Deconstruction at Reclaimation

[Galdethriel]

Heya, this is sort of a half-suggestion half-question.

I recently returned for a visit, as I've probably told everyone who happens to walk past and/or spend anything over 2 seconds in my presence. XD

Now I resubbed with a Gifted subscription to see if I could prolong the life of my lair, which didn't work because it had been reclaimed, yadda yadda. Now, I'm not so bothered about it being deconstructed and stuff. But I heard that the novians you get back are at 70%.

If that is the case, why not 100%? I mean, exclusively for reclaimed plots;you deconstruct them yourself and you get 70% back, but when plots are reclaimed I really think you should get 100%.

I've seen people kinda muse about coming back and a big problem is when they say, 'Oh, my lair's gone... it's just not worth it.' I'm pretty sure if you got 100% back it would be much easier... because you could just rebuild the same lair, no bother, and get back to playing.

As it is it just seems to be harsh for the sake of being harsh. Having a deconned lair or plot and losing that big chunk of work on it isn't exactly encouraging. Why's it like that, if that is the case?

~Galde

[Sigi]

The reclaiming of plots is very up to date now. So picture this. You are playing and have a build plot or lair. You want to move. If you do it yourself you get 70% novian.
If you let your sub go, your plot gets reclaimed and in your proposal you get 100%. You resub, move and build your new plot with your 100%.
I think it would be great to get 100% but then in both situations.

[Galdethriel]

Ah, that's a really good point I completely missed. D:

Well then, as you said, why not 100% in all situations? It's you who's done the work anyway, and it's not like you get XP for reapplying novians. :/

[LOVWYRM]

my vote for this!

[awdz]

I think currently it's 80% if you deconstruct, 70% for reclaim.
I'm in favor of leaving it as is, or maybe increasing the % some but keeping the reclaim amount less than the deconstruct amount - moving is expensive, and there should be incentive to keep your subscription up, IMO. At least you get to keep the majority of your work.

[Galdethriel]

I'm in favor of leaving it as is, or maybe increasing the % some but keeping the reclaim amount less than the deconstruct amount - moving is expensive, and there should be incentive to keep your subscription up, IMO. At least you get to keep the majority of your work.

I understand that concept, but sometimes when people go they'll go, and having a huge chunk of your work snatched away isn't exactly an incentive to come back either :/

Sometimes people have to leave. They don't have to come back. :/

[SwordMage]

Probably, now that you can't apply the Novian resources to another's plot/lair, there is less excuse to loose 30% on reclaimation.

[Shian]

I understand that concept, but sometimes when people go they'll go, and having a huge chunk of your work snatched away isn't exactly an incentive to come back either :/

Sometimes people have to leave. They don't have to come back. :/

This.
Yes, I see where it can be misused by a person letting their sub lapse, but in order to do that, you'd have to wait three months(?) for it to get reclaimed. Not very convenient and sometimes the benefits outweigh the potential for misuse. I'd love to give some of my friends more incentive to come back.

[Dracaena]

I did not realize you got fewer novians back if the plot was reclaimed. But it seems to me if someone had to drop the account for real life reasons they would come in and decon their plot to ensure they didn't lose anything from storage and things were ready if they are able to return in the future.

80% return isn't that horrible. I just relocated both lair and biped plot to different locations and the move gave me a chance to improve my designs. Yes it was a bit of a bother to get that t4 hall from the 60% complete to the 80% complete it was in the old location but that was partly due to me upgrading a couple other lair rooms as well.

And just fyi, novians still get traded. People just swap the properties to apply them.


Dracaena

[Galdethriel]

But it seems to me if someone had to drop the account for real life reasons they would come in and decon their plot to ensure they didn't lose anything from storage and things were ready if they are able to return in the future.

Yes but why should they lose any percentage of their work? Deconning it themselves, having the devs do it... I really don't see the point in slapping a penalty on that. When you're crafting and deconstructing things like scales, which will give you XP every time, it's understandable. You don't want people to just gather one load and level on it forever.

But novians give you nothing back besides the ability to move things about. And I don't see how having the ability to move things you own about without a penalty is problematic for the game. They're just rooms and buildings, and they're your rooms and buildings.

Unless they're worried people are going to come along every morning, construct the machines they're using for the day, use them and then deconstruct them for bedtime...

Maybe deconning would start by giving you 100% back the first two or three times, and then begin to put a penalty on after that? I dunno how that would work.

Then again, I dunno why people would construct and deconstruct machines and stuff over and over anyway, unless they were just trying to be selfish or... something D:

Why do I get the odd feeling I've argued against myself in this post? XD

[Smaug]

I think novians should be 100% and allowed to be placed anywhere. Now that plots get wiped when reclaimed theres no more novian farming the old way.

Would be a great way to boost economy, allow me to build a shop on MY plot/lair, then decon it and sell to someone by applying the novians to there plot/lair. Be specially nice for those far away locations where dragging recourses is a real pain to build. Could build at home and deliver in one trip when deconned.

Smaug

[Velea]

You should not be getting a lesser percentage of novians returned if your plot is automatically reclaimed than if it was deconstructed by you. In all honesty we did consider it because if your plot is automatically reclaimed, it means you stopped your subscription without taking in to consideration your plot, but we decided that we wanted to give players who did leave for whatever reason the incentive to return, so left it as if they had deconstructed themselves before leaving. We didn't want to seem as if we were "punishing" someone for abandoning their plot.

[Frith-Rae]

Heh, and I thought both were at 80%

Though I'm in agreement with Glad and a few others here, I've always thought that you should get 100% back. You built it the first time, why should you lose your work because you changed your mind or had to take a break? Because no, every person I know who left the game and lost a plot that's one of the big reasons they give for not coming back - they have none of their "work" to come back to without having to grind more to finish it a 2nd time.

