adventure rating / multiclassrework suggestion

[terrox]

after playing many other games lately. I am wondering if we could get the way we gain exp after we take on another class reworked . after you reach 100 in multiple classes it is not reasonable to have to fight mobs 10x your level to gain exp . Other games just neglates your exp from the other classes and allows you to level starting with level 1 mobs . This would allow players to really learn their new classes instead of just using advance abilities to powerlevel their new classes ( yes it is nice having the advanced abilities but to really learn you new class would in my opinion be better )

[Calyndrell]

after playing many other games lately. I am wondering if we could get the way we gain exp after we take on another class reworked . after you reach 100 in multiple classes it is not reasonable to have to fight mobs 10x your level to gain exp . Other games just neglates your exp from the other classes and allows you to level starting with level 1 mobs . This would allow players to really learn their new classes instead of just using advance abilities to powerlevel their new classes ( yes it is nice having the advanced abilities but to really learn you new class would in my opinion be better )

you basically just asked to do away with the whole multiclass mastery system....
-1 vote for this

ooh just to be clear... HORRIBLE Idea

[meepsa]

you basically just asked to do away with the whole multiclass mastery system....
-1 vote for this

exactly this, multiclassing is a big pull to istaria, and masterable abilities are what makes it enjoyable, remove them and you remove the need to multiclass (aside from bragging rights of max rating)

[Machaeon]

I wouldn't want the abilities from other classes to stop carrying over like they do, that would not be good for people who have built their characters around that and especially for those prestige classes that do rely heavily on supporting classes. Also I have no idea what other game(s) you are talking about that allow multiclassing, Istaria's the only one I've seen that lets you do that.

I absolutely wouldn't be adverse to the effect rating has on experience gain being reduced but not eliminated however. It is rather easy to not understand how badly your rating can turn your character into a gimp if you don't level schools properly. I would know, I ended up unable to kill anything that would get my biped experience- in any school I had fairly early on with just a few schools leveled so I had to turn to powerleveling him with Mach to fix the problem. Reducing the effect rating has on experience gain would help with new players and people who just don't understand bipeds well not immediately screw up their rating, but I would absolutely not eliminate it because it is indeed easier to fight things than it would be with just a level 1 in the class you're starting out with- you have other abilities and skills from other classes. But I am fine with nothing changing in the rating system, I've learned to embrace the grind.

[Spyrioyo]

Maybe there should be a way to for new people to not mess up their classes by for their first class to not allow to change schools until they reach 100 or just something to prevent a screw up but I agree with the others it be bad to remove it completely.

[Calyndrell]

Maybe there should be a way to for new people to not mess up their classes by for their first class to not allow to change schools until they reach 100 or just something to prevent a screw up but I agree with the others it be bad to remove it completely.

I would say no to this but perhaps a warning the FIRST time you go to change class that doing so will have an adverse effect on your experience gain and it may become harder to level??

[Guaran]

The game already makes it harder to level each successive school, as rating (vs. the mobs) goes up, exp goes down.

If you mean powerleveling 1 class with another by trophy hunting, well that's just how the system works. They would have to make the trophy quests work off rating and not current adventure level. And "10x current level" just doesn't exist at all past level 16. And you could still gather trophies in one school and give them to yourself in another school.

Bad idea.

[terrox]

you basically just asked to do away with the whole multiclass mastery system....

wake up and smell the changes over the last couple years , the multiclass mastery system is already on its way out . How many abilities have been changed to UNMASTERABLE ....MANY !!!!
Multiclass characters are NOT just in Istaria .... I know of many games I can play various classes with some Cross over abilities and still be able to switch freely in between . I can play warrior and then switch to a white mage and all i have to do is switch weapons . My whole point is to redesign the way you gain exp so when you start a NEW class you can LEARN to hunt on LEVEL 1 mobs instead of just using your level 50 ability ( from another class) and killing mobs you should NEVER be able to kill at LEVEL 1

[Azath]

I disagree with most of this thread, tbh, there are better ways to sort out the xp grind than so far suggested. But i'd guess they've already been suggested.

My biggest issue with multischooling is no quests apart from TM and trophy, really. Now LUCKILY part of the grind has been eleviated by TM quests that are actually worth doing, i.e. you may get 100xp per kill but look there's 1/8 to 1/6 (depending on teir - the low teirs give awful xp compared to level) of your next level at least! Plus trophies...but then, that's just a different form of grind i suppose.
I think it would help a lot to just remove the getting half trophy xp after 10 turn ins - or at least don't be as harsh as halving it since you know, that's the primary way of leveling bipeds...but hey i've seen that suggested several times before.
I'm pretty sure many decent solutions have been suggsted in fact, and some solutions - as such as merely giving schools quests - have been considered but are struggling for implements.

