Dragon Lair Update: November 13, 2005

[Kitimandiri]

Well in terms of a hatchling getting to check out every lair, I would think a hatchling should only be able to check out the lairs in his/her level range that they could possibly afford, like the lairs on lesser aradoth. A low level biped wouldn't be very safe looking at plots around harro. In that aspect I think it balances out. Players can and are able to check out plots in their range.

[Goriax]

Even if you never touch Blight I still don't see where there's a problem.

Almost all the lair plotsare live now and have been for some time. Heh, at one point someone even made a file which to putthem on your map. You've been told in these forums of typical lair sizes and prices. Even for the few new lair plotswhich have been added and are not yet live DB has announced their addition, so you know approximately where they are. You should have been checking them out in the past weeks. If you haven't it's your own fault.

So this is what you do:
1. When they publish final lair auction information read it over.
2. Spend a few hours this weekend visiting lairs in places you're interested in.
3. Place some bids.

It doesn't take 11 days to do this. It's taken me less time to pick out REAL houses.

Think of the auction as part of the game, because it is. As part of the game you are given a finite (but I consider very adequate) amount of time to place your bids.

If you miss the auction entirely because you simply couldn't handle that in 11 days, I'll bet that there will be plenty of unclaimed lairs afterwards; so you could still buy something. Perhaps not in your ideal location, but something. And you'll probably end up paying less since you'd just be paying the imperial price.

Building the lairs will take a great deal of player time, but buying the plots won't.

[Deth]

Well in terms of a hatchling getting to check out every lair, I would think a hatchling should only be able to check out the lairs in his/her level range that they could possibly afford, like the lairs on lesser aradoth. A low level biped wouldn't be very safe looking at plots around harro. In that aspect I think it balances out. Players can and are able to check out plots in their range.

Well this would be true for some one that has a hatchling on Live. I meant an adult or ancient that never copied over to blight.

I myself do not see a problem with 11 days to bid. As long as they give a couple days notice on what is being auctioned when. So you bid min Bid on any of the first lairs that come up that you like out of them. Then go explore others that are not up for bidding. If you win the first bid,but find a later one that you know you must have. Then sale the first at no lose and bid every thing on the one you really want.

Yes going around and scoping out everyone you want would be nice but it is not a requirement. So Dragon A spent a couple of days on blight scouting so knows what he wants and waits while Dragon B has no clue and start search on Thursday. As long as Dragon B watches when Plots are closing and checks them out before they close he has no less advantage then Dragon A. He just has to bid more often as he scout where as Dragon A already knows Which he wants to bid on.

Dragon A may even have to rethink his plans depending on the order that the bids close. I think Dragon B would be better off there as he is taking a fresh look at just what is closing next and does not have to worry about what is closing 3 or 4 days down the line.

[Frost]

You know, it's fun how that same logic goes both way. There's no reason why other should be pushished because you have way too much time in your hand.

I didn't realise. I'll call David up and have him shut the servers down untill you have a bit of freetime. That's why we're all here after all, for you. The rest of us players are just for background ambience.

The only real dispute is the fact that, yes, if you didn't copy an adult or ancient to Blight, a hatchling wouldn't be able to scout for lairs. Either way, it still gives you time after they hit live to run around for 11 days. The SAME opportunity as the rest of us have. I thuroughly expect things to change whenservers come back up onThursday anyway.

You say you haven't logged in in the last 11 days? That sounds like a priority issue. You sure like to visit the forums on a regular basis and whine. Why not log in for a half hour instead of trolling the forums. And FYI, aside from my wife, my kids range in age from 2-4. You think hands at that age are helpfull, you're on drugs. If you can explain how I'm the "lazy one" without sounding like a fool, I'll be happy to buy you a lair on Order. The chances are more likely Dralk would freeze over.

[Illi]

Even if you never touch Blight I still don't see where there's a problem.

