My Review of Vanguard

[Frith-Rae]

I can tell you put alot of thought into you post...it shows.
It's true..leveling is on the slow side in VG. I think that is a good thing. It keeps most of the " instant gratification " types away. They can keep playing WoW for all I care. I'd rather have 100k mature players than 8 million " are we there yet?" types.
It took me over 9 months to ding my first 100 in Horizons and thats with 40+ hour a week playing. Mind ya..I level slowly due to my tendency to goof around too much. I also was a avid anti-power leveler..as I like to enjoy a game the way it was meant to be enjoyed..and don't like to group much.
My point being...I find nothing wrong with leveling slow...There is nothing to do once ya reach the top cept going around talking about how cool it is to be max level. I always end up just making an alt and doing it all over again anyways.
Its the journey I enjoy ... destination doesn't matter.

Well you're talking to someone who in over 2 years in Hz has a 90 level dragon (only), and whom it took over a year and some months to hit 60 in WoW. So I don't have a problem with leveling slowly, as long as I feel rewarded for my effort and time spent. I do other things, I stop and smell the roses - obviously.

However, on the first exp. nerf in VG during beta, it just got "not enough reward for time spent" for me. I don't even want to think how I'd feel if I'd then paid and got another exp. nerf on top of it. Prior it seem to be going just fine, it was still slower than WoW, which is fine, but I still felt it was productive to actually you know adventure and quest. But then after the first nerf I logged in and my experience crept by so slow, doing the exact same stuff, that I never even got to level one more time before the beta closed down on my level 10, but I did hit level 9 I think on my Warrior (Or was it 7 to 8). The bar moved so slowly for each kill, and slow for quest completion - it just became not worth it for me.

This is comign from someone who HATES the grind feeling. I never grind mobs without a quest. I can't do it for 10 minutes without that "end point in sight" or "end reward in sight" before wanting to log off and take a nap. And with the nerfed exp in beta, it started to feel like grinding. Because of what little reward or progress I was having on my leveling - it just didnt' feel worth it anymore. To me.

So that was my issue with it. I dont' mind slower, I do mind what I saw as "creeping..." LOL. I minded that I'd kill 30 things that each time almost killed me (you know those ******** blue dots), and I hadn't even made 1/4 a level, I'd turnt he quest in and...still hadnt' made 1/4 level . To me it just crossed the line from slow to TOO slow.

Which still won't stop bots or powerlevelers as there's nothing in the combat mechanics that keeps them from doing their thing (as say there is in Spellborn with the manual triggering).

I'd rather say have more levels, than have each level go so slow

And for AAO (You can read the whole review thread on RR btw, its like mutliple pages from multiple Points of view), I would be one that would tell you not to bother. But everyone likes different things, so its hard. I do know several other peopel who are going to wait a few more months to see how the game goes and what they change before purchasing. I also know that many more people are preordering LOTR and looking forward to it more. But then it IS to each's own. So I'd say read all the player reviews, take what you like to do and their opinion with the grain of salt - and then decide .

[Avarr]

So is Vanguard worth purchasing? Or should I hold out for the free trial and/or the release of LotrO? Haven't made the plunge to buy the hard copy yet (hate to waste 50 bucks on something that might not appeal to me).

I believe it is, but as some others have said: It all depends on what you like. The previous posters have covered most of what it is about. I have never played WoW, so I can't say it is the same thing or not. I think it is a bit unfair to give the game negative points for choosing WoW-like items. Most MMOs (if they are smart) review their predecessors, and cherry pick the items that work. While I myself have never been interested by WoW, clearly there is something about it that works - so it would be tough to fault VG for copying those items.

Vanguard definately has the feel of the original EQ when it was first released. Which I really liked, so it has a very familiar feel to it. It has some things in common with HZ, as well. Racial abilities, no zones, crafting (but VGs is much more involved), and housing. It has other things that we have always wished for: Boats, pets, and mounts.

I have only played up to level 10, but it is fun so far. The quests move you along, without much of a grind. I tend to solo as a cleric, so completing the quests sometimes means a lot of time spent picking mobs off one at a time. But to me that doesn't feel grindish. As you level, new quests pop from different NPCs, so it has a definite progression feel to it. But, this is only thru lvl 10, not sure how it is after the fact.

