own silos (which are guild-only and my lair is out in the middle of nowhere).

I'm sorry to hear of your troubles but sadly there's no official rules against this sort of behavior, and with all of the newer players we've had enter the game, there's no surprise that some of them are just plain bad apples.

[awdz]

Please keep in mind that it only takes one person to make it seem like all of society is a mess. Most of us are just as upset about the whole issue.

[LOVWYRM]

anyway-its a big shame that thieves can walk through our lands
and take away what others worked hard for.

Our guild silos have been robbed..
and devs can`t/won`t tell us who did that- cause it was public silos.


We shall never find out..
we are as helpless here-
like we are helpless concerning all the dirt and evil in rl.
What a pitty..

[Terao]

Please keep in mind that it only takes one person to make it seem like all of society is a mess. Most of us are just as upset about the whole issue.

So true Awdz!

[Mimir]

...
and devs can`t/won`t tell us who did that- cause it was public silos.
...

And this is the issue...
Are the Devs by their lack of action condoning this action? Because public silos are public it is now NOT ONLY OK for them to be robbed but encouraged?


If public silos (for the good of all) need to be made private to prevent this, is there a possible way to easily add players to a private silo?

The current method of adding users access would need to be revamped to only allow some access to some silos and possibly not others.

This seems like a lot of programming involved for something that seems as simple as checking the logs, speak to the offending party and give a warning.


I am not advocating the perma ban of any player, but a warning that it IS possible to track these types of infractions would go a long way to curb them.

All I know.

[LOVWYRM]

Well- though I am very upset:

But if we put silos on public- we have to accept the risk.
I mean- its all a gentlemen`s agreement not to rob someone.
Nothing else.

And devs may not want to get in trouble with data privacy protection.
Which I can understand.

All that makes me feel so helpless *shrugs*

[Finkledbody]

Although I too am against people whom steal from public silos, we should keep one thing in mind. They are public silos.

Using a public silo for temporary storage is reasonable.. Got a few left over bricks/bars?
-Great!!

Expecting ur 7k bars of t6 bricks/bars to be in a public silo overnight?
Seriously, you dont' expect them to stay there... Do you?


___

Side note: Expecting the devs to use their limited time to track down this type of behavior is un-needed; and would be entirely to wasteful when considering the other problems/priorities they have.

[Mimir]

I personally wound not, but... this was not just 1 silo it was 2 or 3 FULL T6, T5 and a T4 full of T6 materials. Usable by a few.

Let's not blame the victim here... stealing is stealing regardless of the situation.

[Dracaena]

Then there is the flip side of the coin. Players who use public silos for personal storage and leave stuff sitting for weeks. I get really sick of that and I will consider such abandoned and move/use it if I need that silo. Public silos are use at your own risk. Be polite and pick up after yourself when you log for the day so the next guy has a silo to use.

[Mimir]

Then there is the flip side of the coin. Players who use public silos for personal storage and leave stuff sitting for weeks. I get really sick of that and I will consider such abandoned and move/use it if I need that silo. Public silos are use at your own risk. Be polite and pick up after yourself when you log for the day so the next guy has a silo to use.

Agree with you on that one...but 6 hours or less should not be considered abandonment.

[/sarcasm]
But then again what do I care? It was not my stuff that was ripped off nor my lair that was vandalized. Buck it up all you that have had stuff "borrowed". I'm sure you just forgot to activate that machine room and were planning on getting to it sooner or later.

[/end sarcasm]

[Raptress]

Someone taking your stuff from a silo during the same day you put it there while you're online, yeah, that's dispicable. I personally have had stuff stolen from a silo while I was out in the field gathering more. Couldn't have left it for more than twenty minutes, and I was online the entire time.

But I'm very careful to make sure I clean out public silos when I'm done with them, and definitely before I log off, even if I'm not finished. There are few things worse in crafting than seeing a silo that you'd like to use sitting full of the same resources for weeks or even months. I don't like to disturb other people's stuff in silos, but there does come a point where I will move it.

...That is the risk one takes with public silos though. Istaria is lucky to have avoided having many selfish players like larger MMOs do, but like Lovwyrm says, it really is just a polite, unspoken agreement not to just take everything out of every silo you see.

