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Thread: "Helping"?

  1. #1

    Default "Helping"?

    How much help is too much? At what point does 'helping' actually detract from a player's enjoyment, rather than enhancing it? Certainly it makes it easier, but easier isn't always better. People tend to appreciate things they've worked for more than they do things that are handed to them on a plate.

    Back when the game started, everything was much harder than it is now. Nobody had bulk items or resources stored away so that they could make things for others at a moments notice, there weren't lots of high level players who could get whatever you wanted in a few minutes - we each had to go out and find the things we needed for ourselves. We spent weeks sometimes hunting for comps, scouring connies for orbs and the few dyes that were available, then had to find someone who was able to make what we wanted and sometimes even had to supply the bricks or boards. But when we finally got our new item, it was worth it. We'd be so excited that we'd tell our friends about it and link the new item and they'd be really pleased for us too - it was a real accomplishment. Do you think new players today get that same feeling of excitement? Particularly those in guilds.

    My question, particularly to guilds, is how much help do you give members? Hand them everything they need at all levels? Lots of help at low levels and then they're on their own? What form does help take? Do you give them all the items they need, or give them the resources to make their own items? Do you supply certain items, but other items they have to get for themselves? Do they have to supply all resources and comps, but you'll make everything they need for them? Do you store everything they could ever need and they simply go through and take what they need, like a supermarket but it's all free?

    What about hoard? These days it's much easier to get than when we ('we' being really long term players) started. Tier 1 drops start at 100, and hoard req for level 1 is also 100 - that means with 1 drop a new hatchie is already at or above cap for his level. At level 10 the req is 1000. Remember how good you felt each time you reached the hoard cap for your level? If you "help" a hatchie by giving him just 2 T5 hoard items (which will be at least 24k) then you just met all his hoard reqs up til level 21 - how thrilled is he going to be with those T1 drops now? Did you really help him, or did you actually rob him of the pleasure of hitting all those hoard levels? Meanwhile, there are plenty of mid to high level dragons struggling to reach cap who'd really appreciate a few higher tier items.

    I've seen so many players come into the game in the last year, rave about how much they like it, level up, get everything they need, including a plot built, all done in a few months, due to all the 'help' they get and then they're gone. Sounds like all that "help" they got simply served to drive them out of the game.

    My guild has reached a point where we have just about everything in stock that a player needs at any level - even a lot of teched items that others have outgrown. Right now we're discussing what exactly we should keep on hand and what we should stop holding and let players find for themselves. I'd really appreciate input from others as to what your guild does, and how well you think your system works.

  2. #2

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    Well.. I had this nice long reply to your post all written up, but my login timed out... suffice it to say that I usually only "help" a player in the sense youve mentioned here up to the end of T1 gear/items (except tools). Especially if the item to be made is unteched. If the requested item is teched, I will usually require the requestor to provide all the components for the item, unless I just happen to have a Huge supply of the component. Unless the person is a long good standing guildie, I will not usually dig into my personal stash of components to provide them with what they "want" without working for it.

    To me, time honoured people that have provided me with things, deserve my return of the favor. New people have to earn their place beyond T1. Usually those people, at least in the guild, have the Senior guildmate tags in our guild, they have proven themselves to be a positive asset to the guild, with or without the nearly pointless guild point system.

    anyway, enough rambling...
    Elated that HZ is no longer in the hands of the Infidels.

    Now.. I may have to split my time between 2 games... CS:S and HZ...

  3. #3

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    Our guild has discussed this a bit too, a while back. We have techs, forms, comps and materials in storage. So how do we stop people from just getting bored and leaving because things are too easy?
    Our guild does a heavy screening before allowing new members. You have to prove you are not a leech, you work for what you want and play the game like it should be played.
    I will make basic items for people in the guild, I get requests to make new cargo or armour and I tell them you plan out the comps, get them and then I'll do it. There are those in our guild that do that all for people, and I dislike it very much, and try to get them to stop.

    I hope everyone steps back and let some of the babies cry a bit about not getting their toys this very second. Force them to plan ahead, and think about what they want instead of just the gimme attitude.

  4. #4

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    Quote Originally Posted by AA0
    I hope everyone steps back and let some of the babies cry a bit about not getting their toys this very second. Force them to plan ahead, and think about what they want instead of just the gimme attitude.
    Strongly agree with that one - and have to take an example of RL for all that is behind this issue.

    What car will a youngster estimate more - the one it got as a gift (from Parents, Grannies, ...) or the one it had to earn the money for with vacancy-jobs? Easy answer for me ...

  5. #5

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    I fell information about the game, where to go , what to make and game mechanics is about all I give out for free. If they want me to do more than that they will certainly need to make an enticing offer, not everything can come for free.

  6. #6

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    Rhyssa, here is what we have always done...

    Information and direction should always be free.

    And even though we store a variety of comps, everyone is expected to provide their own. What is stored if for emergency or to help those that are truly broke.

    Hand me downs are rarely used, since the teching is specific to the player and often not what others want.


    The general rule for us is, crafted items are free to guildies, but if you can make the item, do it yourself and don't ask others. It's totally fine to request items you cannot make due to lack of skill or being the wrong race to make it.

    The key IS knowing the members personality and temperment before they are made members. Screening of some sort must be done. If you find that you have too many freeloaders, then drop them as a learning experience for them, and explain what it will take to return to good graces.

    One thing that works well for us, is to openly explain expectations and responsibilites, and move ANYTHING you don't want pilfered into private storage.

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