Dryad RoP

[Vandellia]

I have posted many times that as the dryads were weakened by their being shut away from the world, that in order to recover their true abilities, they should have to do something similar to the RoP that dragons do,that being said I do believe that they should also be height restricted in their flight, for a dryad to sink below the water is simply sillydragonflys and other flying creatures can hover over water, so should dryads. Now On to RoP for dryads as they are nature based creations and are normally (historically) found in glades and woods the Rite should be based on investigating the "turning" of the treants from a peaceful race of beings the dryads have known forever, into the mindless angry beast that Istaria currently knows, so they could possibly start out series of quests by talking to the named cedar treant and chatting at the end with a grandfather Yew. I would love to see what kind of Ideas/quests you all can come up with the scenerio.

[Tarran of Chaos]

Agreed, though I dont believe it should be as difficult as rop because they only gain flight, not all of Istaria.

[Goriax]

From dragons it appears they have two ways of limiting flight altitude which can be combined. I'm sure flying dryads would be the same.
1. Absolute. The way they just made it for dragons. You can't fly above z coordinate of x meters. If they use this it means you can't fly at all if you're on a mountain more then x meters high.

2. Relative. You can only fly x meters above the ground. This is the way it used to be. When over water ground is measured from the sea floor, not water level. they never changed it in a year and a half of dragons flying like that so don't count on it changing for dryads (probably too involved for the gain). This means you can't fly over water deeper then that maximum relative flight altitude.

They can also be combined (you can fly no more then x meters above the ground as long as you're absolute z coordinate is less then y).

There's one other possible caveat. Whether they can apply different rules to different races. Since there's only been one flying race I just don't know what's possible there.

The reason I brought this upis the comment about being able to fly over water regardless of depth. That would imply an absolute limit, but an absolute limit implies you won't be able to fly at all on high mountains.

If it were me, I think dryads would work better with a relative limit. The classic limit being treetop height whatever that is (50 meters maybe?). They would still be able to cross shallow water (as long as it isn't more then 50 meters deep) but not deep water. By comparison, dragons used to be limited to 200 meters relative.

Something to keep in mind is that for dragons at least the command which normally is used to jump is used to start flying instead. Adult and ancient dragons can't jump. Even if they're on a mountain so high they can't fly they still can't jump. Presumably if dryads got real flight they wouldn't be able to jump either. Probably not a big deal but don't say you weren't warned.

I'm all for flying dryads if it's done in a balanced way which accentuates the differences in races rather then blurs them. However, if you're going to discuss it you need to be aware of the limitations imposed by the engine.

[Loacalea]

IPosed in mine Topic on the board alittle bit about dryads RoP.
Here some basic i think Dryads should have.
Dryads for one should only be able to fly tree high no higher thats not counting the giant trees.
Dryads should be able to fly above water.
Reguardless how deep the water is they still should be able to fly across it.
While there flying there sprint should still work as usual.

[Fireclaw]

I'm thinking dryads could possibly be made to fly over water because I think the water table in Istaria is always at the same level above zero Z altitude (which is a plane some distance below the ocean floor). Thus dryads could be given flight along the lines of:

Dryad flight (gained after doing a quest chain):
Fly speed 60
Min. altitude: 10m above the waterline (guessing thats maybe 210m above zero Z) <<<< dryad flight <<<<< Max altitude: 20 m above terrain mesh directly below the dryad or 1800 m, whichever is lower. While not allowing dryads to fly to high altitudes like a dragon this would allow dryads to fly through obstacles they can't now such as construction scaffolding. It would also allow them to fly out of reach of melee mobs, which is a huge advantage over other bipeds.
Takeoff animation: none - due to their small size dryads are able to launch into the air much faster than a dragon, which must go through a 2 second takeoff animation before being able to launch except when taking off from a running start down a steepening incline. Unlike a dragon, a dryad does not need to worry about being unable to take off due to the takeoff animation being interrupted.
Duration: dryad flight has an endurance meter similar to the breath meter for going underwater. The bar begins depleting the instant the dryad starts true flight by pressing the jump button and is fully depleted after 1 minute of flight, after which the dryad cannot ascend and begins to lose altitude at the rate of 2 meters per second until the dryad is on the ground. Once on the ground, the bar replenishes at the rate of 5% per second, so it takes the dryad 20 seconds to fully replenish the endurance bar. A dryad can fly with less than the fully endurance bar, but doing so means a shorter flight.

[Guaran]

Agree with Fireclaws assestment however the fly speed should stay at 50.

60 fly speed would be like a permanent, free saris sprint. Saris would get envious.

Besides, Dryads are really pretty tiny. 50m or even slower is a realistic movement speed for them thru the air. (I'm picturing fireflies in my mind as something of a reference. they move pretty slowly. 50m is plenty fast IMHO)

For the sprint, they would have to land to activate it. same things dragons do with our velocity sprint we receive as Ancients.

