Blight Patch notes Mith an alloy ?

[Vandellia]

While i am all for the changes to the t 1 thru 3 ore to bar formulas especially the cobalt change it will definately have some serious negitive sideaffects and making mith a an alloy is a bad idea in general. I will re state some peoples ideas here

1. Unless tulga modifies tarbashes and standishes cargo disks to the new resource standard the affect is
a. increase the pricing on building
b. decrease the intent of the disk as a valuable asset to the metal trades
c.increase the grind when working and leveling -metal is already a grind as it is
2. Mith is already difficult enoughfor the non high-tier (adventurer leveled) crafters its is dangerous at best to get mith as it stands having to double your hazard for what amounts to little or no gain is not good logic.
3. It will slow down leveling of all metal trades whats is wrong here is the people that i think it was designed to affect -ie the ones pushing for higher tier forms/conten it affects the least where it affects the people just being able to get to mith the most.

Feel free to agree/disagree but post your opinions and use logic not knee-jerk ones getting upset and threatining is not the best way to address the issue :)

[Seranthor]

I think that they are trying to slow down mithril crafting for reasons only known to them, I could float a few theories of my own but then you'd never see this post.

[Senkeleron Fell]

Since steel and cobalt are already alloys it shouldn't really change building prices much except for mithril.

Tarbash disks were not given the ability to port to help the metal trades, they were given that to help carry construction materials.

It will only slow down the leveling of those people who can do mithril. Getting to that point shouldn't change all that much.

[Alladania]

If mithril becomes an alloy it's going to raise jewelry prices - unless the customer feels like providing the bars.

[imported_tjl]

1. Unless tulga modifies tarbashes and standishes cargo disks to the new resource standard the affect is...

this one I do not understand. Can't you still use the cargo disks while gathering mithril just as easy as now? (just have to put cobalt ore in the backpack?)

[Death-knell]

If mithril becomes an alloy it's going to raise jewelry prices - unless the customer feels like providing the bars.

Actually if you read the blight notes

Mithril Bars require 4-2 Mithril Ore and 2-1 Cobalt Ore

You see it requires cobalt ore, not bars. And cobalt nodes will also be placed amongst the mithirl nodes. So, if you fill your tarbash or regular disk with mithiril ore and then load your back back with cobalt ore your good to go.

Mithiril as an alloy is an abomination. This is the cheesiest thing I ever so them do!

[Uther Blade]

[img]/Web/Themes/default/images/icon-quote.gif[/img]Alladania wrote: If mithril becomes an alloy it's going to raise jewelry prices - unless the customer feels like providing the bars.

Actually if you read the blight notes

Mithril Bars require 4-2 Mithril Ore and 2-1 Cobalt Ore

You see it requires cobalt ore, not bars. And cobalt nodes will also be placed amongst the mithirl nodes. So, if you fill your tarbash or regular disk with mithiril ore and then load your back back with cobalt ore your good to go.

Mithiril as an alloy is an abomination. This is the cheesiest thing I ever so them do!

[img]/Web/Themes/Generic/images/icon-quote.gif[/img]Vandellia wrote: 1. Unless tulga modifies tarbashes and standishes cargo disks to the new resource standard the affect is...

this one I do not understand. Can't you still use the cargo disks while gathering mithril just as easy as now? (just have to put cobalt ore in the backpack?)

Alladania? Tier V stone, wood and metal reaping potions all take Mith to make... there are also dyes that take mith as well... this will force the cost of these items up as well.. and much more than jewlery

TJL? Yes... you can use your inventory to carry the needed ore to make the bars, but you will make half the amount of bars you make in game now, per load.



The first load of mith bars you make?... you will not enjoy it at all. Forget your alloy discussion. Lets talk about the devs taking the game in the wrong direction... If it ain't broke don't fix it.We play to escape from RL rules and limitations... IF.. I choose to level my character in Mith, it is because I can't get the xp in steel after I hit 100 in a crafting class that has points to smelting, readjust the xp for thesmelting process... OR
Tarbash disks will need to be increased for bulk and carry capasity for this to be equitable, or Standish disks be made portable, OR
the cost of porting your disk removed, OR
add in tier VI metal bar form now.. (are you going to mix mithril with Ademantium)

I pay to play.. you nerfed the fighting so hard, I don't fight.. now crafting? I can do the carpenter thing or weaver, but to be a complete crafter, I need to have my fitter up as well. I will probly hang my fittering hammer in my house and reminice about the fun I had fitting.

[Snowdonia Honeythorn]

Alladania? Tier V stone, wood and metal reaping potions all take Mith to make... there are also dyes that take mith as well... this will force the cost of these items up as well.. and much more than jewlery

Organic potions also need Mithril tools to make. I believe the only reaper potion that doesn't take Mithril tools is Essence.