One thing to keep in mind is that you need a decent machine to play it, but it's probably not as bad as some make it out to be. My machine:
Athlon XP 3200+
1 gb Corsair XMS Ram
Radeon 9800 pro Vid card

The game automatically set itself up for "balanced mode" for me. It's still pretty, but not as good as it could be. The game runs with minimal lag, but there are some video artifacts and what not. I'd suggest 2gb ram and a better card - that's just not in my budget right now.

If you are truly on the fence as far as trying the game, find out if someone you know bought the box. In the box, there is a "Free 10-day Trial". You can install the game from their discs, and try it for free. If you like it, you have to buy the game.

Just my 2 farthings. ;-)

[AA0]

Alright.. thats kinda unexpected. I don't plan on getting VG any time soon. I hear of the bugs, the grind, the nerfs, and the system reqs I don't have.. sounds tempting *cough*
Maybe when that dev team figures out what they are really going to do with the game, I might try the free trial, but there is no way I'm paying for it as it stands.

Oh, and I read the RR page weeks ago :P

[Zachyattacky]

One thing I really didn't like about Vanguard was when me and my dad went out and bought it we were quite excited(this was during the time Chaos was down) so we got home and poped it in. It got all done and we got on, made our characters and we poped into existance in Vanguard. We looked around and realized we were 200,000,000,000,000,000 miles away from eachother.
Maybe we just don't know about faster transportation, but we are really bummed about not being able to play together. Other than that I loved Vanguard. I still like Horizons better, but Vanguard is a great get-away.

[Unicorn's Lady]

I don't know if this will help anyone, but here is what I wrote to a friend last week about Vanguard.....