[Dracaena]

I personally wound not, but... this was not just 1 silo it was 2 or 3 FULL T6, T5 and a T4 full of T6 materials. Usable by a few.

Let's not blame the victim here... stealing is stealing regardless of the situation.

So let me get this straight. The losses were in silos that only certain people had access too? If that is true then why lashing out at everything? You have a narrow list of suspects.

[Andaras]

I'm completely with Dracaena on this topic.

Public Silos aren't for Personal Storage/Long term projects.
It can be argued how long a time-span constitutes abandonment.

In my book, if you aren't going to remain online and you want to KEEP
them, move the resources into a Guild Silo or another Private storage
unit. Anything else enters the "at your own risk" territory.

Andaras

[Vaz]

I personally wound not, but... this was not just 1 silo it was 2 or 3 FULL T6, T5 and a T4 full of T6 materials. Usable by a few.

Let's not blame the victim here... stealing is stealing regardless of the situation.

So let me get this straight. The losses were in silos that only certain people had access too? If that is true then why lashing out at everything? You have a narrow list of suspects.

To be fair, I take what s/he said to be a comment on the fact that T6 materials are only usable by a relative few even though, in a public silo, they were technically available to everyone.

[Mimir]

I'm completely with Dracaena on this topic.

Public Silos aren't for Personal Storage/Long term projects.
It can be argued how long a time-span constitutes abandonment.

In my book, if you aren't going to remain online and you want to KEEP
them, move the resources into a Guild Silo or another Private storage
unit. Anything else enters the "at your own risk" territory.

Andaras

Got it, so if I want materials all I need to do is see who is harvesting T6 mats, follow them...if they use a public silo I only have to hope for them to CTD or reboot and the mats are MINE ALL MINE!!! ? And as a bonus I can not be held responsible for taking them? I can even brag about how I came upon such a windfall?

This is good news!!

Lair crafting just got much easier.

[LOVWYRM]

Mim- come down again, pls

sh..happens.

We`ve learned from that- we are alerted.
Thats all we can do.

Lets reserve our rage for those who deserve it-
and not flame to those who rise above disbelif, argue with ratio
or are even friends!

[Mimir]

Mim- come down again, pls

sh..happens.

We`ve learned from that- we are alerted.
Thats all we can do.

Lets reserve our rage for those who deserve it-
and not flame to those who rise above disbelif, argue with ratio
or are even friends!

That wasn't rage. That was resignation. It still bothers me that there can be any justification for someone to empty T6, T5, and T4 silos.. OK one maybe to use for what they needed, but ALL of them? To me, this was not empty them to use the silos. This was to take the work of another player.

But LOVWYRM you are correct, thank you for the calming words and I am done with it See smiley face and resignation in the first sentence.

[Steelclaw]

This looks like an instance of "online disinhibition" (summarized in Penny Arcade's comic for March 19, 2004).

Part of the problem is that people mess with the contents of a silo because they can with impunity. Another part of the problem is that despite the existence of some form of protocol, there's no way to determine whether the user of a silo is violating the protocol (and in some cases, determine who that user is).

Thus, as a victim of silo theft, you don't know whether the perpetrator did it because they wanted to be a jackass, or if they decided you were using a public silo for permanent storage. It's easy to point the finger one way or another, but the fact is, you don't know.

Custom labels and public access logs might help provide some distinction between the two motives, and perhaps discourage the former; though the tech for that would be a long way off, in fact, I'm not sure if it's feasible (or a good idea). Nonetheless, if there's strong interest, I can try to get internal traction on the idea, or some other alternative.

[Dracaena]

After talking to people ingame last night I realize this is another episode of the widespread public storage theft where I originally thought it was an isolated incident. We have this happen regularly, I haven't charted the intervals but guessing about every six months? (Least on Order shard) All this fussing just fuels the thief's ego.

They are clever, they hit, wait for things to blow over and people to think it is safe and unlock the storage. Then when everyone thinks things are ok they hit again. Just have to remember public storage is a gamble and don't gamble more then you can afford to lose.

This is my last post here, I'll not be further feeding the thief troll.