May I trouble everyone to read this please ? Its not very long, I promise.

[Mirsathia]

[img]/Web/Themes/Generic/images/icon-quote.gif[/img]Mirsathia wrote:And yes, the size does matter and create lag - not lag between the server and the player, lag that's centered in the video card. Need proof? Compare your FPS in Chiconis versus what you get in Tazoon, or Aughundel. Not everyone has an ultimate top-of-the-line computer/video card with 2-4 gigs of RAM.


~Mirsathia


*Jumps up and down* Oh Oh Oh I know the answer to this one! Oh Oh Oh. TAZOON and AUGHUNDEL drive me down to about 2FPS. Chiconis and Dralk I keep about 10+. Those were really bad choices you know. They do not call it Lagzoon because of use dragons. The only place worse then Aughundel for lag I hear from most is New Rach.

He shoots! He scores! *Crowd goes wild.* Would you like to put any more ducks up for me to shoot?

No the reason these places are so bad and Chiconis and Dralk is Tazoon has all the buildings, Aug has the player plots right there in the city almost. Not sure about New Rach I know a lot of people complain about it right behind Tazoon, might be a combination of players and mobs and such in the area. Now once Dragon Lairs start being build in and around Chiconis and Dralk I am sure you will see more lag there.

Um, you still didn't get my point. More surface to render equals more lag. The same thing applies to player characters - including, especially, dragons.

Being insulting doesn't make your point any better, either. Why bother? You're only looking immature.


~Mirsathia

[Hyacinthe]

Well, I for one have to say I like the new model over the old one.

The reasons are all my own but none the less, it is my opinion.

And well here goes another opinion... I think you should all be happy for what we dragons have now and shut up.... We aren't the "bouncy bricks" with hoard that leaks more than a 20 year old faucet.. We aren't lacking in anything. Be happy that we are the great killing machines we are and quit crying over what wont be changed.

My 2 cents..

~Hy

[Pharcellus]

And yes, the size does matter and create lag - not lag between the server and the player, lag that's centered in the video card. Need proof? Compare your FPS in Chiconis versus what you get in Tazoon, or Aughundel. Not everyone has an ultimate top-of-the-line computer/video card with 2-4 gigs of RAM.

No, it does NOT.

Speaking as a programmer, I can tell you that the SIZE a model is rendered at has NO EFFECT on performance. NONE. NADA. ZIP. ZERO. ZILCH.

What DOES impact performance is the number of triangles, vertexes, textures, lights, etc. The old model is the same (or VERY close) in all those aspects. Thus, there will be no discernable performance difference between an Ancient model the size of a housecat, and one the size of a T6 guildhall. If they have the same number of base resources used in rendering them, the scale does NOT matter.

In fact, your non-sequitur of comparing Chiconis to Tazoon bears this out. Why is Tazoon so laggy? Is it just a handful of big buildings? No, it is a huge amount of small ones in the same place all being rendered. Why doesn't Chiconis lag? Because it has about 1/50th to 1/100th the resources to draw. If we blew Chiconis up to the size of Tazoon, it wouldn't lag any more than it does normally.

[Pharcellus]

Well, I for one have to say I like the new model over the old one.

The reasons are all my own but none the less, it is my opinion.

And well here goes another opinion... I think you should all be happy for what we dragons have now and shut up.... We aren't the "bouncy bricks" with hoard that leaks more than a 20 year old faucet.. We aren't lacking in anything. Be happy that we are the great killing machines we are and quit crying over what wont be changed.

My 2 cents..

~Hy

Yeah, that really makes me want to stop. [8-)]

You're entitled to your opinion. You're entitled to voice it. You're NOT entitled to tell other people to "shut up" about theirs, unless you want to be told the same. 'k?

If it does get changed, I will be sure to make a "new old Ancient pack" just for you and Mirsathia. [:P]

[Dragoniade]

[probably] Everyone who has the old models edited in are dragons. Like I said before - it's not just a dragon issue, it's a playability issue for everyone. That means bipeds, too. Obviously, the devs thought that the size of ancients, combined with their predicted numbers, would be too much for other players/the game to be able to handle easily. Since using the old model is an edit on ONLY your side, the bipeds don't have to be inflicted with a larger, laggier dragon. You're the only one who sees it, so of course you won't notice much of a difference. And yes, the size does matter and create lag - not lag between the server and the player, lag that's centered in the video card. Need proof? Compare your FPS in Chiconis versus what you get in Tazoon, or Aughundel. Not everyone has an ultimate top-of-the-line computer/video card with 2-4 gigs of RAM.
~Mirsathia

For your information, the size has nothing to do with your FPS.
If you have 2 identicals models with the sam number of polygons, but one is three time bigger, the performance will be unchanged? Why? Because it's the number of polygon that affect performance, not the size of them. 2000 small triangles will render at the same speed as 2000 big polygon. So unless they made the smaller model out of scratch or remove polygon, ther's no reason to have different performances.

[Theolaerynn]

[probably] Everyone who has the old models edited in are dragons.

I guess you missed the thread where I stated that pretty much everyone in my guild is using the Old models, and only two of us are Dragons. My wife is in fact a Dryad, and she prefers the Old model too. I know of other Bi-Peds that use them as well, and some have even posted in various threads here.