#1. Vanguard isn't Horizons. But it so far has come the closest to that Horizons feel that I've taste-tested so far and in some ways it feels like what Horizons might of been if they were recreating it. On the beta forums parts of the game was compared by the playtesters to UO, EQ (both 1 & 2), WoW, DAoC, SWG, & Horizons, so Sigil definately gleaned some good ideas from many areas and crafted this game with their own view.
#2. You can't be a dragon. You can't multiclass. But it does have a lot of different races you can be including 3 animal races and of course dwarves & elves. It also has 15 different adventure classes and all the ones I've tried so far have been interesting. And you're allowed 8 characters per acct. Oh! about underwater races. Not at this time, although I did read they do want to add them in the future. (Hey, at least for now we can swim)
#3. It does have fairly detailed crafting, although again you can't multiclass in it and no, it is not race specific (Though dwarves & gnomes at least do get a little racial boost in Harvesting. I'll have to get the new racial benefits written down soon.). The 3 main catagories are: Blacksmith for metal items such as armor & weapons; Outfitter for leather and cloth items; & Artificer for stone items, wood items, and jewelry (Alchemy didn't quite make it in, but as far as I know they are still planning to add it later). To build houses, boats, & some advanced items you'll need stuff more than one of the classes. Also when you get more advanced you can specialize in subcatagories.
Harvesting has it's own catagories, but you're allowed to have up to 2. They are: Mining (metal), Quarrying (stone & gems), Lumberjacking (wood), Skinning (leather), & Reaping (fiber). Interesting note, if you harvest the same skill in a group (such as a bunch of folk grouping and then mining) you'll be able to gather more from a resource node and are more likely to get special resources.
Player made items are suppose to be usually better than what you can find in monster loot and there are ways to add extra benefits to an item while you are making it. Unlike Horizons you don't get a piece paper when you learn a recipe, so you won't fill up storage with them, but you also can't pass a copy onto another person. The fastest way to gain skill in crafting is to go to an NPC and get a work order from them. It is also a way to earn a little bit of coin.
If you don't want to hang in the various areas auction chats to sell your stuff, there are NPCs in most of the major communities that let you put your stuff up for sale on the local Exchange; similar to Horizons town connies except the list is for a whole continent, not just one town. When you make a purchase from the Exchange, it is sent to the mailbox and you recieve an in-game notice that you have mail. To get your purchase, just go to the nearest mailbox, click on it, it shows you a list of your in-game mail, and click on the letter that is sent from the Exchange. The mailbox system is also great for sending stuff from one of your characters to another or sending stuff from one continent to another. So far I'm sent items that my dwarf couldn't use to JJ's & Matt's gnomes and resources to Matt for his blacksmithing. P.S. It's great for leaving a msg for someone too!
#4. There are many quests in this game, but you don't have to do them to raise your adventuring levels. I do recommend doing the beginning quests though, because it will teach you a lot about how to play Vanguard. (And I've found most of beginning scenarios fun & interesting). For almost each player race you have a seperate starting place and beginning scenario. A couple like the Wood Elves & the Raki do start in the same place. (See my Vanguard Races & Classes album to get the starting areas http://picasaweb.google.com/UnicornsLady/VanguardSRacesClasses )
#5. Housing is similar to Horizons. There are certain areas were plots have been designated and on those plots you get certain building choices of what can be built there. During the open beta only housing was set up as the choices, but there will also be merchant shops, and crafting shops. Most of the plots I found during open beta cost 1 gold or 2.5 gold, but there were a few huge plots that were costing 1000 platinum.
Unlike Horizons you do have to pay a weekly rent (I think Dark Ages of Camelot does this), and for the 2.5 gold plot it was 5 silver. The only outlandish rent I saw was on the 1000 platinum plots, the rent there was 1000 platinum a week. I figure they'll have to lower that rent in the long run or even the biggest of the guilds won't buy those plots. (Here's the link to the album with the plot pics, I just don't have them labled yet. http://picasaweb.google.com/UnicornsLady/VanguardBetaPlots )
Also unlike Horizons, buildings have doors and we will be able to decorate the interiors of our homes, set who is even allowed in the building & when, and other advanced options. So! No more worries about someone ransacking our homes! (abit like UO houses)
#6. Vanguard's world is big. Like modern Horizons big! Maybe even bigger. So to get around the world besides your own two feet there are horses that you can buy by the time you are 10th lvl. and to get from one continent to another or out to the various islands (in case you don't want to swim all that way & possibly get eaten) there are boats. There are ships that run regularly from certain ports to get you to the next continent over, but you can also build your own boat and take it wherever you wish.
When you are advanced enough, you can used fancier steeds, such as Unicorns, Camels, & Shadow Hounds (think Hellhound) and eventually when you're high enough winged steeds such as Griffons, Pegasi, Dragons, and JJ saw a Phoenix. (I got to fly on a Griffon one night during the open beta, you again can go anywhere with it (not a set route like a lot of the other games) and it felt quite a lot like the how the dragons fly in Horizons. Fun!)
#7.Gnomes hate Dwarves, Elves hate Goblins & Orcs, and Goblins & Orcs hate just about everyone!! There are Factions in this game. Which means for those of us not on the PvP server certain communities will have NPCs that might kill your character on sight in the beginning until you kill enough of their enemy that they decide you're ok. The communities that will kill a certain race on sight I have also listed with the pictures of the races.
#8. Pets! Besides your steed, so far I've found that several of the beginning quests will give you a temporary pet. As a gnome I got this huge hawklike creature http://picasaweb.google.com/UnicornsLady/VanguardBetaGnomeCapitalMekalia/photo#5023385031152466626 and as a dwarf a got a huge (cute in my personal opinion) spider. Also if you pick Necromancer, you learn fairly earlier how to call up an undead pet called an Abomination to help protect you and attack your enemies for you. I don't know if there are more pets since I haven't gotten very far yet.
#9. If you wish to play together immediately I suggest you play the same race. Unlike Horizons everyone does not start at the same place. Most of the races have different starting spots and they are spred out on 3 large continents (one of the continents is an archipelago). Some of the few races that start together or almost together are: Halflings & Thestran humans (start in nearby communities); Lesser Giants & Varanjar (start in same community); Half Elves & Kojani humans (start in same community); Wood Elves & Raki (start in same community); Orcs & Goblins (start on same island, maybe same community); Qaliathari humans & Mordebi humans (start in nearby communities); Kurashasa & Varanthari (start in nearby communities). Hopefully I'll get some good info in the near future where to go to get to the ports that have the ships that will take you from one continent to another.
AND! Don't forget Factions!! People already have been accidently killed when they didn't know that the town they were meeting friends at was Kill On Sight for their race. So if you do plan on making different races, plan on not meeting up immediately and meet somewhere safe for all of you.
#10. Just like Horizons was Vanguard requires a beefy computer. My computer is barely cutting it, I stand still alot and I'm at the lowest settings. JJ's & Matt's computer that are only a year old are doing fine though.
Here is Sigil's recommended specs for a computer to run Vanguard (it should of been heavily recommended!):
Windows 2000/Windows XP/Vista
3.0Ghz Intel processor or 2400+ or higher AMD processor
2GB of RAM.
100% DirectX 9.0c compatible computer. Vertex and Pixel Shader 2.0 compatible hardware with 256MB of texture memory.
100% DirectX compatible sound card
Broadband Internet connection
16x speed DVD-ROM
20 GB of hard drive space