[Spyrioyo]

I disagree with most of this thread, tbh, there are better ways to sort out the xp grind than so far suggested. But i'd guess they've already been suggested.

My biggest issue with multischooling is no quests apart from TM and trophy, really. Now LUCKILY part of the grind has been eleviated by TM quests that are actually worth doing, i.e. you may get 100xp per kill but look there's 1/8 to 1/6 (depending on teir - the low teirs give awful xp compared to level) of your next level at least! Plus trophies...but then, that's just a different form of grind i suppose.
I think it would help a lot to just remove the getting half trophy xp after 10 turn ins - or at least don't be as harsh as halving it since you know, that's the primary way of leveling bipeds...but hey i've seen that suggested several times before.
I'm pretty sure many decent solutions have been suggsted in fact, and some solutions - as such as merely giving schools quests - have been considered but are struggling for implements.

I also agree there should be a better solution one that is fair to all players and balanced.

[meepsa]

Maybe there should be a way to for new people to not mess up their classes by for their first class to not allow to change schools until they reach 100 or just something to prevent a screw up but I agree with the others it be bad to remove it completely.

not allowing them to multiclass would also gimp them, as playing purely as scout really hurts (especially in the early levels).

[Korchak Strongbone]

Are we talking about dragon multi-classing? LOL joking..

For everyone it's different but, you don't need all 28 schools to be a good player. If you decide doing 28 to 100 is what you want then that is possible with a lot, I mean A LOT of hard work but, it is possible.

Just having a class that gets 10 armor use
a class that maxes power
a class that maxes healing

Pick 1 of each here and thats 3 100's not bad. Then for end game choose what school you really want and use the carry over mastered abilities from those 3. Then after that you have 4 100's.

Then you can start to look at a few schools like conjurer, ranger, berzerker, guardian, spearman that have nice masterables and decide which you want to get they don't need to go to 100 either. A few of those are only 44 and one is like 58 I think.

Just that is enough to deal with about anything out there in the world and be able to hold your own quite nicely anything above that is just because you can, yes of course it all helps but, it's not required.

-Kor

[AmonGwareth]

wake up and smell the changes over the last couple years , the multiclass mastery system is already on its way out . How many abilities have been changed to UNMASTERABLE ....MANY !!!!
Multiclass characters are NOT just in Istaria .... I know of many games I can play various classes with some Cross over abilities and still be able to switch freely in between . I can play warrior and then switch to a white mage and all i have to do is switch weapons . My whole point is to redesign the way you gain exp so when you start a NEW class you can LEARN to hunt on LEVEL 1 mobs instead of just using your level 50 ability ( from another class) and killing mobs you should NEVER be able to kill at LEVEL 1

I think perhaps you are misunderstanding the multischool system. If you are a level 25 Warrior and change to the Mage school then yes you start as a level 1 Mage. But because you are also a level 25 Warrior you aren't truly the equal of a new character who joins Mage as his or her first school. That is why the rating system exists, to give you an "effective" level that represents your combination of schools. Doing away with the experience penalty would be wrong because your Level 1 Mage is now more powerful due to increased health, statistics, etc.

As far as other games, I can honestly think of 0 mainstream MMOs that have a true multiclass system. I would be curious which ones you are thinking of. Certainly some of the common ones such as WoW, EQ2, SWTOR, Neverwinter, Lotro, Guild Wars 2, ESO and Rift don't.

[Korchak Strongbone]

Maybe Epics could drop 1 trophy to each player that could be turned in for 10% of a level. This could help a bit on not just grinding trophies when your rating is well over 200.
The only thing I would suggest on this would be you would have to use the trophy with the current school you killed the epic with so you would have to use your 89 mage or whatever you had on to kill him and not just use your 100.

-Kor
100 Warrior, Mage, Healer, Spiritist, Druid, Elemental Archer, Ranger, Conjurer
84 Scorcerer
71 in the other 19 schools.

[anonimas]

I don't think we need to simplify multiclassing. It's something Istaria is really proud of and it should be a kind of achievement.
What can be done - is to offer more class quests so that multiclassing won't be crystal using/trophy grinding. Or even make each 5 or 10 levels to undergo quests. Quests may be simple, like "kill 7 rats", but they could provide xp.
Besides, levelling a class in a few days would really hurt the game. Too many "tanks" that just slaughter anything around without thinking what does this ability do.

[Dacurly]

What can be done - is to offer more class quests so that multiclassing won't be crystal using/trophy grinding. Or even make each 5 or 10 levels to undergo quests. Quests may be simple, like "kill 7 rats", but they could provide xp.

