Talk to the Team: Dragon Schools

[Cooolios]

Is it me or has everyone forgotten that we have a blight test server that we can test to see what we like and what we don't like?? As a past programmer I like experimenting and experimenting can lead to see interesting revelations on what works and what does not.

For new school suggestions. I think it would depend on how many schools you are wishing/willing to make. Technically you have 2 as is currently. Helian and Lunus. Magic and Melee (in regards to buffs/abilities gained) which face, it are part of what differentiates most bipedal school anyway.

I like Amon's idea. To me it is reminiscent of school forget quest for bipeds. It works. Depending on how many schools I have a few ideas.

Ex 1 - 3 schools. Melee, Balanced, and Magic. Bipedal equivalents would probably be Bezerker, Reaver, and Spiritist. Each could be specialized. I use Bezerker as a reference because there are currently not many options to compare a dragon to without suggesting another idea. Warrior is to general to use and dragons clearly don't have as many weapon skills to choose from. Same applies to Spiritist.

Ex 2 - 5 Schools. Caster(Primalist), Healer, Tank, Breather, DPS. Equivalent ideas would probably be Mage, Healer, Bloodmage/Warrior/Cleric (because a tank doesn't have to be melee in this game), KNOC/CHSW/BTMG would be close to the idea of a Breather imo, and a Bezerker/Sorc.

Ex 3 - is probably my favorite idea because well I just don't know heh. Read on!!! Caster - Healer - Melee - Balanced(Jack of All, master of none) Each is specialized highly and masterable abilities exist in each that carry over only to supplement minorly the other classes. Perfect example is the Mystic schools for peds. Guardian/druid/spiritist/bloodmage/reaver/shaman/healer/cleric/storm D.

I know that we need to keep these different from biped schools in terms of how they do it but it doesn't necessarily mean we can't mimic what they do to some extent. I'd love to see khutit form used as a requirement or boon for a class O.O :D

BUT WE HAS BLIGHT SERVERS TO TEST SO LETS MAKE BABY IDEAS!!!

[Calyndrell]

Is it me or has everyone forgotten that we have a blight test server that we can test to see what we like and what we don't like?? As a past programmer I like experimenting and experimenting can lead to see interesting revelations on what works and what does not.

Nope I don't think we have forgotten this but the problem is by the time an idea is ready for blight Amon and the other devs will have already dedicated many, many hours into a project. I think the whole point of this is for the devs to get an Idea of what we want so they know where to focus their attention. and not waste too many hours on something we hate.

But ok heres my ideas for what schools.. the idea I have for names I am purposely staying away from Lunus and Helian.

Firstly we have the three melee classes.
Drulkars Warriors... Warrior/dps... Focusing mainly on melee DPS less on defense .
Drulkars Guardians... Tanks... we know what tanks are but I was wondering weather or not it was possible to have abilities that FORCE monsters to attack them for a limited time.
Drulkars Chosen... essentially monk melee dragons.

then we have the spell casters...

Guardians of the Sleeper... Mage DPS.
Child of the Sleeper... Crowd control mages.
Followers of the sleeper... Healers.

And finally we have the hybrid class.. although for this it could be the normal DRAG school.

Now none of these ideas are exactly new and the names are just off the bat but I do think its important that we don't make it sound like "Helians are mages" and "lunus are warriors" people seem to rail against this idea alot thus why I chose Drulkar and the sleeper.

[LOVWYRM]

I fear I do not understand what is going on here.

Dragon schools like Cooolios suggested?
Winged bipeds?
Dragon healers, sorcerers mages aso??

Considering we already have too few bipeds.- and too few who want to take the hard way up to master all schools--
do you think that will motivate folks to play a biped?
Or do we want a dragon world? Bipeds crafter only?

I still do not get the intention behind all that.
Keeping dragon players busy for a longer time??

We all agree on the fact that Helian/magic user need MORE love.
But besides that-
Dragons are already tanks- are already multi tasking if they play hybride, they can heal themselfs and groiup members well enough.
They use areas and bolts...they are strong enough for the challenges of the game.
If they are well trained and balanced. If they have different scale sets and some other features.
So-WHY??