Ack! This turned out huge! And I haven't even started telling you about Diplomacy! Sorry, but believe it or not, I'm just skimming the surface. Vanguard is even more detailed than Horizons and even after a whole month of playing entensely the 3 of us have a lot more to learn of the basics. But it has been a whole of of fun so far!!!!

Nellie Lovett/Ochre Tekton
of Azure Twilight in Carmo on Order

[Thamoris]

* Update *
Since my first review of this game based on my experiences ...much has changed. I now have 3gb of ram ( had 1gb before )...AMD 3500, Nvid 6600 ....and the game runs so much smoother. I still play on high performance BUT I have nearly everything " good" cranked up. There are few shaders and lighting effects type things I leave set low...and grass..I have grass turned off. It doesn't bother me and it saves about 10fps. So they have done alot of work on the games engine. I average around 25-30 fps with this setup. A high end AMD or Intel setup with at least 2gb of ram will average around 50-60 fps based on some talking around. * note..game is not optimized yet for Vista or Nvids 8800's.

A bunch of new content has been added...including a facelift on nearly all weapons, new mobs, and quests. I expect events to start here fairly soon ...currently the game staffers are taking time off from nearly a year of intense work.

I'm having a blast in Vanguard...pure and simple. It has everything Horizons had...cept multi-classing, playable dragons, and dynamic spawns. That's probably my biggest complaint really....the mobs and resources all spawn in the exact same spot every single time. Now..out in the open the wander around alot...but in dungeons...it's really noticable.

Anyways....Having a blast there ... certainly reccomend this game to anyone that likes Horizons style gaming.

[Zarcharien]

I've been playing Vanguard since release on the RP server and I'm really enjoying it!

I recommend anyone to atleast consider trying it. Maybe you will like it, maybe not, but worth the shot imo.

[Tcei]

I've enjoyed Vg quite abit here lately. I was in beta 4 for a bout a week, then quit because it was unplayable for me. (not enough ram and outdated vid card)
Came back at release after I'd upgraded and was able to play but still had alot of lag(avged 5-8fps). A month later im now able to play with only occasonal lag issues and avg 20-25ish in fps.

Graphicly this game is amazing, even on balanced settings, things are very detailed and beautiful.

After trying several characters I finaly settled on a wood elf bard, currently she's lvl 13. The first 10 lvls go by fairly quickly. Not a fast as wow,granted by fast enough. After 10 there's a big dip in how fast exp is gained it seems. Those who played eq will find it familar. How ever I find I only have to grind very little currently to lvl, most of my exp I get while doing quest. The quest themselves vary. While many hold true to the classic Kill/collect x and go here type quest, I've run into a few that are different. I've even had a quest involving Vg's flaging system (These are quest that will only pop up suddenly if you've done certain other things), where after I finished all the newbie area quest and was traveling to the next area I was attacked by a npc that only spawns for you if you've completed all the quest there. This led to a new chain of quest and a decent item.