The fact remains that other than one Dragon, the only folks I know of that want the New model are Bi-Peds. Since this represents a massive minority of Dragons, and since Bi-Peds can quite easily use SetScale, and since when all else fails the smaller model can be patched in like we are currently being forced to do with the Old model, it seems like those actually playing the race should have the say. But I guess it is better to needlessly frustrate a fair portion of the player base.

Dragons are huge in most of the stories we read, Ancients have been huge in game for well over a year, and Devs have advertised them (complete with comparison screenshots) since Beta as being huge. As in, Old model huge. There was no reason given as to why they changed them, and at a minimum I would think we are due that simply by virtue of being paying customers.

I firmly believe no reason was given because none exists, other than perhaps friends of theirs wanted them changed. But then, that would be more along the lines of The Harsh Reality that The Lord Intern spoke of.

[Kitimandiri]

I think a lot of this would be solved if a dev took the time to talk with us.

[Mirsathia]

I totally agree, Kitimandiri.


And sorry for the faulty assumption about rendering. I'm a visual artist, not a 3D programmer. ;)


~Mirsathia

[Hyacinthe]

Yeah, that really makes me want to stop. [img]/Web//emoticons/emotion-43.gif[/img]

You're entitled to your opinion. You're entitled to voice it. You're NOT entitled to tell other people to "shut up" about theirs, unless you want to be told the same. 'k?

If it does get changed, I will be sure to make a "new old Ancient pack" just for you and Mirsathia. [img]/Web//emoticons/emotion-4.gif[/img]

Pharcellus I guess you didn't catch the drift of my post.....think of it more as I'm tired of all the bickering about this subject... it isnt a nerf...bleh.. tired of hearing it ya know.....it wasnt intended as aSTFU and play....

As for the "new old Ancient pack" no thanks lol.. I said I liked the new model but i didnt say i completly wont play with the old...lol besides that is already available with setscale.

[Pharcellus]

Well, since no one is holding a gun to your head forcing you to read it, it is pretty easy to infer that you are telling people to "shut up" about it, especially since you used the words. [;)]

[Hyacinthe]

I enjoy reading a good debate.. but when it gets beaten into the ground then it get to the point where anymore said would be moot... Ya know what i mean [:^)]

[Dragonboy]

Like I said in a different thread...
The BIGGER the better concerning ancient...

Anyone who is against it...
Dont become an Ancient...
Better still dont become adult...
or simply use setscale and let all that want to be big become big...

[Dragoniade]

Like I said in a different thread...
The BIGGER the better concerning ancient...

Anyone who is against it...
Dont become an Ancient...
Better still dont become adult...
or simply use setscale and let all that want to be big become big...

Except, you can't setscale every ancient dragon you see.
Have those who want small dragon use it, since they're mostly won't be grouping with ancient anyway

[Cobal]

Well, I followed this discussion with great interest.
All that I wanted to say has been said by others allready.
All thats left for me to say are two tidbits not related to the topic at hand but that did catch my attention.

first tidbit:

And sorry for the faulty assumption about rendering. I'm a visual artist, not a 3D programmer. [img]/Web/emoticons/emotion-5.gif[/img]

I just checked out your deviant art, those sure are pretty illustrations.
very nice indeed.[Y]
Ifyou ever decide to try your skills on 3d Art (maya, 3dmax) keep Pharcellus's comment about resources in mind, will greatly speed up rendering the final image [:)]

second tidbit:

err hyacinthe?

1st Sub 100 Ancient

You are actually proud of this?
I mean, having to be powered through your arop.
your kidding right? thats not to be proud of, thats a source of shame.
It's a joke to get a rise out of types like me right?

[Hyacinthe]

second tidbit:

err hyacinthe?



1st Sub 100 Ancient



You are actually proud of this?
I mean, having to be powered through your arop.
your kidding right? thats not to be proud of, thats a source of shame.
It's a joke to get a rise out of types like me right?

Just because I didn't spend two years playing my dragon doesn't mean I powered though... I worked ******** hard to get my dragon to where he is not to have that accomplishment belittled by anyone.

And yes I left my dragon at level 97 while waiting for the rest of the ARoP to be finished and yes when Manga allowed the first group to finish the ARoP on Blight I jumped at the chance to become the FIRST sub 100 Ancient. Why, you ask?
Yup, it is to stab at all the dragon players who griped and complained about the ARoP requirements being to low. Don't like it tough sh*t. Nothing you can do about it.

Just a note.. the difference in powers between a level 97 and a level 100 dragon.. well there is no freaking difference [:P]

[Ivy]

yeah it would be really nice if some dev would take the time to read this post. Just a shame its so long already, feel like that loweres our chances a bit.

[Cobal]

oooh, oops.
I owe you an apology Hyacinthe.
I didn't even see it was on blight[:S]
Can't possibly blame you for testing.

I'll need to put on me reading glasses next time.

[Hyacinthe]

Would have been the first on Chaos but work got in the way though from what I hear I may have been the second sub 100 on Chaos

[Amerelium]

size is not the only issue here, the new model is flawed, and obviousle made up in haste - and you are the ONLY dragon I've seen speaking up for the new model. I'm guessing you're a lesser with a dragon alt...

[Rorix]

i like the new models better.

size doesnt matter.

if i could id go back into my adult body.