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  1. #1

    Default Low Population

    Ok i didn't know if this was the right section for this as its not really a rant but i only been back in Istaria for a couple days and the amount of changes and updates has been quite a lot to take in. I personally think you guys have done a good job with the content changes. But however i always come to the same question: "how come a game like this has so little population?" I mean i love this game even if i go away from time to time ill still be a istarian. Surely it wouldn't hurt to try and re-advertise this game id love to see the population increase again. Maybe this is wishful thinking? I cant say but i sure as hell refuse to give up on the idea of a bigger community. If anyone has any thoughts or suggestions or ideas about ways to advertise that's cheap but effective feel free to comment

  2. #2

    Default Re: Low Population

    I have to agree that some better advertising might be in order, though I have found advertising to be very expensive. Might be worth looking in to.
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  3. #3

    Default Re: Low Population

    We definately need to look into that. We need new ideas.

    Maybe a "talk to the team"?
    And we need to do that very well stuctured.
    Different sections for different probs and suggestions.
    A simple "What to do to get more players"? is not enough nowadays.
    YOU told me to play a dragon!

  4. #4

    Default Re: Low Population

    Please don't change anything on starter island or New Trismus. it was the challenge of the game that hooked me and kept me coming back . i played for 1.5 years solo and out of all chats . it was the most exciting and yes difficult times in the game but it was just as awarding when I finally got past that mob or quest that kept defeating me . I have seen many players leave cause of boredom after level 100/100/100/100 dragon or 200 adv rating biped what is there to do ? you have built your plot/lair , you have tried to get epic hunts going but no one wants to hunt , and farming for trophies is so boring ( even worst that leveling craft schools ), you even create multiple characters but it is the same. and then there are the players that have left cause they disagree with where the developers are taking the game. yes it is getting easier to help new players but it is the veterans that also need to be satisfied .please develop new quests and area where a high level biped can level without being overwhemed ( doom is only good for so long and Barrier vale is a death sentence for a solo biped ). as for Order .. it is the same old complaint by many too many player that would rather just sit in New Trismus and just Roleplay ( and there is nothing wrong with Roleplaying ) but when new and veteran players can't get a group together for a difficult hunt again and again.. they finally give up and eventually leave . same goes for the players that leave cause of the development and restructuring of Istaria ..after years of asking for age old bugs to be fixed and are ignored and then to have abilities nerfed orto find out that a new update has Broke part of the game and can't get fixed ( cenotaphs) .

  5. #5

    Default Re: Low Population

    Quote Originally Posted by Marynah View Post
    I have to agree that some better advertising might be in order, though I have found advertising to be very expensive. Might be worth looking in to.
    Advertising is VERY expensive. Those nice banner ads you see on gaming sites like mmorpg.com? They run into the THOUSANDS per month and are charged based upon the number of views.

    The Dev Desks and word of mouth are our affordable forms of advertising. I am unsure why some folks might not get them in their email, perhaps their spam filters caught it?

    Yildar, your #2 point is interesting. Though I'd question how many people truly download and read a game manual or starter guide? I don't think I've read a game manual for a downloaded game ever. For a physical one while I was waiting for it to install, maybe, but for a game I simply downloaded on Steam or direct? Nope, don't think so.

    NT is large and spread out when compared to Spirit Isle or Skalkaar. You said "underwhelming" though. How do you mean?

    Thank you all for your feedback. We appreciate it!
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  6. #6

    Default Re: Low Population

    I kinda followed up on the hinted suggestion lov

    so I've started this

    http://community.istaria.com/forum/s...424#post298424
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  7. #7

    Default Re: Low Population

    I wonder if the color schemes of the areas may attract more players, just something bight and catchy?

  8. #8

    Default Re: Low Population

    I've thought about this some since I returned last fall (it's still under a year, so I'm still a newbie, right?)...

    There are two challenges that need to be overcome.
    1. How do we get new people to take a look at the game?
    2. How do we keep them from getting frustrated early on so they realize just how wonderful and complex it is?

    My thoughts on both:

    1. The best sales team out there is the existing player base. If you know others that play computer games of any type, encourage them to try it. Stress that you can make a trial account, but if you play a human you can play forever for free (most MMO's only support free play for a week or 10 days or rely on microtransactions for their revenue stream). The reality is that many of them, if they try it and like it, will eventually want a dragon. Or a plot. Or both. And then they'll become paying subs.