The world is definitely huge. Travel on foot takes time (unless you're a bard :P ), you can get a basic horse starting at lvl 10. I found it to be fairly expensive at that lvl, but I think that may depend on how fast you earn coin, and location. However its not overly expensive as even if you're a little short a little bit of questing/grinding cash dropping mobs will fix it fast. In addition to horses you'll also be able to aquire other mounts such as cammels and worgs/hell hounds
There's also the option to travel by player made boats (i've seen a few of these there kinda neat), as well as npc boats, but it appears currently that there's and issue with the npc boats, so they're using porters for now at most (all?) major port cities. There are also flying mounts in game (I've not seen any yet tho), these are supposed to be the high lvl mounts, that you wont get till you're 47ish or so. These are supposed to be the fastest form of travel in the game, and amongst the known beast that will carry you around are griffins, pagusus (Pagusi?), wavyrns, and even drakes (I really want one of those!). Another note about mounts is that they also act as extra storage.

Crafting I cant say much on as I've only done it all of 3 times, but its definitely more involved than any other game I've ever played, and from what I've seen/heard, building really big stuff such as houses and ships takes a large group of folks to do. I've not heard of any houses being built yet on my server, as almost everyone seems to prefer ships as they are storage + travel, but ships apperantly take awhile, as would houses I imagine. Im willing to bet that the high end/lvl ships and houses will take a fairly large community effort, similar to what we've seen here in Hz.

As for diplomacy, its not really my thing tho i do play it from time to time, and is definitely a mini game in and of itself. In addition to being able to grant bonuses to everyone in a city when yo ucomplete a diplo quest i've also heard rumors that its possible to sway or even change the power of factions within a city.

Of interest to roleplayers, there's a huge list of emotes to use. A freind and me went thru just about all of them on day. As far as I can tell most have an animation to go with them, but there's no way to actualy sit in a chair or laydown *sigh*.

Over all I'd say this game is very good. There's definately alot of similarities between it and eq, espically in the look and feel of the game.
There's also things that are familar from horizons, most notable being no zones or instances, housing, the ability to fly (granted you do have to have a mount..). And if you're a darkelf, the exposure to lots n' lots of Dragons!
(There are lots of dragons flying over the newbie delf area, scared the pee outa me the first time I saw a shadow of one pass over me...).

*edit* almost forgot I wanted to show ya'll an example of the graphics

[Kulamata]

Nice scenery; where is it?

[Thamoris]

Nice scenery; where is it?

Do I sense sarcasim?

I've played mostly in Thestra....seen great vistas there, many of them. Some along the shore ..looking for miles down the coast with very detailed shipwrecks scattered about. Ya know there are ghosts and treasures down there. I've looked out for miles from the tops of light houses. Looking at the numerous and varied trees...can see every single leave on a certain tree over a mile away. That's on high performance settings with some details and LOS cranked up...mind ya. As a Gnome I had a great time looking at their town..buried inside a mountain in a crystal cave. It had the perfect Gnome feel to it...perfect! You can even hear Gnome npc's do their chatter..their voices echoing off the cave walls even ! You hear the little scurry of feet as rats run by you...and who knows what else. Beautiful crystals hang from the ceiling in a nice random fashion.

As a Dark Elf in Qalia it was vast world of desert. Not very attractive at first unless one is a desert buff. Then the sun sets....omg...some of the best sunsets I've seen in game and I don't even have the fancy cloud option turned on. Sunrises much the same.

As a Wood Elf I spent alot of time running back and forth between massive trees...where the Wood Elves made their houses. I ran on vines ..big fat vines that swooped this way and that all over the place. I fell off and died a couple times when I wasn't paying close enough attention. Flowers are all over...with bits of sunlight peeking in through the dense umbrella of tree branches overhead.

As a Goblin I enjoyed looking at all the crazy ..almost alien looking plants. A wierd mix of rocky highlands mixed in with random thick jungle.

Even the Halfings had some nice scenery....I felt like I had just stepped into a LOTR world.

So ya.....great scenery...and graphics ! I could give many more examples...but I'm writing a novel here. You can go to www.lhguild.com get password and look at our screenies posted in the " photos" section.. if you like...remember they are taken on an old cpu even.

Recent fixes to some memory loss issues has increase performance greatly ! Lots of ram helps..2gb is best really. I put 3 gb in and even on an old AMD 3500 and Nvid 6600 I get 25-30 fps with many of the goodies turned way up.

