Rant About RP.

[Shian]

To me, RP is only good if you have OOC communication so you are both on the same page.

Ssilmath has been happy to send me tells when I can't figure out a word or two. RP is about what the character is doing. I'm perfectly happy to RP the fact that Ricar doesn't understand those words even if I do.

The point is, it's supposed to be my decision whether or not my character can understand him or not. Nothing is more frustrating than having to RP something on a character because the player is also in the dark. Sephiranoth ended up on my ignore list early on because he was just impossible to communicate with.

I believe it was Dharsi, one of the evil dragons early on in Shian's RP history that was one of the most fun to play with because we actually talked to each other as players to make sure we were on the same page and didn't step on each other's toes as players while our characters threw insults at each other.

This is also another issue to me- Without this type of communication it would have been way too easy to take this stuff seriously and end up with hurt feelings as players.

The downside of this is I ended up in scripted RP more than I wanted, but it was a necessary thing, especially when it came down to mate choices and all that

[Chioxin]

I believe it was Dharsi, one of the evil dragons early on in Shian's RP history that was one of the most fun to play with because we actually talked to each other as players to make sure we were on the same page and didn't step on each other's toes as players while our characters threw insults at each other.

This is also another issue to me- Without this type of communication it would have been way too easy to take this stuff seriously and end up with hurt feelings as players.

The downside of this is I ended up in scripted RP more than I wanted, but it was a necessary thing, especially when it came down to mate choices and all that

I find this very important, which is kinda why I stay away from public channels. I prefer interacting with the people I'm RP'ing with as well as the RP'ing =) Usually though, you gotta start somewhere, and that's often a channel!

Chio just isn't as serious as he should be in a channel.

Doesn't need to be scripted though! But I know what you mean. Often people get mad at me because I'd like to discuss a little bit about the scene before diving into something... But it's honestly just to give it a setting, time, and place. It's not to script the outcomes and going ons. I just need my bearings is all.

[Xepher]

I agree with you 100%, Shian. OOC communication is not only necessary in many cases, but also in itself something to enjoy. I like getting to know the player behind the character I'm interacting with, and have made many long-standing friends as a result.

[Frith-Rae]

oh absolutely Shian and Chio and Xepher.

Good, quality RP I feel REQUIRES some type of OOC discussion going on between players. It doesnt mean "scripted", most of my RP is not "scripted" at all but absolutely I keep up OOC communication in order to make sure everyone is ont he same page and understands what all is going on.

I RP across forum posts and games and regular OOC communication between players keeps things going smoothly. Doesnt mean you are telling everyone what the plan is or what you are going to do and say, it just keeps everyone on the same page AND helps SO MUCH in defining that line between IC and OOC mentalities.

I find whe soeone is open to OOC comments back and forth there is much less drama around IC comments and attitudes being taken personally and OOC. The person sees yoou interaccting with them outside of RP in a friendly and joking and generally accepting manner then its much easiser to IC RP Conflict and anger and intercharacter drama WITHOUT that person also taking it personally.

RP without OOC interaction to me would never get beyond the superificial because all the deeper emotions would run too mmuch f a risk of being misinterpreted.

But that doesnt mean scripted because I specifically go to lengths to make sure that the other person is NOT telling me too mucha bout what they have in mind or what plot they want to unfold and I specifically do NOT answer direct questions about how my charater would fee or react to anything because, as I always say, "well lets RP and find out!"

I don't like knowing too much about what is going to go on around my charactger (background ooc wise) because I prefer the more natural reaction of reacting to events as they happen rather than thinking about them before hand. So I always in any OOC discussion make it clear that I dont need to know those details.

And OOC keeps it fun and lighthearted even if IC RP is all deep and serious *grr* .

Also I would like to..suggest at this point..can we stop pointing out Seph or anyone else specifically?? That will get this thread locked and I think some of this discussion is very important. Talkinga bout the RP habits of soeonewho is not here to defend nor correct for misinformation - is really making me very uncomfortable.

So..lets stop wtih the finger pointing or naming or anything. That person is not here and its not a fair discussion nor is it necessary to the overall points about RP.

Please? Before we get locked?

[Chioxin]

I really want a place where I can just go, and chat like my character should about the world I'm playing in. Something I was trying to do on my return was just talking about random things I actually did in game that day! ... nothing really came of it. I shall have to go push myself back into a few channels and try again.

[Though I am getting really tired of the families stuff. I swear everyone and their mother is the daughter of another and eventually a daughter of their own daughter. SO SILLY! Family has no meaning.]

[LungTien Temeraire]

I second what you said, Frith-Rae, OoC is imoortant to RP. While those who don't RP would have no issue with ones who takes everything IC, RPers who use both IC and OoC would have issues to communicate. And it isn't bad for RPers to discuss OoC if they want.

That said, I also agree with your last paragraphs. And if Sephiranoth wants to be only IC, it is his choice and only his. If suggestions to him can't convince him to adopt OoC sometimes, I have already said what was the only solution in such case before, for those who don't enjoy IC only talking, and I won't repeat myself.

[Though I am getting really tired of the families stuff. I swear everyone and their mother is the daughter of another and eventually a daughter of their own daughter. SO SILLY! Family has no meaning.]

Could you put in a link in which lore precisely says families don't matter in Istaria's universe, for dragons and maybe some other races?

I personally don't see families' stuff as silly, and seeing a good amount of people have IC families for their characters, I doubt they see it this way.