    2. My biggest gripe/issue (and also my greatest love) with the game is how big and vague it is. Istaria is unlike other MMORPG's like WoW where you start out with a big yellow ! right in your face and you're basically led from one area to the next with no confusion as to what to do next. Instead, it's really more a big sandbox with a lot of really cool RPG elements built in. IMO. Feel free to disagree What we really need to keep players from giving up and getting frustrated:
    - a better downloaded .pdf manual with a "getting started" section that spells out all of the NT quests for biped and dragon
    - a downloaded .pdf of all beginner formulas and techniques, with those that are sold indicated as such (and by whom)
    - a downloaded summary of all schools, similar to what was in the original hintbook or what is available on Istaria reference.

    Note that I stress downloaded - make these part of the initial download and then have clickies to these on the start up screen. There's plenty of real estate there for a few simple links.

    Once you've made a character and "explored the world," NT is frankly a bit underwhelming. However, when I started again, I felt like NT was HUGE. And I had a heckuva time finding some of the quest/kill mobs. A simple map that shows where the different quests are completed wouldn't be that tough to make, and again if it's downloaded with a "map of New Trismus" link on the startup screen... I can't imagine this taking a ton of dev time.

    ALL of the above is intended for one thing only: Get people to try that first hit, and come back for another taste, and another... and about the time they get to Kion/Parsinia/Sslanis they will realize just how awesome and complex the game and classes/skills/crafting are... and then they'll see that perfect spot for a plot of their own... and we've got another subscriber.

    None of the above would take a ton of time - most of it already exists in one form or another. All I'm really proposing is that we make it easier for true newbies to get a little more help to prevent that initial frustration where they decide that it's not worth investing extra effort just to find out where a quest ends. And then they swap to something like Farmville and never come back.

  9. #9

    Default Re: Low Population

    An enormous amount of work has gone into improving the introduction stages of the game, with huge tutorial overhauls as well as T1/2 massive revamps. The content is there, the directions are there (or helpful players when the directions get misinterpreted), but to be honest, I really think that the pricing is the main drawback. I've never really gone down this line of thinking myself, as I always thought it was appropriately priced for a (computer) MMO, however, other computer MMO's are no longer the only competition for Istaria/Horizons. Here's how and why I've started to think that pricing is an issue:

    If you choose F2P (which is a fantastic option to begin with), you're limited to one human character only, which in itself isn't a huge issue other than the fact that you could play as a standard Human character in just about every other game ever made... so nothing unique to draw you to that subscription method.

    Ok, let's say you're happy with the Human and no plot. Your vault holds 300 items... by the time you've worked your way up to say Lvl 40 in a single craft school and single adventure school you probably have at least one set of armor, one set of cargo armor, 2 sets of jewelry, tools, cargo disk(s), weapons... so there's 40+ items. Now add it quest rewards, quest items (which you have no idea if you need to keep them after the completion of the quest, so you do anyway), unscribed forms, tech comps, trophies... there's another 100 if you're a bit of a hoarder (depending on how many forms you've looted and kept). So Vault space is a serious issue for F2P-ers and I dislike having to spend an entire day every week emptying and sorting through all my loot.

    Ok, so let's say you choose the payment options... $10/month for no plot (why bother? fair enough, you may want to try a dragon for a bit before deciding if you want to pay a bit more for the lair)... so $15/month (~$180/year or ~$155/year for an annual sub). For some people that could be their entire gaming budget. Let's compare that to say the PlaystationNetwork, which is less than half that... ~$70/year for an annual subscription, which gives you heavily discounted games every month and even some free!

    As sad as this is for me to say, when I realised the amount of money I've spent on monthly subs for this game over the last 10 years, I'm no longer getting the return on investment I would like... I've been hunting the same Epic mobs for longer than I wish to admit, and I still don't have a single Reklar item, but that hardly matters since almost all epic gear is pretty sub-standard. It's great the dev's have worked so hard on all aspects of the game, but as a long time player, I have no use of the nice trinkets and quest rewards from anything below 100.

    So what keeps me here? The community of course! I enjoy helping others with hunting, not so much crafting... that I still very much dislike. I have a lair I would love to finish one day but I have all but lost the will to continue with it. Don't despair, I have no intention of cancelling any of my subs (I just started switching to annual subs since I've lost out on more than 100 Loyalty tokens by only having monthly subs... why is my Loyalty somehow less than others when I've been playing and paying for so long?!?)

    Anyway, I'm glad this is in the rant section The main point I think I was trying to make is the price is no longer competitive in the overall gaming market.
    --- iuvenilis --- [Officer of The Alliance]
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  10. #10

    Default Re: Low Population

    Maybe I am too old school, I still use paper reference a lot. I have a dozen or so sheets I have created like spell and form checklists, plans for next armor upgrades and techs required, etc. plus the Brady hint book from way back when.

