Ancient Rite of Passage

[David Bowman]

We just completed the review of the Ancient Rite of Passage (this is a walkthrough conducted by the primary designer for a review group of developers here). We will be releasing more information about this going forward, but I wanted to put out the requirements so you can begin discussing them.

Level 90 in either craft or adventure
100 days since creation
Adult Rite of Passage complete

We are all excited by what we've discussed today, and after we've done our next review we'll let you know more of the details.

David Bowman

[Firedragon]

100 days? Aint that a tad low? [:(]

[Vesuvius]

Aye I was hoping for a bit more than 100 days.

[Blue Hasia]

Thanks for the post david,
But I think the dragon players all agree that 100 days is very low. Over the past year I have talk to many dragons and all those thatI talked to have all thought the ARop proper time frame to be over 200 days. me my self I belive the dragons acount needs to be 1 year old. after allwe are to be considered ancient players....heck I could go for 2 years.

[Vesuvius]

Indeed, I think most dragon players would agree that the RL requirement should be 365days.

Otherwise we are going to see dragons powerleveled to ancient in 3 months, which, will be rather dissapointing.

The level requirement looks pretty good though and its good to hear that the AROP is progressing well.

Any hoard requirement?

Thanks for the update, as I forgot to mention that in my previous post.

[Varangaard]

The level req is good, if suprisingly high considering what you had set for adult RoP. Hundred days since creation on the other hand is too low. Double that would be far more preferable, if not full year (most preferabe). It might be hard to swallow to those that became adults two days after creation but it is not something that should be considered.

What's with the level requirement of 90 craft or adventure? Does that imply that the quest will branch, where one brach is for adventure skills exclusively, and the other branch for craft skills exclusively?

[Vesuvius]

In my opinion it should require both crafting/adventure at 90, following the same suit as the RoP.

Regardless, 365days should definitely be the time requirement.

[Firedragon]

Need lvl 90 to start it... though you probably need 90/90 to finish it. My guess atleast.

[imported_Lycaunoss]

100 days is too little time in my opinion.

How long till the next review? (sorry but someone had to ask[8-|])

[shemra]

*sighs* I thought being Ancient was going to be something that all Dragons breathed heavy after, and wich would demand alot of the Dragon...guess i was wrong.. [:'(]

Imho the reqs are a straight out Joke....

lvl 90 EITHER craft or adv?? Whats that? yeah sure, but then you need 100 in the other school....(in my book at least)

100 days since creation? whats that? I made 2 Dragon alts when i started, both are over 100 days....

One thing though...i hope the quest itself is hard as **** and please make it worth the while specially for the oldies that have worked their tails off for this.


-Ilinga

[Vesuvius]

Hopefully when David comes back to the thread they will make the requirements a bit steeper after seeing how people feel about it.

[Jaraiden]

Level 90 in either craft or adventure
100 days since creation
Adult Rite of Passage complete

We are all excited by what we've discussed today, and after we've done our next review we'll let you know more of the details.

David Bowman

How much IG playing time? There are many time related replies on other posts (that you have read, remember your words)to ensure players are not powered through adults and to Ancient. Dedication to your dragon character has to be a requirement.

100 days since creation is too low.

And, please, for the sake of an Ancient dragon's self respect, make it a dragon only series of quests. Again, there are many posts talking of bipeds powering hatchlings to adult requirements and through the "Become a True Helian/Lunus" series of quests. Certainly, a TRUE Helian or Lunus (and the dragon race)won't need the overpowering might of bipeds for their own advancement. After all, dragon aid is hardly needed for biped advancement past a rating of 100.

:: Looks forward to his posts on completing the dragon ability tasks to 100 and Dragon lair plots ::

[Blue Hasia]

I also agree on the subject that to become ancient dragons need to have acounts at least one year old

[imported_Frith-Rae]

Actually that really does'nt follow the original logic for the Adult RoP.

The STARTING point was 30/30 - but they originally had I guess "hoped" that it would take 50 in one OR the other for the dragon to finish *laughs a hearty one at how that reality turned out*.

But actually you don't need anything even to finish it - you need 35 craft for Lunus, and what..40 craft for Helian to finish it without buffs or craft scales. And just the 30 initial adventure rating doesn't change :).

Personally I'm totally fine with only 90 in ONE - as it DOES Follow the Adult ROP if it splits along the adventure/craft line - as the Adult RoP does the same thing (Or was intended too).

I think a 90 craft for a Lunus seems a bit extreme *shrugs* But then I hate crafting...

However, the 100 days (unless they mean playtime since creation possibly?) does seem a bit light. Considering that yes, it does mean you'll have 3 month + 10 day ancients being PLed.

But why should a Lunus be asked to level to 90 or 100 in craft? Why should a Helian be asked to do the same in Adventure? To *me* anyway, making both schools equivalnt just once again shoots down the idea of "diverging paths".

The Adult ROP has really no "diverging path" to speak of when you talk about rewards, really, except for the pretty breath - otherwise you really don't see much mechanical playing difference for most, choosing one or the other (and many who don't care about RP go Lunus so they don't have to craft the extra levels...)