If it returned at 100% they'd feel actually rewarded for coming back. Its not an incentive to re-build 20-30% of something you felt was at least a little bit grindy the first time. Its an incentive to go "well I didn't lose anything so I"ll just pay for a month and see how it goes."

Most other games I'm aware of with real estate allow for this (you just pick up where you left off by paying a fee or something, but you don't lose the stuff you put into the house/apartment/whatever). Yes you may lose the exact "plot" or "apartment" you were in but you can repurchase whatever and all your "Stuff" is still there - not 70% or 80% of it. All of it.

I know I've quit games after I felt bored of the grind. Whenever I've gone back to resub I've done it because I can pick right back up where I left off. If I lost my experience or my money while I was gone - I would not return.

I know that if for some reason my account here lapsed and I lost my plot; I would never return. If I got hacked in WoW and my stuff and gold of 6+years was gone, I would not resub and play again. If I got back 70% of my stuff, I would not resub.

Its something people use as a reason NOT to come back; I've never heard "oh I want to come back and rebuild 30% of what I already did and got bored of a quit in the first place!"

[Nambroth]

All of what I will say, I say in the best interest of players and company alike. It is not meant to argue or be rude, but add input and hopefully help in some small way.

Yeah-- I'll sign this. I understand that there's a chance for it to be taken advantage of, but quite honestly it's a lot of hassle for little reward to take advantage of ("Mwahaha, if I cancel my sub for three months+ and then come back I can move house without getting a deconstruction penalty!!" ... That's sort of a pain in the rump even for someone devious, don't you think? O_o ).

Honestly I have seen this complaint (of needing to rebuild, even in part) from players wanting to return quite a bit.

I guess you guys over at VI will need to analyze which loses (or gains) you more subs:

1. Keep the recon-penalty to keep people from canceling in the first place. People that hang onto a sub that they might cancel just to hold onto their plot/lair. These type of people hang onto it because they don't want to lose it because they probably intend to keep playing, right? Why struggle to pay the extra (or at all) for a sub to keep your land if you don't intent to continue playing at some point?

2. No recon-penalty to entice players that are considering returning to subscribe again. Life comes up, some of the younger players are entering the working world or getting shipped off to Basic, the economy isn't real pretty right now. Sometimes letting a sub run out isn't a choice so much as a necessity. If a player is considering returning and paying money into the game, the knowledge of needing to either rebuild, in part, can be a big drag and isn't the best incentive. Rewards work better than punishment when trying to get paying players back...

In all honesty we did consider it because if your plot is automatically reclaimed, it means you stopped your subscription without taking in to consideration your plot, but we decided that we wanted to give players who did leave for whatever reason the incentive to return, so left it as if they had deconstructed themselves before leaving. We didn't want to seem as if we were "punishing" someone for abandoning their plot.

I am not at all trying to argue, but I am not sure if this is a fair way to look at it; Most players that stop their subs, I'll wager, do very much take into consideration what it means for their plot. For many, especially lately, this has been a very hard decision to make and it can come down to good priorities; Pay rent or play a game? Of course necessity should come before luxury and with any hope players will take care of their housing need and financial responsibilities first. Not at all that I am suggesting that VI somehow coddle players that have other financial responsibilities that come first! All I am suggesting is that as a seller of a luxury item, it is good business sense to create incentive and reward for those that would be repeat customers.

I am a current paying player, and though I am only one voice, I do feel punished if I come back and have to re-build my home, even if only 30%... 30% can be a lot of work when it comes to a large finished lair that had all structures built..! Yes, it is less work than 100%, but it can be enough for me to not re-sub (or re-sub at a lesser rate) if I need to leave.

[Shian]

You know, it always puzzled me as to why there were so many built plots, yet only a handful of finished lairs.
Might just be my server, but by flying around, I often see lairs that are purchased, maybe a few things planned but nothing built in them or only one corridor finished. I think I counted once back in 2008 and I came up with the number of seven.

Seven finished lairs on the whole server on a game where a good number of the populace is dragon.

The truth of the matter is, Lairs take years to build whether one is a 'slow crafter' or a 'quick crafter'.
Plots can be finished in the matter of a week or two just because the resource requirement is far lower.

30% of a year.. to rebuild something you already built once? If I let all of my subs go, (entirely possible as SO's employers haven't paid him in 46 days,) I know I wouldn't come back.
I have 3 lairs. That's an extra year of non stop crafting just to get back to what I had. We've already seen on these forums, people that come back, see they have lost their lair and promptly leave again.

IMO, the only penalty of letting your sub lapse should be having to find a good location again.

[Kerech]

The truth of the matter is, Lairs take years to build whether one is a 'slow crafter' or a 'quick crafter'.
Plots can be finished in the matter of a week or two just because the resource requirement is far lower.

There's also the fact that plots can be built "all at once". I can go into fitter school and then grind out joints/sheets for every structure on my plot all at the same time, and apply them to all the structures that need them.

Lairs you can't do that. Yeah, there used to be a way (maybe still is) to apply stuff to chambers you were standing over vertically, but it's confusing and prone to make connectivity problems in your lair from what I remember.

So to build the lair you have to work multiple resources, multiple times (for each chamber).

I never understood the loss of novians when deconstructing. If I have a structure that I've put all the time and effort into building, or paid good gold to have someone build for me, and I tear it down, I should get those novians (all of them) to use again later.

I'm sure there was a reason for it when the system was put in place, but would it be possible to change it?