Plot reclamations - would like clarification

[Justa Mirage]

I do believe in the original days, the items in storage got shoved into the owner's vault and over stuffed it.

When auctions happened before, the buildings on the properties were left in-tact.

Any property not bought during "auction" got a white flag attached to it and made it "for sale"

Novian farmers then ran around looking for white-flagged properties with structures and removed them for the novians.

Then the novian farmers would buy another from a player that wanted said structure on their plot for a few copper, and place the structure on their property, and sell it back to the original owner.

The easy fix for this pillaging is to limit the amount of time a player can purchase a property in the game, or as another suggestion, prevent players from instantly deconning the structures for a week, preventing them from pillaging.

Wiping the world and starting over with plots / lairs would just drive away the remainder of the players. I can see the look on Valtur's face now...

We're sorry, but your Tier 6 Grand Hall and all its contents have been turned into novians and put in your vault. Your guild domination of all "dragon lair communities" have been removed and put up for auction.

[Laneth]

I can't wait to her the devs take on how they want to do plot reclamation. i know that my opinion of wiping plots doesn't sit well with lots of people. but there is another aspect to also look at right now with the game. the economy. we really don't have an economy right now. cleaning off the plots would be one way of helping get the economy going again by opening up construction jobs for crafters. i agree that wiping the plots would be a big pain to the people buying it and the people that might be using the plot. and i do see your point in stating that it would be like the novian farmers but on a global scale. I think i would rather see a 30 day wait to buy a plot rather than to sell one. the sell thing could hurt a guild like mine that helps its members out by catching a plot or a lair opening up and buying it for them while they are offline. then once the person logs in either later in the day or the next day, it gets transfered to them. And your mention of the owned plots that don't have construction or shops, how many of those players still play? i know a lot of people that quit the game before they ever decided to do anything with thier plot.

ok, enough of my rambling, i work nights and need to finish painting the kitchen so i can go to bed

[Landowyn]

To whom it may concern:

Novian thieves? Novian farmers? Back when I could afford to have four subscriptions to this game I purchased several plots in outlying locations that contained completed or semi-completed structures that I required for the 3 plots I purchased in South Gate (Order). With an additional contribution from me, they turned into beginner and journeyman shops open to everyone in the realm, a consigner, vault and whatever other type of facility I could jam onto them. Three 75x75 plots completely full. And I never could have done it without pulling down some half-completed plots that no one owned or was likely to own in the near future.

Yet, by your definition, I'm a thief? May the withered aegis strike you down where you sit.

And by the way, after taking a significant hit in the salary department I had to get down to one plot/account, so I took my novians and left for a single, larger plot. Two of those three plots are now completely rebuilt and a third is "planned" but unfinished.

Life in the real world and in the MMO world changes. Get used to it.

[Arietna]

Landowyn - no, that sort of resource usage is not thievery. The sort people are referring to were the people who bought a plot, stripped it, sold it back to community, bought another plot, stripped it etc. and then sold the novians. Your is definitely NOT thievery ~ it's good building practice.

[Landowyn]

Other posters seem to make little distinction between the two. Anyway, it makes little difference. If the novians are used to build (and what else would they be used for?) then what right do we have to tell people what to do with their lawful purchases? They can't sell them, only build or destroy.

One person argued with me that they were selling the resources by taking ownership of the plot from the true owner, building up the plot for a price, and giving the plot back to the owner. What the heck. That's free enterprise, and they're still being used to build.

I had a lot of extras left over because I upgraded buildings. I was able to GIVE THEM AWAY by doing exactly the same thing. The rightful owner of the plot was delighted, to say the least.

People who call other people pirates, thieves and scavengers need to get off their high horses. If the plot that got "raided for novians" had an important building to you, then buy the plot and rebuild it. You can even go "raid for novians" another plot to do it. I don't care and I encourage you to make use of the opportunity.

Landowyn - no, that sort of resource usage is not thievery. The sort people are referring to were the people who bought a plot, stripped it, sold it back to community, bought another plot, stripped it etc. and then sold the novians. Your is definitely NOT thievery ~ it's good building practice.

[Hoberton]

To whom it may concern:

Novian thieves? Novian farmers? Back when I could afford to have four subscriptions to this game I purchased several plots in outlying locations that contained completed or semi-completed structures that I required for the 3 plots I purchased in South Gate (Order). With an additional contribution from me, they turned into beginner and journeyman shops open to everyone in the realm, a consigner, vault and whatever other type of facility I could jam onto them. Three 75x75 plots completely full. And I never could have done it without pulling down some half-completed plots that no one owned or was likely to own in the near future.