Almost all the lair plotsare live now and have been for some time. Heh, at one point someone even made a file which to putthem on your map. You've been told in these forums of typical lair sizes and prices. Even for the few new lair plotswhich have been added and are not yet live DB has announced their addition, so you know approximately where they are. You should have been checking them out in the past weeks. If you haven't it's your own fault.

So this is what you do:
1. When they publish final lair auction information read it over.
2. Spend a few hours this weekend visiting lairs in places you're interested in.
3. Place some bids.

It doesn't take 11 days to do this. It's taken me less time to pick out REAL houses.

Think of the auction as part of the game, because it is. As part of the game you are given a finite (but I consider very adequate) amount of time to place your bids.

If you miss the auction entirely because you simply couldn't handle that in 11 days, I'll bet that there will be plenty of unclaimed lairs afterwards; so you could still buy something. Perhaps not in your ideal location, but something. And you'll probably end up paying less since you'd just be paying the imperial price.

Building the lairs will take a great deal of player time, but buying the plots won't.

And this really is the simplicity of it.

*wonders to herself how someone with "not enough time to place a bid" will have enough time to build the darned thing..........:/*

[Pharcellus]

Even if you never touch Blight I still don't see where there's a problem.

No surprise there.

Almost all the lair plotsare live now and have been for some time. Heh, at one point someone even made a file which to putthem on your map.

Aesthetic location is not always on the top of everyone's priority list.

You've been told in these forums of typical lair sizes and prices.

Yes, the typical Lair size stated up until very recently has been repeatedly stated as being 120x120x240. Now that the sizes are set on Blight (ON BLIGHT!!!), it turns out that there is no Lair that size, only one master Guild Lair that is close, and the rest are about half that size. No one has posted typical prices in the forums until very recently; only comparative biped plot prices have been stated, and they were incorrect.

Even for the few new lair plotswhich have been added and are not yet live DB has announced their addition, so you know approximately where they are. You should have been checking them out in the past weeks. If you haven't it's your own fault.

Those are guild lair plots, and not subject to auction. If they are not yet live, then most people would not have been able to check them out anyway. Getting access to Blight has not been the most obvious and straightforward process, ESPECIALLY to people who don't bother coming to the forums. (You know, all the ones you and others are constantly defending as the "Silent Majority"?).

So this is what you do:
1. When they publish final lair auction information read it over.
2. Spend a few hours this weekend visiting lairs in places you're interested in.
3. Place some bids.

Anyone who is looking for something other than aesthetic location needs to look at as many as they can in the next 11 days. They pretty much have to start over and look, since the resources, prices, and sizes have only recently been placed and set. I will be looking at EVERY SINGLE LAIR IN THE GAME, again. Luckily, I have time to burn. Not everyone does. I estimate that I MAY get through the list by the last day of the auction.

It doesn't take 11 days to do this. It's taken me less time to pick out REAL houses.

FYI, I spent THREE MONTHS looking at houses when I was in the market to buy my first one. However, this isn't even close in terms of comparison, since we are buying EMPTY LOTS, NOT HOUSES. A real comparison would be that we've been looking at empty lots, with no idea as to their exact size, proximity to utilities, construction businesses, roads, etc. All we have known is the aesthetic location.

That may be all YOU are interested in, but I ASSURE you, it is not all *I* and the rest of the world is interested in.

Think of the auction as part of the game, because it is. As part of the game you are given a finite (but I consider very adequate) amount of time to place your bids.

What you consider very adequate for you doesn't automatically equate what is adequate for the rest of us.

If you miss the auction entirely because you simply couldn't handle that in 11 days, I'll bet that there will be plenty of unclaimed lairs afterwards; so you could still buy something. Perhaps not in your ideal location, but something. And you'll probably end up paying less since you'd just be paying the imperial price.

Yeah, that's a fair solution. "Tough, take the leftovers!" [8-)]

[Kitimandiri]

So you have absolutely no idea what lair you want [:p]

[Death-knell]

Well can't speak for everyone but I bought many different lairs (one at a time) on blight. I was experimenting on how things fit in different dimensions and different tiers. I can see a lot of people bidding and winning, then selling the plot after figuring out a pretty or convenient location is not the way to go.