Amon- you wanted suggestions- and complain you did not get-
Steelclaw and Racktor made good suggestions too you did not comment.
What to you think about their ideas?

[LOVWYRM]

Had a talk with the tech team and here's a potential option. We could provide a way for existing Dragons to choose (as an option, not a requirement) to "convert" their existing characters to the new system. This process would simply remove whatever quested abilities we removed as part of the change and set your school to the first tier of the new system at equal level. So, if you were level 100 Dragon Adventurer you would become a level 100 Juvenile. Note, that is the proposed school name, not the race. So you'd still be an Ancient Dragon as far as race. This would let you keep your character, equipment, etc while converting to use the new school system.

Neither Lov nor Luna or Flame want to suffer from amnesia.
We have a saying here: We have the choice between plague and cholera^^

[Calyndrell]

Neither Lov nor Luna or Flame want to suffer from amnesia.
We have a saying here: We have the choice between plague and cholera^^

Luna, whilst i am not fond of the idea of losing my old abilities I understand if we want anything added to dragons we need to be prepared to lose a little of what we already have. Personally i would prefer to see the abilities weakened but still usable even if its only for nostalgia. perhaps once the new classes go in rename the current Gold rage as "Rage of the elder" and allow it only to be used every 5 mins. This way it wouldn't be so uber but yes its still there.

(without making this sound like its biped vs Dragon) DRAG as it stands is already far stronger than any single class and its more flexible than any single class.. If we want to be able to expand into multiple classes it needs to lose just a little because whilst the DRAG game isn't the same as a biped game we do hunt together and no one wants bipeds to be utterly overwhelmed. (even if the idea of dragons utterly overwhelming bipeds does sound fun)

What I am trying to say is the Devs need to ensure there is balance.. just remember whenever we multiclass we lose some of what we had... I like to think of it as "Taking one step back to take two steps forward" that is afterall how multiclassing works.

Winged bipeds?

I still do not get the intention behind all that.
Keeping dragon players busy for a longer time??

Not sure where the winged bipeds came from not seen that mentioned anywhere in this thread.

But as for keeping dragons busy in this game for longer.. HELL Yes thats enough of a reason for me to want it.. Aurakvoar doesn't come out except for the odd hunt because I don't really have anything I really want to do left with him.

[AmonGwareth]

We all agree on the fact that Helian/magic user need MORE love.
But besides that-
Dragons are already tanks- are already multi tasking if they play hybride, they can heal themselfs and groiup members well enough.
They use areas and bolts...they are strong enough for the challenges of the game.
If they are well trained and balanced. If they have different scale sets and some other features.
So-WHY??

They can do these things, yes, but not well and certainly not as focused as bipeds in specific schools. There have been lots and lots of requests, complaints, and suggestions over the years asking for more focus on healing, or spellcasting, or crowd control from players of Dragon characters. If they were all these things already, then those players wouldn't be asking for them.

Amon- you wanted suggestions- and complain you did not get-

Steelclaw and Racktor made good suggestions too you did not comment.
What to you think about their ideas?

I don't really like Steelclaw's to be honest. Skill Trees are great and they could certainly be a way to extend gameplay, but we don't have the necessary tech on the server, database, or client to support that feature. Plus, how would it work with the existing systems and schools. With quested abilities. There are a LOT of questions that would need to be answered before even beginning implementation.

Beyond that you have concerns about speed of implementation. If a LOT of huge features were required for client, database and server you would have to extend that time out even further.

I don't see much from Racktor other than agreeing with Guaran and saying "add to what we have already". Which you can find thirty threads on without much difficulty over the last six or eight years that clearly describe why we don't feel that can be done without heavily altering existing Dragons and the school (as well as quested abilities).

So far it seems like there are four viable possibilities. 1) New schools for new characters, leaving older characters untouched. 2) New schools for new characters, but providing a mechanism for older characters to transfer to the new system. 3) Change existing school and characters to fit the new system. 4) Do nothing, leave the system as is with no changes.

The fifth possibility, add on top of existing Dragons without altering anything about the current system or content, is in my opinion completely unworkable.