There is also a potion or two which take Mithril to make but I forget which exactly.

[gusi]

For pots that need Mithril (Powder) - Ginesh's Thickened Skin and Latro's Evasive Aura. Essence, Moonlight and Obsidian dyes also need Mithril (Powder).

[Dragonboy]

Luckily as I dragon I am hardly bothered by the changes in mithril, but I still dont like the changes, nor did I ever liked the fact that Steel and Cobalt require 2-3 different components...
I never leveled my dragon on mithril, mostly for the simple fact that it was of no use for me since there used to be no way to process the stuff beyond bars...

But what I was wondering...
Mithril has a nice color now, but what will happen to this when you mix Cobalt and Mithril together...
*wonders if the mithril shirt Frodo had in LoTR is also an alloy made from Cobalt and Mithril*

[Senkeleron Fell]

Somehow I don't think they are going to waste the time to change the color of mithril...

[Aamer Khan]

I personally don't mind the charges for porting with a disk, since there needs to be consumption to remove wealth from the system.

And, I really don't even mind that Mith will be slightly harder, since the resources will be in the same field. And I say slightly harder, because it is only a tiny bit more difficult to make having to add 1 extra ore into the mix. The effect from this is it slows the process down a bit, which is actually quite reasonable for a higher level material. To me the better solution would be to up the optimal smelting by at least 100 points which would serve the same purpose, and actually help create a bit more consumption, since everyone would have to tech their gear differently. This would also be good for crafters, since they would now have new orders. Merely adding cobalt ore to the mix just serves to irritate players.

I do believe many things ARE broke and need fixing. Crafting is no different than adventuring in that it directly impacts the game. One class needs it's forms, another can make too much money from PB runs, others are too hard, or have no way to decon for exp. Not everything is equal, nor should it be.

One thing to remember... WE are not developers. We have no clue what their "vision" for the game really is. All we can do is respond to changes, and let them know what we find fun and engaging, and what we find tedious. I realize that they seem to have the view that we will adjust to more tedium, and that the core playerbase will stay through any experimenting they do. Evidence does NOT support this though. Too many have left due to the game turning into grind only.

Event will fix this, and hopefully will be coming soon. Until then, keep them Ideas flowing. [;)]

[Guaran]

In my mind Mithril should stay Pure. i.e. NOT be an alloy.

The reason for the change was because Mithril was a bit too easy, and with well planned structures on plots near the mithril fields, upper craft leveling became easy once one craft was high enough to process mithril.

But the root of that problem is that tier 5 metals differ from the previous 4. Tier 5 only has 1 metal. Lower tiers had gold, platinum, silver. Precious metals used for jewelry, and cobalt, steel alloys for armor. Even bronze is an alloy but they have the nodes combined into 1 to make it easier for beginner crafters (good idea). (On that note the finishing machines need added back to the fields on all starter islands if they haven't been already.)

If tier5 jewelry was a metal OTHER than mithril, and perhaps things like powdered 'xx' for things like alchemy, it would break up Mithril's monopoly on tier 5 crafting. The crafts where the metal for tier5 gets changed would no longer get quite as easy a ride from Mithril processing exp. Now armorcraft, outfitter, weaponcrafter will still all be classes that benefit from Mithril once one class has raised the skill up. The skill for the other schools using a different metal will benefit from the skill, but not the ultra convienient resource that Mithril became. I believe that's all the dev's are trying to do here, break up mithrils hold on leveling up adjacent craft skills. It is also to make way for Adamantium, and it was probably going to be an adamantium/mithril combination.

Now I don't think Adamantium should necessarily be an alloy either, but this metal's history (lore) is less exact than Mithrils, and it may well have been an alloy.

For Mithril, they could use platinum as a 'catalyzing agent', or 'firing agent' (fuel for the smelter), if they insist on 2 different resources to construct it. If they go this route it I would suggest at the bottom end of the scale 3 mithril ore 1 platinum ore, and at the optimal end of the scale 2 mithril ore 1/5 platinum ore at the optimal end of the scale. In other words 10 mithril ore, 1 plat ore to make 5 bars at the optimal end. If it's a firing agent there wouldn't be any reason it necessarily has to have 1 ore for every bar. The upsides to this would be the plat ore could easily be carried on person, and a tarbash disk could still have a use for the mithril ore.

I know the Tarbash was originally introduced to help with construction, but any/all craft schools skills apply towards the use of that disk. In other words it's too late, the disk is now mainstream for most craft schools.

Another suggestion would be make the optimal end of mithril, 3 ore to 1 bar and remove the second material. This is if they insist on making mithril a lil harder no matter what.