[Illi]

Well, thanks to the auction setup, they won't be selling lair after lair until the day AFTER we've all won one, more or less. I personally, don't care where my lair is, only that it's the size I want. So thankfully, I won't have to fight Dragons who can't be happy with what they win.

[Pharcellus]

So you have absolutely no idea what lair you want [img]/Web//emoticons/emotion-4.gif[/img]

Nope. I have a few on my list for further consideration, but I have seen maybe MAYBE 10% of all of them placed in the world. Not enough by far to make a decision based on my criteria.

[imported_tjl]

you actually don't have to travel to each individual one to get an idea of what is around it... unless you don't know where resources etc are. I do not have to travel around the harro plots to know what is close to them, and what isn't.

I think a week to find some plots and bid on them is more than enough for most players.

see this thread for a def file with the locations of the lairs:
http://community.istaria.com/Web/Sho...?PostID=104916

log in with those map markers, open the map, and delete (or ignore) the markers for the plots you know you will not want. this should take no more than 30 min.

over the next week, travel to the plots you are interested in, and futher narrow your list of possible lairs.

the only hang up in the process is if you want that lair with the perfect mountain vista... or some other purely aestetical reason. A week might not be enough time if that is your only set of criteria.

[Dragoniade]

You say you haven't logged in in the last 11 days? That sounds like a priority issue. You sure like to visit the forums on a regular basis and whine. Why not log in for a half hour instead of trolling the forums. And FYI, aside from my wife, my kids range in age from 2-4. You think hands at that age are helpfull, you're on drugs. If you can explain how I'm the "lazy one" without sounding like a fool, I'll be happy to buy you a lair on Order. The chances are more likely Dralk would freeze over.

Guess what, there's a difference between spending 5 minute here and there to check the forum, and spending 3 hours in the game. But I guess you can't get that either.

And I guess I was right since you had to resolve to insults to get your point. Troll back at you. Some people aren't just sheep who take the left over they are given to them. When there are flaw, we point them out. If people like you prefer to hide instead of solving the problem, do it, but don't call those who take a stand troll.

[Dragoniade]

And this really is the simplicity of it.

*wonders to herself how someone with "not enough time to place a bid" will have enough time to build the darned thing..........:/*

Probably the same someone that will have more time in a month or so. Remeber that people are blaming it on the bad timing and the short duration.
Holiday + last minute notice + short duration = Pissed people.

If the auction has been announced 3-4 weeks ago, it probably would have been different. But they were announced 2 days ago, that they were going to be rushed live, along with the hoard, in 2 days.

[Frost]

[img]/Web/Themes/Generic/images/icon-quote.gif[/img]Frost wrote:
Why not log in for a half hour instead of trolling the forums. Guess what, there's a difference between spending 5 minute here and there to check the forum, and spending 3 hours in the game. But I guess you can't get that either.

I said a half hour, not three. I'm sorry if your personal schedule doesn't coincide with the lair release schedule. That's really not mine, or anyone elses problem but your own. They're not going to delay the auctions because it doesn't work for you. If the auctions were announced three or four weeks ago... The ETA was originally Oct, and they've done better at keeping the community up to date on the progress, with updates regularly.

And I guess I was right since you had to resolve to insults to get your point. Troll back at you. Some people aren't just sheep who take the left over they are given to them.

I called you a troll, and that's what you're doing. You're posts are not constructive; on the contrary, they're quite argumentative. No one is going to have sympathy for someone with an attitude. If you end up with left overs, it's because you didn't bid, period.

When there are flaw, we point them out. If people like you prefer to hide instead of solving the problem, do it, but don't call those who take a stand troll.