[Kulamata]

I'm sorry, sarcasm was not intended. I spent nearly all of my time in Qalia, and was underwhelmed by the scenery. Having gamma and brightness turned up for older eyes at night tended to wash the already bland colors out a bit as well. But that didn't have anything to do with my post, which simply reflected being tired and hasty.

I didn't see anything like the scene you posted, and was wondering where the screenshot was taken. It is nice.

[Tcei]

The area in question is Jaelen's Crossing on Kojan. The floating islands in the background are the islands that the Raki used to get to Telon.

[Thamoris]

I'm sorry, sarcasm was not intended. I spent nearly all of my time in Qalia, and was underwhelmed by the scenery. Having gamma and brightness turned up for older eyes at night tended to wash the already bland colors out a bit as well. But that didn't have anything to do with my post, which simply reflected being tired and hasty.

I didn't see anything like the scene you posted, and was wondering where the screenshot was taken. It is nice.

No worries then mate

Qalia is the least attractive to me. There are only a few nights that are that dark...and ya....it can be a bit annoying. Most of the nights are lit by the moon. A couple nights are almost as bright as day ( full moon ). I have this " UltraBrite Mode" on my monitor that helps alot on the dark nights.

Thestra is the most developed. Lots of pine trees and mountains with grassy plains scattered about.

Kojan is the least developed so far.... Content wise. Lots of thick forest, jungle..mountains.

The world is freakin huge with even more room to expand into. It's almost TOO big...population is really spreading out now. It's fun breaking in a new mmo world though...I like being a part of the changes and evolution of the mmorpg.

[Thamoris]

Update !
Well..I've been playing Vanguard for about 3 months now and felt the need to update what has been changed...fixed..ect.
First...I'll start off by stating how much I miss my fantasy life in Horizons. =( I miss the small town type feel and my guild mates. I lost my mmorpg virginity with Horizons...and will be forever spoiled by many features present in the game, but I do not miss watching my beloved Hz world whither away into a mere skeleton of a game that at one time held such great promise to break new ground in the world of mmorpg's. I have seen now that Horizons was trying to do things never before even thought of in the mmorpg world . I've always known this...but seeing a $30 million game try to do some of the same things ( ie..massive seemless world for starters ) and struggle at it..despite the money spent....gives me renewed appreciation for what AE / Tulga where trying to do.

Since I last posted Vanguard has indeed slowed down a bit. The Legendary Heroes has lost 30-40 members due to attrition..with most of them leaving the game...a few leaving the guild due to our casual play style. We anticipated this ...most of those folks were picked up at random really fast anyways just to get the ball rolling. We are now recruiting in a much more deliberate fashion...with an emphasis on quality over quantity. That's a brief status of our faction there..case any where interested.
The game has improved alot ! Particularly on mid to low end machines. I do not know what they did in that last patch..but I was able to adjust my graphics setting from High Performance to Balance settings without losing any fps. ( AMD 3500, 3gb ram and Nvid 6600 ). A few hundred new quests have been put in game. A few dozen new mobs. A complete rework of weapon and armor models. Chunk crossings are much softer now and I hear fewere reports of game breaking issues. Even those with hard bugs before...seem to be doing better now. My number one issue in VG is the fact that I am finding myself playing too many alts and unable to focus/progress in game. This is because so many of the adventure schools are so freakin good and different from eachother. Vanguard has done an excellent job of balancing each school so they are both unique and balanced...here is what I've played so far..from a soloing perspective cause I solo most of the time.

Bloodmage ( beta) - strong school...high damage and can heal. Squishy though so can't handle multiple mobs well solo.

Shaman ( beta ) - I haven't played much as Shaman..but they get to change shape into various animals as they level up..seems fun..will play more someday

Cleric ( beta ) - best solo and group school you can get. Heavy armor, two handed mauls and lots of heals. The strongest school in game in terms of survivability.