Never could have done it - hmmm - sounds like you just did not want to take the time to do it. Effort.

Yet, by your definition, I'm a thief? May the withered aegis strike you down where you sit.

Typical Liberal position. Attack the ones that points out your actions.

And by the way, after taking a significant hit in the salary department I had to get down to one plot/account, so I took my novians and left for a single, larger plot. Two of those three plots are now completely rebuilt and a third is "planned" but unfinished.

Life in the real world and in the MMO world changes. Get used to it.

What does your Salary in the Real World or anything else in the Real World have anything to do with a game.

Landowyn - no, that sort of resource usage is not thievery. The sort people are referring to were the people who bought a plot, stripped it, sold it back to community, bought another plot, stripped it etc. and then sold the novians. Your is definitely NOT thievery ~ it's good building practice.

First off you can not sell Novians and secondly buying a plot, stripping, selling it back to community is exactly what Landowyn is saying he did.

I am not attacking Landowyn. Just pointing out that changes need to be made before Plot reclaimation can take effect. No more stripping of the land for your own "Get to the Top" in the shortest amount of time.

*Now the atttacks will commence upon me*

[Katscratch]

I think that guild plots should go like this if the Key Plot owner is an active account any plots that are held by members who no longer pay should be Set to For Sale and all structures left intact with permissions unchanged so that active people in the guild can buy them.

If the owner of the Key Plot is no longer an active subscriber The Guild town should be reclaimed and all structures in that town should be destroyed except for any active subscribers who own plot in that town.

[Landowyn]

Pretty much loooked like an attack to me. And proud to be a liberal ...

Never could have done it - hmmm - sounds like you just did not want to take the time to do it. Effort.



Typical Liberal position. Attack the ones that points out your actions.



What does your Salary in the Real World or anything else in the Real World have anything to do with a game.



First off you can not sell Novians and secondly buying a plot, stripping, selling it back to community is exactly what Landowyn is saying he did.

I am not attacking Landowyn. Just pointing out that changes need to be made before Plot reclaimation can take effect. No more stripping of the land for your own "Get to the Top" in the shortest amount of time.

*Now the atttacks will commence upon me*

[Alladania]

Once someone buys a plot, it's theirs.

I started back to Horizons with the new ownership and bought a small plot from our guild property (which was quite a letdown after giving away my plot in Forest Guard a year ago). I sold my small plot back to the guild and was transferred a larger plot from a guildie not returning (this weekend). I promptly tore down a few things on my new plot and put in the confectioner shop and pottery wheel that I do need. I would have been pretty angry to lose my holiday weekend of getting MY new plot set up because of a 7 day limit on deconning. Or what if the guildie couldn't transfer the plot to me at all because I had to wait 15 days between selling the guild plot and buying another?

Yes, some people will buy a plot and do things with it that don't suit the community. It would be sad if that happened, but throwing on heavy-handed regulations that restrict everyone because someone might be a jerk isn't cool either.

[LaughingOtter]

When you buy a plot, it is yours to do with as you please. Of course some people will strip plots and use the novians elsewhere, but that is their right. If you see a plot for sale and don't want it to be lost to the community, buy it yourself or help someone else buy it.

With the population as it is, there are going to be many, many plots going up for sale. New players who need plots stand a good chance of getting one for a decent price, but there will not be enough players to buy all the plots being reclaimed. The ideas being suggested would not stop Novian harvesting, only slow it down a little while inconveniencing everyone else in the game.

Istaria is covered with deadwood and weeds from a year of neglect. Let the fires come. Cleanse the land. Make it new again, so that those yet to come to these shores may find their own places to call home. If there are those among the Gifted who do not wish to see their properties despoiled, all they have to do is stand up and pay a small fee to counted as citizens of the Empire again. Those that chose not to do so have no grounds for complaint.

[LexDivinia]

Once again, we have found another issue in which there is no happy place.

I believe that if there is a white flag on a property with unfinished structures, then I have every right to buy that property, decon, and sell it back to community.

That doesn't mean I am going to go out to Parsinia and decon the stone shop there just because there is a white flag on it. Granted, there are people that will, but so be it.

If the community needs a structure, then buy the plot, and protect it. My guildies and I felt that way about the Bind house in Bristugo (Chaos) and so we pooled our money and bought it. Anyone could have bought it and made it a freaking tree garden, but we bought it and made the T2 guildhouse a T1 in order to fit the connie and pawn, etc. Many of the resources used in getting it built were novians combined with the assistance of the community. The same goes for the plot directly behind it with four working shops.