I would prefer mithril was unchanged, and that a new precious metal for jewelry/alchemy use was added, so that tier 5 followed the established pattern of the other tiers. Since tier6 metal bar isn't quite here yet they can adjust Tier 6 to have 2 metals as well before introducing that formula. Other metals I can think of are titanium, selenium (Manga's idea).

Another possibility for a second tier5 metal, is perhaps an alloy that uses mithril, which could be the jewelry/ alchemy bar (resource) Something like "Mithril-Platinum" There could be a "Mithril-Platinum" bar for Jewelry, that uses 2 mith ore 1 platinum ore, and for armor usage, the existing "Mithril" bar, which could use 2 mith ore 1 cobalt ore in it's construction, or maybe 3 mith ore and no cobalt or platinum. Or just 2 mithril ore as the bar currently is.

You get the general idea's.

I'm not 100% sure that would really seperate the construction schools experience gains (which was the source of the idea that Mithril needed to be changed), so perhaps a different approach to crafting exp, specifically processing exp, would be a better resolution that any of the previous ideas I have listed.

Mining and smelting skills could come ONLY from actually mining, and smelting. in fact the miner school could be removed, and the skills be added to automatically by the various schools like armorcrafter, but only from processing metal resources. So this class would get 2 different experience types. Same thing for weaponcrafter. Seperate out the processing exp from the actual trades exp. Joining any class that uses metal would automatically add a subclass called "Miner" and all the schools could contribute EXP to the "Miner" subclass, but only for processing metals or stoneworking. Then when using bars to make armor, the armorcraft skill gets that exp.

In this way experience gain is more realistic in what actions give exp to what skills. So exp for 2 different classes would start taking place, but that really would make sense because the basic skill of mining goes hand in hand with the "Prestige" skill of crafting a beautiful Mithril chestplate, but the skills themselves are vastly different (Mining vs Armorcrafting)

Experience gains for crafting armor and weapons would need boosted somewhat as well to help compensate. Mithril bar form could be left completely alone. And cross training crafting schools (multiclassing) would still happen but in a more logical manner.

[kengar]

Interesting idea, Guaran. Assuming it's properly balanced, it resolves some other issues as well.

For example, I spent 7 hours doing slate construction work on my plot this weekend. It had to be done, but it would have been nice to get more than one level out of 7 hours worth of work. However, since that character is a lvl 100 blacksmith, I didn't get any processing XP for slate work, which put him in an odd position. A mason of the same level that wasn't a high level blacksmith would have still been optimal on making the slate bricks, and would have gained XP for making the slate bricks. End result, a mason that was learning more would have leveled faster than a mason that didn't need to learn as much. It seems to me that both should level at the same rate, and your idea would have that effect.

It might be interesting to extend this out to all the individual skills, though I see a few issues with doing that. This would eliminate other things that some people object to, like leveling construction schools by making tools. You just made 1000 mithril mining picks? Congratulations, +360000XP to Metalworking. It would also mean that you couldn't grind metal armor to perfection, then turn around and make essence leather armor as the first piece of leathercraft you do.

The two downsides I see would be that this would mean crafters would loose stat bonuses (unless stats came from base skills) since the classes no longer level, and that transmutation would be a horrible horrible grind because noone actually needs to transmute anything T1-T4, it isn't until you start creating T6 resources from T5 resources that transmution is important.

Your idea would definitely be less disruptive than taking it all the way to seperate levelable skills.

[Guaran]

Yeah after thinking a bit more about it, the existing Miner class could stay as is, but exp to that class would come when mining, smelting, quarrying, stoneworking, while in any other craft school. The exp would go towards the skill used.

I don't know alot about all the other biped crafting schools, but theother Gatherer classescould follow the same example. The school is auto-added when any "Prestige" crafting school uses the skills needed, and exp for gathering goes into the gatherer school when 'gathering' or processing the resource.

[starlight]

I have taken time to think about their so called changed to teh metal bar formulas , namely mithril . I seriously feel they dont care about the players feed back. Also I feel they are specially targeting Armorer, weaponsmith , I could even go as far as fitter and yes jeweler as well , since these school can ONLY work with metal bars . I had known som high level crafter that were sometimes below lv 50 adventure. So I agree leave mithril alone it is fine the way it is now these devs I feel sometimes dont really think their changes through the whole way

[Guaran]

I think it all came about from people
1) leveling many other craft schools off of Mithril, and
2) selling items to PB right at the mithril fields. 500s to 1g a day could be made doing that. (though mind numbingly boring).

I will like the steel and cobalt 'fixes', because cobalt was unnaturally difficult.