If they are only requiring 90 in ONE for Ancient, then perhaps they really *ARE* going to diverge the paths this time...

or as another said, you'll get into the quest and realize "oh wait your other half really does have to be that high, it just doesn't have to be that high to start" just like the Adult RoP....

((actually aren't the adult starting requirements 30/20 and 20/30 - just to take the task - just people usually don't start until they are done with the requirements? Bah I can't remember)

[David Bowman]

There seems to be a misconception that just because someone can receive a quest means that they will be able to complete a quest. I've listed the requirements to receive the quest. I believe any Dragon attempting the Ancient Rite of Passage with ONLY the minimum requirements to receive the quest will die. But they will be able to see what they need to be able to overcome the challenge. (Parts of the quest are not accessible by bipeds, so biped assistance will not be available.)

I'm interested in discussion, that is why I posted here. I've heard that 100 days is too few for some of you. Some have even proposed specific numbers. Please share your reasoning behind any proposed time lengths so we can take that into account as we continue to develop the ARoP.

David

[Blue Hasia]

I have many resaons why i want it to be a year..or more.

1). The elder dragons that have been here since day one have been waiting to become Ancient now for very long. I belive we have stuck it through and waited for over a year now means that other new dragons should also wait like we have.

2.) One year also will show to other player when they see an ancient dragon it will tell other. Hey look at us we are Proud to be a dragon and we are elder players.

3). for RP resaons. the term ancient means Old and wise. anda 3 month old dragon is by no means ancient and wise they are still a young pup.

[Vesuvius]

There seems to be a misconception that just because someone can receive a quest means that they will be able to complete a quest. I've listed the requirements to receive the quest. I believe any Dragon attempting the Ancient Rite of Passage with ONLY the minimum requirements to receive the quest will die. But they will be able to see what they need to be able to overcome the challenge. (Parts of the quest are not accessible by bipeds, so biped assistance will not be available.)

I'm interested in discussion, that is why I posted here. I've heard that 100 days is too few for some of you. Some have even proposed specific numbers. Please share your reasoning behind any proposed time lengths so we can take that into account as we continue to develop the ARoP.

David

To the bolded, Great to hear! I for one am very pleased to see this.

As to why I feel the requirement should be 365days I agree 100% with what blue said.

1) Those of us who have been here from the beginning have waited over a year for this to come out. We have stuck through thick and thin, even dealing with horrible things such as hoard decay. It would be a slap in the face to these players to see an ancient made by a bored biped or a new player, powered up to get an ancient in under 4 months.

Having to stick with the game as a dragon for 365 days shows dedication. It also is a status symbol that other players can see when they see an ancient dragon, "Wow, that dragon has been here for over a year". The 365 days helps to give the ancient status that elder feel, something for other, younger, dragons to look up to.

2) By lore, ancient dragons are very old, and having 365days as a requirement is a nice mechanical way to represent this.

3) I suggest 365days because 1 year is a nice solid number. So far I havent seen any other dragons stand against this amount, especially those who have been here from the beginning.

4) It is fair to say that after making current dragon players wait a year due to the ARoP's non-existance, future dragons should have to show that same commitment to being a dragon and playing horizons.

Thanks for taking our thoughts into consideration.

[Jaraiden]

(Parts of the quest are not accessible by bipeds, so biped assistance will not be available.)

I hope many of the adventure parts are. Again, it comes down to dragon lore of a solitary race (and thus less biped dependence). Crafting parts, by definition, have minimal biped assistance (as in using a scaleforge to create the new phylactery).

I'm interested in discussion, that is why I posted here. I've heard that 100 days is too few for some of you. Some have even proposed specific numbers. Please share your reasoning behind any proposed time lengths so we can take that into account as we continue to develop the ARoP.

David

Time and knowledge. In fantasy literature a dragon knows alot about itself and the world. There is much to Istaria, like attuning to the pads (which could be a requirement), visiting the towers, and completing most (or all) of the ability tasks (please, not for Gold Rage though until hoard drop is increased).

100 days since creation allows for "sleeper" dragons and abuse by players. A dragon is created, leveled a bit, then sleeps (or is sleeping now waiting for Ancient RoP requirements). Then they awaken, get powered through to adulthood then to level 90.

180 days since creation may hinder the "sleepers" and allow for that "growth" dragons should have as they mature in Istaria. On the player side, it acknowledges the efforts of long term players in staying with Horizons.

I hope the other posters will look for their time related replies in old posts and update/repost them here.

[Larus-Fel]

i would go with the atleast 300+ char creation time due to it being before ROP came out when we had alot of issues in the beginning.. more or less the ones that lived through everything.. good and bad. acual play time should be imo atleast 50 days play time.. would make sense.. considering alot of my in game dragon friends are right around that average...

Hope you guys like that so far [:P]

[Vesuvius]

Indeed. Having some ingame played time in there would be nice too. If the Creation time was 365days, any dragon player that met the other requirements would certainly have around 50-60 ingame days.