What makes you think I have a problem to solve? What flaws? Every time you turn around, your story changes. First it was that bipeds got a week, why didn't dragons. Well, we've got 11 days. Then you wish misforutne on everyone that had logged into blight to test lairs, and explore because you"couldn't". You complained about not enough time to scout lairs, and check things out, but then counterpoint yourself with the statement that blight shouldn't be a walkthrough. Next you'll say it's because the lairs are broke, which has nothing to do with the auctions. The lairs will get fixed in their own time, wheither you own one or not. The auctions go live in one day, but the lairs arn't sold for another 11. If you log in and bid 11 days from now, you have the same chance as someone who bids everydaytill the end of the auctions.There are only a few situtaions I can think of where one would phisically not be able to log in to bid. On det in the military, for example. If you're able to log in, then it's a personal choice not to log in.

[Dragoniade]

I said a half hour, not three. I'm sorry if your personal schedule doesn't coincide with the lair release schedule. That's really not mine, or anyone elses problem but your own. They're not going to delay the auctions because it doesn't work for you. If the auctions were announced three or four weeks ago...

Like I said, some people are just selfish. If the timing match their own schedule, everything is perfect and those who don't are just sucker. Those who have problem, then it's their problem. Selfish.

I called you a troll, and that's what you're doing. You're posts are not constructive; on the contrary, they're quite argumentative. No one is going to have sympathy for someone with an attitude. If you end up with left overs, it's because you didn't bid, period.

So take the post you choose and use them agaisn'T be. Yes I'm argumentative, because I defend what I believe it. If you consider pointing how a school is broken and need balancing 'trolling' then I guess you aren'T better. Some people are tired here of being taken like fool that will take everything thrown at them. Broken school, unfair testing, cloned dragons. Sorry, but if your idea of a troll are people wanting things to be fixed, then you're worse than a troll to my eyes.

What makes you think I have a problem to solve? What flaws? Every time you turn around, your story changes. First it was that bipeds got a week, why didn't dragons. Well, we've got 11 days. Then you wish misforutne on everyone that had logged into blight to test lairs, and explore because you "couldn't". You complained about not enough time to scout lairs, and check things out, but then counterpoint yourself with the statement that blight shouldn't be a walkthrough. Next you'll say it's because the lairs are broke, which has nothing to do with the auctions. The lairs will get fixed in their own time, wheither you own one or not. The auctions go live in one day, but the lairs arn't sold for another 11. If you log in and bid 11 days from now, you have the same chance as someone who bids everyday till the end of the auctions. There are only a few situtaions I can think of where one would phisically not be able to log in to bid. On det in the military, for example. If you're able to log in, then it's a personal choice not to log in.

Sorry, but biped got more than a week. A month if I remember correctly.
And I wished misfortune to those who went to blight and returned only to brag and behave like being on Blight give them the right to be pissy over everyone else. Those who actually tested things (what blight is supposed to be), not go there to scoot, I wish them good luck.

Blight isn't a scout server for you to have an advantage over the other player. Blight is there to DEBUG and TEST content. Don't forget that.
And don't even dare bringing military people here.

[Pharcellus]

you actually don't have to travel to each individual one to get an idea of what is around it... unless you don't know where resources etc are. I do not have to travel around the harro plots to know what is close to them, and what isn't.

There are lair plots placed on new lands where new resources are just now being placed, and it is possible more new resource fields may be added to old areas. Azulite crystal resources are ALL new, and are integral parts to many lair structures.

I think a week to find some plots and bid on them is more than enough for most players

I don't.

see this thread for a def file with the locations of the lairs:
http://community.istaria.com/Web/ShowPost.aspx?PostID=104916

log in with those map markers, open the map, and delete (or ignore) the markers for the plots you know you will not want. this should take no more than 30 min.

over the next week, travel to the plots you are interested in, and futher narrow your list of possible lairs.

the only hang up in the process is if you want that lair with the perfect mountain vista... or some other purely aestetical reason. A week might not be enough time if that is your only set of criteria.

