Favoritism

[Landowyn]

Posted this elsewhere, but it got ignored. It does bother me.

It seems as if some plots are growing while others remain the same. I noticed this on a plot near mine, where the dimensions have grown from 100x100 (already quite large) to 120x104.

Why is this being done on plots already owned by players ... smacks a bit of favoritism. Mine, 3 plots over, remained the same. Oh, yeah. The plot that "GREW" is owned by a former intern at Tulga Games. Do I have to volunteer to work for free to get a bigger plot? Inquiring minds want to know.

No, it's not a number glitch. You can plainly see the increased size because the "brown" turf on the plot has expanded. by 20 meters.

I can see increasing the 22x22 plots and some of the other ones smaller than 40x40, but why does a former "employee" need a 120x104? A similar plot next to this former "employee's" plot also grew to 120x104. Not sure why.

[LaughingOtter]

As has been pointed out several times before, one of David's projects last year was resizing and enlarging plots when time & circumstance permitted. His motivation was simply to add value to the properties and enhance the gameplay of the individual owners.

The fact that one property belongs to a former TG intern does not, of itself, support a charge of favoritism. A great many other plots were also expanded and there's every reason to believe that David would have continued expanding plots, but for the sale to EI.

[Pharcellus]

1) David no longer works on the game, so anything he did or planned or whatever is mostly irrelevant now.
2) If this change happened recently, why no notice of it in patch notes? When it was done in the past, was it not included as part of the patch changes?
3) If the plot changes are recent (I admit I don't know, someone at Vi should speak up), were there any other plots changed as well? If so, where?

Appearance of Impropriety can be as bad, if not worse at times, than actual impropriety itself. While you say that there is insufficient reason to directly infer shenannigans, there is enough to at least be concerned enough about it to ask and get clarification.

[Kerech]

There were a bunch of plots changed on Genevia Island with the last patch. Maybe that's when this change was made.

[Deth]

Pharcellus what he may have ment was maybe DB last year started in that area and only did one plot. The work he did was pushed to blight with the entention of more such pushed to blight to finish that area, but due to the sales that stopped.

[LaughingOtter]

David's actions last year may or may not be irrelevant; regardless, it is a simple fact that he had been doing plot expansions at the time of and just prior to the sale.

It's quite possible that there were changes made to Genesis immediatly prior to the sale which were not recorded in any patch notes, and which only just recently went live along with everything else left unfinished when the Tulga staff was let go - which, from the sound of things, it did.

Appearance of impropriety is serious, yes, but looking at one fact without considering the greater context creates a false impression. The facts are that many, many other plots were changed, that it was an ongoing project that David made no secret of, and that the change happened when the last, unfinished Tulga delta finally went live. Those facts should be taken into account in order to fully consider the issue.

[Hal`cyon Sskyler]

Hopefully I can offer some perspective here, since I'm guessing you're talking about my plot in North Crystal.

David was behind most of the world editing in Horizons. It was something he enjoyed doing and took pride in showing off the system to visitors. If you remember it was David who placed all but the first 100 plots in-game and added just about every dragon lair. World building is one of the more powerful and enjoyable tools in Horizons that players never get to see and expanding a plot is a nice way to demonstrate what the tool can do.

Like LO said, often times when a player would visit the Tulga as a welcoming gesture he would show them how the world building tools work and eventually wind up at their plot on the internal shard, Genesis. If there was empty space around the plot border he would bump up the size a little bit and commit the changes. Also, if there was another plot of similar dimensions nearby he would increase that one as well.

The key point I want to mention is that this wasn't something he did solely for anyone who walked into his office. In his free time David would frequently visit communities with lots of open space and make some adjustments to increase the value of the land. This was done more or less across the entire isle of Genevia and should have came to live with the first post-EI patch. It was a gesture more towards new players and inspired by no particular individual.

The implications of how this applies to "favoritism" seems like a semantic argument to me. Once you meet David you pick up pretty quickly that he's a nice guy that genuinely wants to look after his employees. I wasn't on the payroll but I did take out a student loan to fly out for the Summer, and this was just one of his way of welcoming me in. I didn't need or ask for the extra plot space nor did I need it, and to be fair he did increase the neighboring plot to do what he could to keep things even in a reasonable amount of time. Given the time and the motivation (there are hundreds, maybe thousands of plots in Istaria) he probably would have continued to grow plot sizes.

The problem here is one of scope. David wanted to give myself and three strangers a free, unexpected bonus. Whether this is "evil" amounts to the same thing as giving anyone who visits your house a cupcake. Sure they enjoy the cupcake and appreciate the gesture, but it just isn't possible to be "fair" by then giving one to everyone who may have set foot in your house in the past, the neighbors' house, the mailman, the corner market twelve blocks down the road,etc. It's not that you don't want to, it's that you just don't have enough delicious frosting to go around.

(In the above example "delicious frosting" and "time" are interchangeable)

[Velea]

Glad that the question was answered, but this topic feels more appropriately on the "Rant" section, not a general one, so going to move it.

[Arietna]

The change in the Genevia plots were definitely only released last live patch. I personally bought a 22x22 plot (a "training plot building" exercise for my brother).. and saw it, overnight, expand to 52x46 or so.. In cedar's cove..

and we're not employees, nor anything close. In fact, he only just started playing :P

[Aaelefein]

Um....