[Chioxin]

You mis-read what I was saying LungTien. Families are not silly inherently. The "Degree" family has gone to within Istaria amongst it's players... I think is a touch on the insane =P To the point of incest. =P

I think I had a hoot when I was watching a dragon try to court another dragon and suddenly they found out that the dragon was their brother, and then THAT had to be cleared up that they weren't /really/ brothers by blood. And that's just the "simple" mishap! There's ones where you're technically the nephew of yourself as the tree made a loop!!!! How'd that happen!?

[EDIT: Note in both cases above, I talked OOC'ly with these people and they thought it was silly too! We had a good chat about it. Fun times.]

[LungTien Temeraire]

Ah, I see... while such private family stuff can be RPed, I have also seen some insanely twisted/melted family links, through blood relative and adoptions.

[Chioxin]

Just out of curiosity, and I bring this up because I saw a "Dev" say it...

Lore wise dragons are genderless, that was totally a Player made up thing. Amon stated that dragons were genderless, I thought!

sooooooooooo

*Turns into a hatchling with BIG BABY EYES* "Where do hatchlings come from????" *BIG EVIL GRIN!*

Ya, so, jabbing at the lore there. I don't think dragons really have families do they? Or maybe they're just Asexual... Or... Someone mentioned when they die they are just reborn? I dunno. Is there lore on this at all? The only "SOLID" lore we have is... that dragons do not have gender in Istaria.... it was just a player made up thing. Just like Sslik! Sslik's are its too!

[Vaz]

Long ago, developers of Istaria intended dragons to be genderless. But it was not accepted by the players (I recently read somewhere), so the developers soon gave up on that and declared dragons to have male and female genders. Dragon gender has been canonical for quite a few years now. Here is an example.

I wouldn't have minded playing a genderless dragon, but now that is against the lore except in cases of mutation (as far as physical gender goes).

[Xepher]

I for one definitely feel that players should do a bit of research before having their hatchling adopted, and likewise those seeking to adopt should do so sparingly. Kind of wish I had way back when, since Xeffer now seems to be related to half the population in some crazy way or another :x

There is also evidence that Slee is his own uncle! Now THAT is messed up.

[LungTien Temeraire]

There is also, in game, on some sentences said by dragon NPCs, or related to them, in quest logs,... some occasions where we can see 'he' or 'she'. That is how I learned Althanas the Great, purple dragon near Chiconis with pitbull head, was a 'she'.

[Shian]

I have a list of those if anyone wants it.

[Dhalin]

I think the reason why players balked at genderless dragons, is because gender is such a good portion of how an intelligent being (humans are the only known intelligent beings and there's very strong evidence that gender very well does affect how personality develops) acts, how their personality forms, etc.

A gendered person trying to play a non-gendered intelligent being might seem a bit difficult, not to mention, just plain weird. That and genderless dragons removes the possibility of playing relationships, whether it is a mated pair, or a parent+child (mother/child, father/child) or even brother/sister roleplay.

None of this is possible if dragons were truly genderless.

It just seems so... weird... to even imagine how to play a genderless but living creature that's intelligent.

I think the only reason the devs intended for dragons be genderless was just purely to make programming and implementing them easier; I still think that they should add gender in-game, even if it is -just- in the stats. That way when I see a "questionable" name in-game, I could at least do a search on them and know what gender they are, before I make a gaffe like calling a female "he" or a male "she", much like that one famous dragon who wrote that dragon quest guide who's name I cannot remember. Supposedly a male, but had a female-sounding name IIRC.

[Chioxin]

*SNIP*

On second thought! I don't think this is a can of worms I want to open! I agree its harder to play genderless. I don't agree you need mates, whoopy, and eggs to have interesting characters and relationships! That simple!

[Dhalin]

*SNIP*

On second thought! I don't think this is a can of worms I want to open! I agree its harder to play genderless. I don't agree you need mates, whoopy, and eggs to have interesting characters and relationships! That simple!

Nothing in my post should have been taken in the wrong way. I should have added that as an edit.

One doesn't need "whoopy" to have a loving (in a family way) relationship, and/or a relationship involving parents/children and family in general. My main point was that it is easier to play mother or father to a child if all involved have a gender. Otherwise, I'd think it'd feel more like, I don't know, a boss instead of a parent when there's no gender. That, and for the parents, having a son or a daughter would affect the way the parent acts towards the child, right? Well if the child has no gender... errr... okay do you treat it like a little boy or a little girl? Or neither? I think that'd be weird.

Nothing in either of my posts was meant to be taken towards the "whoopy" angle. That's not what I meant in the slightest. Now if players want to do that, well. They better keep it private, and not let anyone see it. There's lots of minors playing this game and they don't need to see that. Otherwise, what they do in private is none of my (or anyone else's for that matter) business.

[Chioxin]

No no, wasn't taking anything the wrong way =) Honest. And whoopy wasn't even the focus at all either of my little "blah" about it all.

[Dhalin]

No no, wasn't taking anything the wrong way =) Honest. And whoopy wasn't even the focus at all either of my little "blah" about it all.

*nods* Fair enough, back to the topic!

[LOVWYRM]

(concerning some that is said here- NOT all: I finally know, why the elves left middle-earth )

[LungTien Temeraire]

No, family and mates aren't required to have interesting characters but it can still be interesting with them
I think the matter is more that, perhaps, a bit too many people adopt sons, siblings, parents,... while they could be friends or even see about making them blood related. In these case research and discussions can be good.