My criteria are not limited to one specific category. I look at about 6 different things, and weigh my choices for EACH AND EVERY LAIR based on them.

I already have my own map markers file generated for allowing me to efficiently examine the lairs from the auction list posted tonight. It STILL will take me a good deal of time to explore.

11 days is a very tight window for me, and I have LOTS of time to burn.

I can't imagine the hell that some people are going to go through trying to cram enough time to go looking with a casual play schedule.

[imported_tjl]

[img]/Web/Themes/Generic/images/icon-quote.gif[/img]tjl wrote:you actually don't have to travel to each individual one to get an idea of what is around it... unless you don't know where resources etc are. I do not have to travel around the harro plots to know what is close to them, and what isn't.

There are lair plots placed on new lands where new resources are just now being placed, and it is possible more new resource fields may be added to old areas. Azulite crystal resources are ALL new, and are integral parts to many lair structures.

so spend your week scouting those new areas which you are not familiar with. You are not new to the game, im sure you could mentally cut the possible lairs you wanted in half.

I think a week to find some plots and bid on them is more than enough for most players
I don't.

ok. over 300 lair locations have been availible for exploration for ... about three weeks now. if a dragon is just now starting the process of finding a suitable lair then one week might not be enough. however I don't really think Tulga's problem, since they have been very communicative with the locations and lair status.

My criteria are not limited to one specific category. I look at about 6 different things, and weigh my choices for EACH AND EVERY LAIR based on them.

I think that process takes too much time. based on my biped plot purchasing endevours, my advice would be to rate the lairs in batches based on location, or some other similarity. not each individually, because if lair A and liar B are in the same general area (chiconis let's say) applying the same critiera to each is a tad redundant.

or maybe you could rank your set of 6 criteria by importance. start with the most important element and apply it to the entire list of lairs. drop those that fail the criteria, and move on to the second criteira, drop those that fail... etc. and get a much smaller list of "visit worthy" lairs that way.

[Goriax]

Aesthetic location is not always on the top of everyone's priority list.

Then evaluate locationusing any other criteria which suits you.I was primarily evalulating location on the basis of proximity to portals, resources, roads, and hunting grounds. As I see it there's twoaspects to consider in evaluating a lair plot. The lair itself (i.e. dimensions) and it's location.Location has been known for weeks and if you haven't decided on some preferred locations by now it's your own fault. They have now posted dimensions of all the lairs. Auction order also matters but that's been posted too.

It doesn't take 11 days to do this. It's taken me less time to pick out REAL houses.

However, this isn't even close in terms of comparison, since we are buying EMPTY LOTS, NOT HOUSES.

That's right. An empty lairlot in this game has far fewer things to evaluate. For lair plots you're not worrying about zoning, drainage, soil, or danger of floods or slides. Plus you're not worrying about mortgage, quality of schools, hidden problems, ease of maintenance,etc. I wish buying a house were this simple.

Perhaps you can convince TG to give it more then 11 days, but I hope not. 11 days is plenty. I for one am itching to get on with working on my lair. I'm not really interested in waiting MORE time for people who just can't seem to manage this in 11 days.

I've had a pretty good idea of the areas I was interested in for weeks.This was based on the lair locations on the live shards which were available to everyone. Once Iknew thefew sizes lairs came inI picked the size I liked the most and was able to quickly decide on the exact plotsI wanted, fine tuning based on proximity to roads and portals.I went around the last couple nights and picked out some second and third choices. Once I knew the auction order last night I did my final fine tuning of what I'm going to bid on.

I'm ready to go. I've picked out the exact plots I'm going to bid on and will be placing my bids when I can get on after this all goes live. Then I'll be twiddling my claws for the next 10 days while people who just can't make up their minds dawdle.

[Frost]

[img]/Web/Themes/Generic/images/icon-quote.gif[/img]Frost wrote:

I called you a troll, and that's what you're doing. You're posts are not constructive; on the contrary, they're quite argumentative. No one is going to have sympathy for someone with an attitude. If you end up with left overs, it's because you didn't bid, period.