[Eni]

as my top speed on ground is past 180 in my opinion 50 is nothing. Always remember no speed buffs work on fly speed.

[Joaqim]

Agree with Fireclaws assestment however the fly speed should stay at 50.

60 fly speed would be like a permanent, free saris sprint. Saris would get envious.

And right now Dryads are envious to Dragons, who fly way faster. And you have to see, those lil bugs are the real flyers ingame, or have you ever seen a Dryad (alive) even touching the ground?

[Goriax]

Giving dryads any sort of true flight means other bipeds will need something as well to compensate since, unlike dragons, dryads have access to all the abilities, schools, and game content that every other biped has access to. Can't give them everythingothers haveand then also give them something the others do not have as well.

Unless of course dryads also have something taken away so there's something that other bipeds can do that dryads cannot. But somehow I suspect they won't like that.

Increasing the flight speed just increases the problem for no purpose that I can see.

[Joaqim]

Giving dryads any sort of true flight means other bipeds will need something as well to compensate since, unlike dragons, dryads have access to all the abilities, schools, and game content that every other biped has access to. Can't give them everythingothers haveand then also give them something the others do not have as well.

Well every biped race has it's abilitys which no other race can get. So I have the mighty human magical aptitude, which no other race could get, well, even if they wanted have it[:P]
So let dryads fly, I have swimming and that speedy SoG hill climbing ability on my wishlist[:D]

[Loacalea]

In mine Post on mine listI made of suggestinI suggesteda witch class.
Dryads will not be able to take that class.
But all therest of the current races will except dragon and dryads.
So it would be fair if dryads gain flying if we gaina witch class of course boys will be known aswarlocks.
except there shield i said what they will use as a broom will be the only thing they can tec for flight speed the dryads will be faster then rest of the races.
HoweverI even wrote about RoP for every race also.
http://community.istaria.com/Web/ShowPost.aspx?PostID=24732
(I knowI mix Drawf and Gnome around i doing to fix them soon)

[Dragoniade]

[img]/Web/Themes/default/images/icon-quote.gif[/img]Guaran wrote:Agree with Fireclaws assestment however the fly speed should stay at 50.

60 fly speed would be like a permanent, free saris sprint. Saris would get envious.


And right now Dryads are envious to Dragons, who fly way faster. And you have to see, those lil bugs are the real flyers ingame, or have you ever seen a Dryad (alive) even touching the ground?

Flying faster won't make you more efficient at combat (miss,miss, bellow par, miss) or crafting (1,1,1,2,0,1,2,...) because of the 'lower' score you get for getting 'flight'.

[Tarran of Chaos]

Dryads should get flight with no restrictions. They should be able to fly just as high as dragons and just as fast. Flight is also their racial ability. There is no valid non-envy reason for it to not be so.
The rest of the bipeds should get mounts. War steeds with barding.

[Fireclaw]

Dryads should get flight with no restrictions. They should be able to fly just as high as dragons and just as fast. Flight is also their racial ability. There is no valid non-envy reason for it to not be so.
The rest of the bipeds should get mounts. War steeds with barding.

Just because you dryads are envious of dragonflight is no reason to give dryads flight exactly the same flight as dragons. Dragonflight is a dragon's single best feature that makes them unique. Dragonflight is very powerful and allows a dragon to traverse just about any terrain safely. However, dragons give up a LOT to attain their flight. Dragons can't multiclass, can't equip biped weapons, have lousy healing, have to exspend a resource (hoard) to use their strongest abilities, can carry less than bipeds and have almost no crowd control. A dragon that hits 100 with 100 hoard is done with the game, while a biped can continue to multiclass indefinitely. Dragons also can't equip most of the coolest weapons (unique and set items, boars hide max, etc.)

The fact that dragonflight is so good is the primary advantage that that sets dragons apart from bipeds. Its good for Istaria because it makes dragons and bipeds more distinct. Remember how in awe you were the fight time you saw a flying dragon. Think how little awe you'd feel if everyone could fly like that... the only difference being that dragons had a less interesting gaming experience with their lack of combat options or multiclassing.

It would also be extremely unfair to the rest of the bipeds to give dryads dragonflight and then not give the rest of the bipeds flight. "War steeds with barding" would in no way be comparable to the utility of dragonflight. Dragonflight has the unique advantages of allowing relatively easy escape from battle, allows the dragon to ignore virtually all terrain and monsters, and can be maintained indefinitely. A flying dragon can literally fly across the world simply by aiming in one direction, flying forward and going AFK for 20 minutes. Being able to run a little faster on a horse, or having a charging horse attack as might be available with an armored mount, simply couldn't compare. The only way to make it fair would be to give all bipeds dragonflight. But by doing so the developers would have tossed the uniqueness of dragons out the window.

In my earlier post in this thread I have a suggestion on how dryad flight could work. It would have its own mechanic that would help make the races of Istaria special while preserving the uniqueness and flavor of dragons. Overall, the dryad flight would be inferior to dragonflight, but would have at least one advantage that dragonflight lacks (faster takeoff). Even then, granting dryad flight along the lines I described above might not be a good idea as even it would make dryads vastly superior to other bipeds.