Ranger - This has been the hardest. They can wield two weapons making for some nice damage output, but I have found little use for my bow cept to pull. My ranger is only lv 7 though..Ill play till lv 10 before I decide if I want to continue in that school. Tanking in leather armor with no heals yet has proven a challenge. I do enjoy my invisability however. It's very effective in sneaking around mobs to get where ya wanna go.

Paladin - My main is a Pally. Great school...next to Cleric I would have to say the best in overall survivability. Heavy armor...many different weapons one can use...and good healing ability. I'm level 21 in that school...yes..I level slowly. I'm in no rush =)

Necromancer - Many seem to love this school. As a Gnome I could make 1 crystal every hour to aid me in combat...they can heal health, energy or one of several other buffs. It's a good school...lots of DOTS and you can summon an undead pet to aid you in combat ..pet stays as long as you want. No time restrictions. I dumped the toon though because I guess I just don't like playing caster types. Those that do however...will likely enjoy this school.. Your pet can tank and hold aggro very well.

Dread Knight ( beta ) -Strong school...I only played to lv 7 ..and that was in beta. The early levels lacked any heals but had some cool Fear abilities that cause the mobs to do all kinds of wacky things. A ton of work has gone into this school since launch and I suspect it's even better now.

Disciple - This school was a pleasant surprise. I am playing it right now ..currently at lv 9 and loving the school. They can wield two weapons at once..doing very good damage. I have two big offensive attacks that heal me while damaging the npc...plus a few other heals. Disciple is considered a healing class. I think I get the ability to " play dead " at lv 10. Playing dead is a riot..first time I saw that I was like..wtf..group member just fell over dead..party was on the verge of a wipe out...we all died..then the Disciple ust popped back up with full health and rezed. Completely ignored by the mobs cause they thought he was dead...pretty neat imo.

Schools on the list to play?
Fighter - your standard tank type...no heals so it's kill fast or get killed. They have several abilities to hold aggro and are highly sought after for raid groups.

Bard - buffs with music..yes you buy and upgrade muscial instruments when playing this toon. They can levitate and can group levitate as well. Leather armor and can duel wield weapons. Bards have all sorts of interesting abilities. Their songs can buff self..group..extend time underwater..levitate..safe fall...all kinds of things.

Sorcerer - massive damage..very squishy. Huge nukes...massive DPS. They get a pet also...to aid in combat. One ability I like is a levitate one...jump off a high cliff with this ability and you can " glide " for a very long time..feels much like flying for a long while.. It can be cast on all group members if need be.

Rogue - This school is what I hear most " I can't solo' complaints from. This seems natural though as the Rogues have most of their special attacks geared towards groups. They are flanking attacks ...relying on another to hold the aggro while they sneak around and back stab. They go invisible too..but unlike Ranger...they can attack while invisible and not lose the invis status.

There are a couple more..I fail to remember...post is getting too long anyways

Crafting has been much improved. I am lv 10 blacksmith now and can make many newb weapons, armor and a few other things involved with ship building and house construction. When you grind levels...you use workorders. The workorders provide all necessary rescources..eliminating the need to go harvest them...and hence..removing a massive timesink as found in Horizons. You still harvest resources for player made goods however...which are much better than game dropped loot. Though game dropped loot is plenty fine to keep you fighting around your level. Player made gear can let you fight a few levels above your own.

Thats all for now. My thoughts are with you Horizons folks and wish you all well....cept those exploiters I just read about..they can rot in hell for all i care.

[Thamoris]

my ( beta ) note means I played this school long ago in the beta stages...dozens of changes have been mades since so please note...my information may not be 100% accurate..but the basic playstyle is the same. Dozens of changes..mostly for the good..have been made to all schools.

[Seenu]

I started a toon there. Great gameplay but graphics and other issues are still very buggy. You need a hefty machine to rune the game. I quit cause of all the bugs and I will go back in about 6 mons to try again.

The voice overs and music in the game really stink, thats the worst part.

[Thamoris]

I started a toon there. Great gameplay but graphics and other issues are still very buggy. You need a hefty machine to rune the game. I quit cause of all the bugs and I will go back in about 6 mons to try again.

The voice overs and music in the game really stink, thats the worst part.

You play , have played, or used to play Horizons and you quit Vanguard because of the bugs?

lol..thats a good one!