    What I meant by NT was that when you first start it seems huge. Doing the assessor quests I felt I was running miles. But when you go back it feels a lot smaller. Underwhelming is what I called it, and that's how I feel when I visit the village where I grew up IRL - my perspective has changed... The point I was trying to make is that although it's easy to find stuff there now, starting out it was a vast unexplored (and at times bordering on overwhelming) place. My concern is that some people may find that frustrating and without an easy resource to help them they may give up. They may not want to ask in a chat channel, but if it's on their PC they may take a few seconds to look it up. Or I may be totally off base.

  11. #11

    Default Re: Low Population

    Yeah no one is about to look through their games big box for the manual and lore, especially new players.

    It is difficult understandably to get people into games that are not only old, but also difficult. Without assistance from other players, Istaria is brutal, and I doubt anyone would want to deal with the level of frustration. They'll just quit and move on. It's a sad turn for gamers around, especially when games like Candy Crush are raking in the dough for impulse instantaneous gratification. These games are what is now. Money talks.

    Anyone who appreciates older games has already done their homework and are staying.

    Dragons are what set this game apart. Everything else has been done in some form or fashion in other games. Seems to be a lot more dragon players than there are biped players. People who get into the game as a dragon, will probably get sick of it within six months, and never explore the bipeds. If something could be done to make a connection for dragon players (the draw in) to try out bipeds, then perhaps you may see more people overall around.

    As Amon said, the cost of banners alone on high traffic sites is killer. People don't black hat SEO and juice links and domains for nothing. It's all about the traffic and what money they can pull from it.

    One thing I would like to see is some of the older quests brought back. Wishgiver comes to mind, as well as Tazoon. It's awkward when the capital is desolate.
    rip

  12. #12

    Default Re: Low Population

    Quote Originally Posted by Dracillion View Post
    Dragons are what set this game apart. Everything else has been done in some form or fashion in other games. Seems to be a lot more dragon players than there are biped players. People who get into the game as a dragon, will probably get sick of it within six months, and never explore the bipeds. If something could be done to make a connection for dragon players (the draw in) to try out bipeds, then perhaps you may see more people overall around.
    This is the best argument for dragon prestige/multi classes that I have seen in a long time.

  13. #13

    Default Re: Low Population

    What's kept me going for a couple months was that I was able to get someone to roll in Istaria with me. If I came in just by myself and tried to do a random grouping thing, I doubt I would stick around. It seems too much like "get to 100, then there's groups".

    In the 20s the quest line starting from Broken Cargo Disk that leads into Plundered Tombs actually seems to be some spiffy content but its only any good because of researching some very obscure posts that talked about it. Playing randomly, what would happen is either I would ignore it ("oh, here's two title quests, just do those"), try it and give up because Hunt Master is way too hard to solo after you just got the broken disk, or do some and forget about it completely since part of it drops from your log if you die or log out.

    I'm certain there's a number of people who like the brutality and complexity of it all, but I don't think many want to solo 100 levels in order to join up. So basically the challenging group content in the leveling range needs to be opened up a little. I don't want to group to kill easy trophy mobs or have a level 40 character crush the 20s content, so a few pointers indicating the good stuff would probably work better than letting everyone float around the ionosphere wondering what's up.

  14. #14

    Default Re: Low Population

    Quote Originally Posted by alizarinblaze View Post
    In the 20s the quest line starting from Broken Cargo Disk that leads into Plundered Tombs actually seems to be some spiffy content but its only any good because of researching some very obscure posts that talked about it. Playing randomly, what would happen is either I would ignore it ("oh, here's two title quests, just do those"), try it and give up because Hunt Master is way too hard to solo after you just got the broken disk, or do some and forget about it completely since part of it drops from your log if you die or log out.
    I can tone down the Hunt-Master, though for the record that quest is given out by Sergeant Jonis in Bristugo. I do want to point out that the quests starting with the Lost Cargo Disk at Elissa Malna in Sable Shores are linear. They lead one to another from Sable Shores to Bristugo to Dalimond and are quite clear about who to visit, where to go next, etc.
    Last edited by AmonGwareth; June 17th, 2014 at 10:05 AM.
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    "Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will spends it whole life believing that it is stupid." -- Albert Einstein

  15. #15

    Default Re: Low Population

    From my perspective it is mainly not so much a problem of difficult contend, because many things can be done in a 2 man team as long as 1 is a healing class. The main problem is getting in contact with people in this game. In other games there is quite often a public channel where everyone starts in - and yes they are often spammed but its a good way to find people doing the same stuff as u want to do. In Istaria you have to join every channel by urself.