[Tribunal]

givin the the wing span of a dryad, it should be a ability "Flight". that gives them the ability to fly like a dragon for a limited time. Then slowly lose altittude so they can land safely on the ground once the ability is over.

[Tarran of Chaos]

Well I am no aeronautical engineer but I feel pretty secure saying that flight is conditioned on the wing size versus the body weight (assuming fixed wings are not under consideration in which angle is necessary to plane out). Dryads are all wing with relativelysmall and lightbody and bone structure so there is no sense in them not having full flight.
Actually, the reciprocal of your ability suggestion should hold true. The dragons are the ones who should have had that flight ability rather than true flight. The reason being is that dragons are supposed tohave glands in the esophagusthat create hydrogenand only make flight capableby filling two chambers under their wings with hydrogen which of course actslike a hot air balloon andlightens them. The hydrogen is also used in breath of fire, but you have to have platinum to act as a catalystfor the flame which makesBreath of Firealso a hoard burning ability (or should be if keeping with realism). Dragons are supposed to have been firelessduring winter where in colder climates they would hibernateand because their metabolism slowed down and they rested instead ofactively crunching platinum.
See, you see all the dragons shouting "look how big dragons were in history" and using related arguements, but I bet you wont find them willing to accept the same scientific logic when its not bolstering them ;)

[Fireclaw]

Well I am no aeronautical engineer but I feel pretty secure saying that flight is conditioned on the wing size versus the body weight (assuming fixed wings are not under consideration in which angle is necessary to plane out). Dryads are all wing with relativelysmall and lightbody and bone structure so there is no sense in them not having full flight.
Actually, the reciprocal of your ability suggestion should hold true. The dragons are the ones who should have had that flight ability, and it should require hoard to use. The reason being is that dragons are supposed tohave glands that work create hydrogen which is used in breath of fire, but you have to have platinum to act as a catalyst. It is the fuel for the flame which makesBreath of Firealso a hoard burning ability (or should be if keeping with realism). The flight itself is dependant on hydrogen caused by eating the platinum. The only way dragons achieve flight is by storing that hydrogen in two hollow chambers which are under their wings, which of course is like filling up a hot air balloon. It lightens their body temporarily so that they can fly when normally their body is too heavy for their wings. The flight is only capable though when they have eaten the platinum. Dragons are supposed to have been flightless and firelessduring winter hibernation in colder climates because their metabolism slowed down.
See, you see all the dragons shouting "look how big dragons were in history" and using related arguements, but I bet you wont find them willing to accept the same scientific logic when its against what they want [img]/Web/emoticons/emotion-5.gif[/img]

Except its not scientific. If you read the lore on Horizons originally put out by the developers with the game, dragons actually fly with magic. Their wings are just used for stabilizing them in flight and for navigation.

Also if you compare a fly to an airplane ... well the airplane can fly much faster and at a much higher altitude than the fly.

[Tarran of Chaos]

A dragon pressurizes and buoys itself with magic? lol
I have heard it all now. I tend to deal with logic. Logically,yes the dragonrace should exist in this game, butI would say its time for Tulga to denounce the flawed Artifact given Lore as pure myth and speculation and start dealing with logic as well. There is far too much incentive to play that specific race.

[Tarran of Chaos]

[img]/Web/Themes/Generic/images/icon-quote.gif[/img]Tarran of Chaos wrote: (yada yada im shortening this)

Except its not scientific. If you read the lore on Horizons originally put out by the developers with the game, dragons actually fly with magic. Their wings are just used for stabilizing them in flight and for navigation.

Also if you compare a fly to an airplate ... well the airplane can fly much faster and at a much higher altitude than the fly.

As for the fly versus the airplane, its obvious you are no aeronautical engineer either ROFL. A plane has a fixed wing angle and an engine with either a propeller or turbine. I dont expect you to understand the significance of that. LMFAO. Anyway, and i cant stop laughing here, but your arguement is dismissed as the single greatest logical fallacy I have ever seen lol.
I think dragons should have an x% chance of blowing up by coughing and igniting themselves. Internally combusting. Oooo I like that idea :)
Whats next? Gnomian spaceships? lol

[Fireclaw]

As for the fly versus the airplane, its obvious you are no aeronautical engineer either ROFL. A plane has a fixed wing angle and an engine with either a propeller or turbine. I dont expect you to understand the significance of that. LMFAO.

And you are an aeronautical engineer?

Forget the fly and the airplane analogy. Compare birds to mosquitoes. The fastest birds fly MUCH faster than the fastest mosquitoes.

Mosquitoes fly at speeds around 20 mph. Fast birds such as the common Eider fly at speeds approaching 50 mph. the fastest bird, the peregrine falcon, can hit 100-200 mph on a dive. Birds also have much greater flight range than insects.