Now, we can go round and round about how I used mine for the better of the community, and others are using them for their personal gain, but I also used a lot of novies on my personal plot. As will many others. And I also paid a lot of people to use their novies on my plot. And I would do it all again.

If it comes to be that something is put in place, by Vi, to keep this from happening or rules are set in motion that forbids this kind of action, then I will abide by it, until then I see this as an issue everyone will continue to disagree on.

[Landowyn]

I think it's just plain funny how some people feel they have the right to tell others what to do with their time, money and property.

[Justa Mirage]

I think it's just plain funny how some people feel they have the right to tell others what to do with their time, money and property.

This is because you didn't have what happened to a "LARGE GROUP" of people when it was first released that buildings could be deconstructed for novians.

I will argue until I am without fur... I "wanted" to buy the plot next to me, I "wanted" to preserve the vaultkeeper I helped build. and I "WANTED" a bigger plot without moving out of the community area I was in.

But... before I could even get home from work on the day of the patch that made it go live, everything on that plot (the vaultkeeper, tier 2 guild house, everything) had been removed from the property.

So don't level an argument you have no idea what "others" went through. Entire communities were stripped, not because they were going to "rebuild" such as you did, the exact quote (from the person that admitted to me for doing it) said "If our guild didn't remove the structures, some other guild would have... we were just quicker to your community. Removing unused buildings and unbuilt structures removes lag..."

So... the excuse is "removing lag is why we destroyed communities with usable buildings."

You CANNOT stand and tell me this didn't happen, because I was there, I got first hand information from the player that removed the items, that the only reason they were wiped, was to pad their guild coffers with Novians and then help others in their guilds get instant structures built.

Sorry, but you are sadly mistaken.

Edit: Lex.... the only "help" I got rebuilding was not by novians but hard working Istarians (Thanks again Hratli and Aamer and a few others for helping rebuild the Vaultkeeper) to resurrect it.

[Demantoid]

Well I am just glad some discussion is finally occuring about this issue!

[Hoberton]

I think it's just plain funny how some people feel they have the right to tell others what to do with their time, money and property.

A lot of people talk about this game having one of the most wonderful communities and I do not disagree with that. But with that said, what about the community and their needs. Two plots I remember that were removed just for the Novians. The plot on Fabric Island that had the Clothworking shop and the plot just across the bridge from the Maple trees which had a Journey Woodworking shop.

The person that removed those plots for just the Novians had only their self interests in mind and nothing for the community.

This is what I am talking about when someone can just run across the entire Istarian continent and Buy plots, strip it clean and move along to the next and do the same.

[LaughingOtter]

The person that removed those plots for just the Novians had only their self interests in mind and nothing for the community.

Then so be it. They spent the money for the plots, they own them, they can do as they wish.

There is nothing - not one single thing - that can be done to prevent this kind of Novian harvesting because that is what Novians were designed for. They are functioning as intended.

Again, if a critical building is lost, help someone buy the plot and help them rebuild. That is what makes this a community to be proud of.

[Landowyn]

The amazing thing is that folks that argue that people are depriving the community are also looking for something free: Buildings and property they haven't paid for. At least the Novian buyers take a 5% hit.

If the shop or building is important, and there's a white flag, buy it and replace those buildings. I'm sure your community will help.

[Vahrokh]

A lot of people talk about this game having one of the most wonderful communities and I do not disagree with that. But with that said, what about the community and their needs.

In WoW, you'd have people (possibly, gold sellers) map hack into your property *not during reclaimations* and deconstruct your stuff and then sell it for real life money. And have bots 24/7/365 up checking private connies for removing everything put for little as temp storage.

Anyway, what makes for a great community is not the tree that crashes noisily, but the silent forest growing around it.

[Veya]

Has there been any date mentioned of when plot reclamation will occur?

[Rayth]

Never been a fan of Novians as part of plot reclamation, or even keeping the structures, unless plot relclamation includes an auction system. You end up with camping on the best plots with the best structures.

It was bad enough when our guild did 75% of the work on the bridge that opened up Lorena (I think that's what it was) and we had to camp the plots we had opened up from the vultures that had nothing to do with it but had all day to stand there.

Either way, nothing they do is going to make everyone happy. In the long run I don't care, as long as the plots are taken back from abandoned accounts and given back to the community.

Having said that, I haven't been on the last 2 years, so my opinion likely means a lot less then some of the die hards.