  16. #16

    Default Re: Low Population

    Quote Originally Posted by Lantis View Post
    From my perspective it is mainly not so much a problem of difficult contend, because many things can be done in a 2 man team as long as 1 is a healing class. The main problem is getting in contact with people in this game. In other games there is quite often a public channel where everyone starts in - and yes they are often spammed but its a good way to find people doing the same stuff as u want to do. In Istaria you have to join every channel by urself.
    There already is something similar.
    Unless it's been changed, last time i checked, one of the first few tutorial boxes advises you to join chat channels (i beleive it direclty advises upon entering MP).
    But the problem is...
    > Forcing people into chat channels against their will can be stressful for shy players
    > Very few people read the tutorials (form my experince of new people on order)

  17. #17

    Default Re: Low Population

    Quote Originally Posted by Azath View Post
    There already is something similar.
    Unless it's been changed, last time i checked, one of the first few tutorial boxes advises you to join chat channels (i beleive it direclty advises upon entering MP).
    But the problem is...
    > Forcing people into chat channels against their will can be stressful for shy players
    > Very few people read the tutorials (form my experince of new people on order)
    The tutorial prompt is woefully inadequate. I said it years ago and I'll repeat it again - the tutorial prompt is no substitute for automatically dumping new players in the new player channel after character creation, and the same can be said for new dragon players.

    Shy players can leave the channels if they create a new character, same for those who are antisocial. Tutorial prompts suck because as we all know, most people don't read them. Automatic assignment of one or two public chat channels would make a big difference to new players. To this day I still encounter guild mates who are completely oblivious to the existence of new player, marketplace, dragon, and other populated chat channels.

  18. #18

    Default Re: Low Population

    Indeed, Facebook is a very powerful tool. I have to admit I hadn't thought of how powerful it is and haven't "Liked" it yet (so my friends can see). But I will do it tonight. Maybe if everyone Likes it, can drum up some business I rarely Like things, but this is worth it, to get some new players, possibly. It's easy:




    Maybe even add that little "Like" icon somewhere on the page that automatically takes you to the Like feature (that so many sites have). So if everyone will join me, and take the effort to Like this page, who knows what can happen? Vahrokh says he/she has 1700 friends, I have about 250. So that's almost 2k people who will see this "Like". Possibly they will visit and see what the heck this is my friend is "liking"? Resulting into someone clicking the istaria.com link on the page. Can even go a step further and click on the "Invite friends to Like this page" link.

    Maybe even add a post (What's on your mind) one time "Playing Istaria @ Istaria.com, fun!"
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  19. #19

    Default Re: Low Population

    Quote Originally Posted by Cegaiel View Post
    Vahrokh says he/she has 1700 friends, I have about 250.
    Slightly off-topic, but wow! I have 70 friends on FB, I know a few people who have between 100 to 120 friends on there, but 250+?!! Your social life must be crazy hehe! How do you remember all of them, how do you manage to schedule time to catch up with them all, how do you get time to play MMOs with that many friends already filling up your social life? One of my mates is a DJ and he's got around a thousand friends on FB but he freely admits he only knows about 50 of them personally, the rest are just people who like his music - makes me wonder if Vahrokh and yourself are secret celebrities

    Well go for it you folks, spread the word to 2000 people pronto!

  20. #20

    Default Re: Low Population

    I talked to a friend of mine in other mmorpg about Istaria. He asked things, I answered. He told he'd check website, returned and told about bad graphic. Another user on other website told about Istaria "graphic made for Android". Yes, for me graphic is of lesser importance...but for some out of there it is important.

    Advertising could help. If users who are satisfied could spread the word it would be the best ads. There are blogs, vlogs, social networks:these can be used to tell things about Istaria. We do not need propaganda, we just need to tell features you will meet in Istaria only.

    Housing. Something has to be done there. As I travel through Istaria's server (Order) - mostly I see empty plots. Ghosst towns. Some plots were in superb positions - and they are no more. Maybe owner left,maybe became free player, maube something other. What I suggest is to discuss a way to increase number of player owned plots, like: make price lesser; make it available to any paying customer or even make it available for anyone who has been playing Istaria for certan time (at least 5 years, for example).

    Player created content. Other games does not shine there ("devs knows better"), hence - our chance. Community may offer quality ideas.

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