The plot size 'increase' to me seems odd...120x104? If plots were being increased, and I find it hard to believe they'd start with a 100x100 plot instead of the 25x25's...the increase seems to be skewed. I would expect an even number for an increase.

That aside, considering the problems with lairs and plots going on right now...I would not be at all surprised if this apparant increase is just an offshoot of the plot/lair problem. I know for a fact that depending on when and where I check my plot window, it will vary from 100x100 to as much as 103x103...all depending on how long I've been logged in, how often I've looked at the plot window, and my location when I open the plot window.

Just something to take into consideration

[Steelclaw]

The plot size 'increase' to me seems odd...120x104?

That looks even to me!

[Hal`cyon Sskyler]

The plot size 'increase' to me seems odd...120x104? If plots were being increased, and I find it hard to believe they'd start with a 100x100 plot instead of the 25x25's...the increase seems to be skewed. I would expect an even number for an increase.

If I remember correctly, the plot was resized by manually moving one of the corners in increments of 4 meters. That's just what happened to fit given the location of both plots.

[Landowyn]

Why in the heck is this a rant! It's not a rant! At least it wasn't until now.... because now I am seriously ticked off. I can see increasing the size of a 20x20 plot, but there is absolutely no need to increase a 100x100 unless you're going to do it all over that dang mountain. And this is a recent change, because I have been checking the adjoining plot every time I log in to see if it is for sale or it's owner has changed. Just a few days (maybe a week or two) ago, it was 100x100 and grew up practically overnight. This is pure, unadulterated BS. Sure, resize the small ones, but don't mess with the large plots unless you're going to do it for everyone. I would KILL for an extra 80 square meters!

Edit: And by the way, what you have revealed Hal is the very description of favoritism. Whether it's for one person or for four, it's favoritism. When I was a GM in another game I would have been summarily fired for a stunt like that, and I don't care if it was the CEO or freaking *** himself who did it.

Edit2: Heh, it filtered the word G O D ?

[gopher65]

My plot has never been resized, but it never could be. Even if I were to go and kidnap Rick and try and force him to enlarge it he couldn't, cause there is no more space around it, so it is stuck the way it is. My plot is decently large already though, so I'm not concerned. But unfortunately many of the 23x23 and 25x25 and 30x30 plots are in the same boat. You just can't expand them unless you delete some other plots (which could be owned, so you can't do that). Hopefully the plots that can be expanded will be expanded though.

I was in... what'sitcalled.... the Valley of Repose(?) the other day and I saw that there were numerous small plots around with large amounts of space around them. I hope those ones eventually get bumped up. That would be a pretty decent location if the plots were bigger.

[Steele]

Cupcake envy truly is a horrible thing...

This thread needs more frosting.

[Landowyn]

Cupcake envy truly is a horrible thing...

This thread needs more frosting.

No, it needs more frothing...

[Hal`cyon Sskyler]

Edit: And by the way, what you have revealed Hal is the very description of favoritism. Whether it's for one person or for four, it's favoritism. When I was a GM in another game I would have been summarily fired for a stunt like that, and I don't care if it was the CEO or freaking *** himself who did it.

I don't usually break out the "d" word here, but seriously, dude, calm down. I flew across the country on my own time to work for free when everything was about to melt down with EI and got something that in no way unfairly balances the game for other people. Favoritism implies I got something for nothing just because David liked me. If anything I got it for dedicating a month of my time helping out the game and doing things like fixing the crystals and helping out with confectioner among other stuff.

[Pharcellus]

In general, it is a bad idea to change something in-game to reflect an out-of-game situation. It is akin to metagaming, and can be a very bad thing when done by game developers/staff/gamemasters/etc.

What, with things like the BoB fiasco in EvE Online, players are very sensitive to impropriety by developers towards other players within the context of the game.

Some time ago, I headed up the staff at another MMOG. Staff were held to very strict standards, and I made it verboten for the other admins to take out capital ships for stupid things like "impressing the newbs". I had one admin not heed the rule, and he got reprimanded for it. He didn't try to unbalance the game, but a rule is a rule, and there was a very good reason for its existence.

In this situation, the more appropriate course of action would have been to compensate you out-of-game in some way. Buy you lunch for the month; take you around to see the local sights, free subscription, whatever. "Compensating" you with in-game privilege and consideration was probably not the best idea. Even if he was doing areas anyway, it should have been part of a more general plan and not focused specifically towards you. The fact that he did so reinforces the appearance of impropriety, giving it legs.

Personally (and I don't expect you or anyone else to hold to this standard; it's just the way I would have handled it), I would have politely declined the offer, not to be ungrateful, but to be fair towards everyone else playing the game.

[Creme]

Why in the heck is this a rant! It's not a rant! At least it wasn't until now....

Sorry, had to laugh because until I got to the last sentence, I was thinking "it is now". Maybe the mods are psychic

Anyway, Pharcellus made an excellent post.

This is a new ownership however (as it sounds like those changed had already been made to the genesis), so I'd suggest that as long as changes are made as equitably as possible to prevent any such appearance of favoritism, things are good.

[Kitimandiri]

It's all a plot I tell you! A BIG HUGE PLOT! *shifty eyes* >_>