So take the post you choose and use them agaisn'T be. Yes I'm argumentative, because I defend what I believe it. If you consider pointing how a school is broken and need balancing 'trolling' then I guess you aren'T better. Some people are tired here of being taken like fool that will take everything thrown at them. Broken school, unfair testing, cloned dragons. Sorry, but if your idea of a troll are people wanting things to be fixed, then you're worse than a troll to my eyes.
.

Do you even have a point? If you do, defend it, but you can't even keep your story straight. First it was time, now it's schools are broken. What do schools have to do with auctions going live? Nothing. Just go back to your cave. You haven't made one suggestion to "balance" anything in this thread so stop acting the victem. Unfair Testing? Testing is testing, get off your high horse. Cloned dragons is just a way to facilitate higher level testing and to encourage more people to test on blight. Blight is there for everyone. If something is available to EVERYONE, how can it be considered an advantage.

Sorry, but biped got more than a week. A month if I remember correctly.

Go back and read your very first post in this thread.Now read what you just said... Are you argueing with yourself?

And I wished misfortune to those who went to blight and returned only to brag and behave like being on Blight give them the right to be [Censored]y over everyone else. Those who actually tested things (what blight is supposed to be), not go there to scoot, I wish them good luck.

Everyone is saying if you wanted to you could go to blight and look around. Nothing is stopping you. The information is was there partially, albeit not likely 100% correct. You'll have to do it when it hits live anyways to be sure. Stop your bickering and get back to what your issue is if you have one.

Blight isn't a scout server for you to have an advantage over the other player. Blight is there to DEBUG and TEST content. Don't forget that.
And don't even dare bringing military people here.

I havn't forgotten anything, you're jumping from tangent to tangent.If you have an issue, get on with it. Otherwise the conversation is done.My comment on military wasn't argumentative.You either can log in, or you can't, and very few have a valid reason why they couldn't. Militaryhave a valid reason why they couldn't, my guess is your not. I served during Desert Storm, and the Haitian Liberation. Don't even presume to tell me what I can and can't discuss with relation to military personnel. Get constructive with your whinning or go away.

[Tantalyr]

Now that the lair locations, sizes and auction times have been posted, I'm pretty comfortable with the 11-day auction period, particularly considering that we can now see that the range of lair sizes isn't nearly as huge (or momentous) as the difference in plot sizes during the post-merge auctions. The smallest lairs are 70 cubes while the largest (not counting the two dragon guild lairs) are 150 cubes, and the latter constitute about half of all the lairs being auctioned. By comparison, the plots auctioned post-merge ranged from 25x25 all the way to 100+ x 100+.

My chief puzzlement/concern now is the decision to prohibit guilded dragons from purchasing, and thus building upon, lairs in their guild communities until all auctions are concluded (i.e. not until November 29). I am, candidly, concerned that there may still be some showstopping bugs in lair construction yet undiscovered on Blight. That is just the nature of test servers--unless somehow every single player is convinced to log into a test server to try out a particular system, almost invariably one or more bugs crop up once the system goes to live servers simply due to the . . . umm . . . creativeness of players in stressing any system.

We already know of two problems which, as I read here, are yet uncorrected. The first is terrain interference which doesn't show up on the planning interface window. The other is the inability to work on more than one lair structure at a time without all other planned structures going poof. What other bugs may pop up once the entire dragon populations of Order, Chaos and Unity start constructing lairs remains disconcertingly unknown.

If guilded dragons could immediately purchase and commence work on guild lairs once the auctions started, then we would have that many players lending a hand to catching any bugs in the system, and hopefully giving the devs ample opportunity to correct those problems before the auctions end. Otherwise, there is a very real risk that there will be a lot of very unhappy dragons who can't build on their lairs due to some bug that might well have been caught by a live server guild lair builder, and corrected by the devs, well before auctions end.

I just don't see the need or justification for running that risk.