First of all..Vanguard doesn't have many bugs...and I get the same fps in Vanguard that I got in Horizons ..on the same machine.

Second of all...Horizons having been 3+ years since launch and STILL not ready for launch..lol
mind ya..I earned the right to poke fun at HZ cause I played it daily for 3 years.

You may have to adjust a few settings to get things ideal..such things as view distance don't seem to hit my system hard so I crank that sucker up. Animation distance as well. Some lighting effects I could crank up without taking a hit on my system. One can even go hardcore and tinker in some of the client files ..further optimizing game performance.

Since launch Vanguard has benefited from several very big updates...resulting in a good 20-30% performance increase and 70% of the issues found at launch are now gone. Since I installed 3gb of ram...game has been very stable.

I just found it funny to find critisism on the Horizons forums about Vanguard having too many bugs. I think Horizons holds the crown for that one mate. I could go into and compare Horizons at launch and Vanguard at launch..well..actualy I can't...there is none. I could tell horror stories about Horizon's launch that would make one cower in a corner and wet himself.

I run it on an AMD 3500
3gb 400 ddr 2 ram
Nvid 6600 256 mb vram...PCIE
Gigabyte MoBo
Seagate 250gb 7200 Rpm w/ 2mb cache

I can play Vanguard at balance settings..but prefer high performance settings with some stuff cranked up at 20-30 fps country and 10-20 fps in town. Can buy a comparable machine now for around $500. Grass density is the biggest hit for me. I thin that out.

Even on high performance ..Vanguard looks 10x better than Horizons does. To me..it IS the new Horizons..least the closest thing we will get for a long while.


What voice overs? I have yet to encounter any.

[C`gan]

To anyone out there who does play Vanguard, have they fixed the lack of utilizing dual core processors yet?

[LaughingOtter]

To me..it IS the new Horizons..least the closest thing we will get for a long while.

Not even close, mate.

Getting kicked out of groups crossing chunk lines - HZ actually IS a seamless world. Sigil still hasn't managed to do that right.

Crafting - the crafting mechanic in VG is a lot more involving, but crafting, as a sphere, is far and away a more tedious, time-consuming, annoying grind than even lairshaping managed to be. You have to grind up levels, then grind for faction to get all your recipies, then grind for more faction, then grind for gear, then grind for rare componants. In order to make anything someone can actually USE, you lose XP because you're not spending that time GRINDING.

On top of that, nobody wants to buy crafted gear because it's too expensive to make and, even now, is being nerfed to be worse than looted gear that costs 1/10 as much on the broker.

Quests: All VG offers is simple Kill X of Y/FedEx quests. HZ has far too many of those, true, but at least the HZ quest system has the capability of providing complex multistep quests that can have branching paths and multiple endings. The VG quest system is not capable - at all - of providing those. The best it can do is to offer players a choice of what quest to do, which is not even close to being the same.

Bugs: Both games had their share of bugs at launch. Which was worse? That's a matter of opinion, but VG gets my vote because I never had a bug in HZ cause me reoccuring XP rollbacks like I got in VG.

Tails: Animal races in HZ have tails. They don't, won't, and pretty much can't have them in VG.

VG excels in several areas, yes. The diplomacy system is probably the most outstanding innovation it offers, and the graphics can be just amazing. Fellowships and caravans sound fun, but they're not in yet. In fact, I'd put HZ & VG neck & neck for the "features promised but not in at launch" award.

In other areas, VG falls well short of HZ. The worst thing about it, to me, is the way Brad enshrined the idea that grind=content=effort in the minds of the development team. Grind is universal in MMOs, of course, but most view it as a necessary evil. VG embraces grind and elevates it to the status of a virtue, to the point where the True Believers will zerg someone like a pack of rabid chihuahuas on crack for criticising the amount of grind in the game. They'll drag you down and howl for more grind, because grind is good and gives what you do meaning.

The current rumor is that SOE is going to buy VG from Sigil. If true, who knows what the future holds. Personally, I think that would render most of these comparisons moot.

[Joaqim]

Not even close, mate.
......

And not to forget... my Vanguard server is alive, my Horizons server is dead.