We already have this, there called Daily Quests from the Town Marshalls. The Devs even made it so you can get all of them at once so it is faster.

[Calyndrell]

wake up and smell the changes over the last couple years , the multiclass mastery system is already on its way out . How many abilities have been changed to UNMASTERABLE ....MANY !!!!
Multiclass characters are NOT just in Istaria .... I know of many games I can play various classes with some Cross over abilities and still be able to switch freely in between . I can play warrior and then switch to a white mage and all i have to do is switch weapons . My whole point is to redesign the way you gain exp so when you start a NEW class you can LEARN to hunt on LEVEL 1 mobs instead of just using your level 50 ability ( from another class) and killing mobs you should NEVER be able to kill at LEVEL 1

Wait what? I don't think a SINGLE ability I use regularly has been made Unmasterable.

And you referenced White mage.. I assume you are comparing to Final fantasy XIV which if thats the case, then how can you even compare both systems you might as well compare istaria to UO. They are totally different systems.

[awdz]

after playing many other games lately. I am wondering if we could get the way we gain exp after we take on another class reworked . after you reach 100 in multiple classes it is not reasonable to have to fight mobs 10x your level to gain exp . Other games just neglates your exp from the other classes and allows you to level starting with level 1 mobs . This would allow players to really learn their new classes instead of just using advance abilities to powerlevel their new classes ( yes it is nice having the advanced abilities but to really learn you new class would in my opinion be better )

I can appreciate the frustration of trying to play a class pretty purely based on that class's abilities and being whomped by anything that can get you xp. Perhaps an option for those who prefer it, to temporarily ignore abilities/skills/etc. gained from other classes, would make for a happy middle ground. I do not know if that is feasible and I would keep the current system rather than change over completely, because I do love the carry over of abilities most of the time.

[meepsa]

wake up and smell the changes over the last couple years , the multiclass mastery system is already on its way out . How many abilities have been changed to UNMASTERABLE ....MANY !!!!

yeah, this would be a point....if it was true.
it's true every class has atleast a few non-masterable ones, but why? well, to make each class unique, maybe???

remove all mastery, and each class is unique, but not working with the current system, trust me, I'm sure the devs can't remake the whole game because A and B don't like the current mastery system.
Make everything masterable and each class is the same, as you can just use the strongest abilities on every other school you want (cloak of thorns anyone?)

Also, if the rating system is messed up for people, don't forget that you can unlearn schools!
though I guess it's not mentioned in-game, thus it's kinda hard to know that.

[Daulnay]

after playing many other games lately. I am wondering if we could get the way we gain exp after we take on another class reworked . after you reach 100 in multiple classes it is not reasonable to have to fight mobs 10x your level to gain exp . Other games just neglates your exp from the other classes and allows you to level starting with level 1 mobs . This would allow players to really learn their new classes instead of just using advance abilities to powerlevel their new classes ( yes it is nice having the advanced abilities but to really learn you new class would in my opinion be better )

This is a terrible idea, and destroys one of the excellent game mechanics in Istaria.
A good game mechanic presents the player with meaningful choices. The Istaria multiclassing system does exactly this, unlike most other MMOs. The choice of which schools to add matters; the order you do them in matters; how far you level each one matters.

Yes, you can gimp your character, and yes, you don't learn much about a new school when it's overshadowed by your level 100 schools. To help with the first problem, it would be very, very helpful if the devs added a quest that walked you through adding and dropping an adventure school -- too few people learn that you can do this as a biped, and it's critical to know. I'm sure many players have left over the years because they got frustrated after gimping themselves by adding too many schools.

For the second problem, there are two very simple solutions -- 1) roll an alt, and play through the first 20-some levels. 2) Copy your character to Blight, and drop your high-level schools.

There's also a third path -- avoid the common multiclassing plan, and level up a few of the classes you want to play at the endgame first instead of starting with Warrior and Cleric or Mage. It may be harder, and you will have to think and plan more, but at least you'll be leveling what you want to play instead of laying groundwork and then grinding up the classes you want to play.

[Edit] It is possible to level more than a couple classes together. I currently have a character (Tamlis on Order) with 6 classes at 25 or 26, and none higher but a few more lower, with a total adventure rating of 39/40. I can fight many monsters at my current adventure rating (but not everything) , with 5 of the 6 (Healer's a little hard). It takes preparation, thought, and skill. I die when I'm careless. But it is fun. I'm attempting to take all 6 to 100, in parallel, without grinding for miniscule xp, using daily quests, or trophies. It looks possible, in theory, and works so far ( and without leveling a crafting class to 100 first). Oh, and none of the 6 is Warrior, Cleric, or Mage.