Why I prefer Horizons to WoW

[Theros Ironfeld]

I shake my head at the peanuts posting that HZ is better than blah blah
it's not ... its different for sure but it aint better
more mature community ??
have a good look at some of the replies and then tell me some of them aint "WoW kiddies" type of replies
FYI The Conclave of Shadows formerly of Blight is functioning quite nicely on WoW and does not seem to be running into the problems some of you are posting about
A game is what YOU make of it NOT what it makes of you !
At this point in time HZ is no longer for me

[Henry Redacre]

For any and all......

The title of the thread is "Why I prefer Horizons to WoW."

Everyone is entitled to their opinion. Is there much reason to try and convince someone else that theirs is wrong? Because really, I don't think anyone is convincing anyone else. I sure as snot ain't gonna listen to someone I don't even know when they tell me I'm wrong on some internet forum.

*shrug*

[Starmind]

Hear Hear!

[Spirit]

WoW has good points... it also has bad points. It's part and parcel of its design.

I see it as an mmorpg that is for people who, otherwise, might not play any mmorpg at all. Despite there being no actual RP in WoW, ever, perhaps it could at least introduce the genre to new peeps... who could then go on to become good balanced rp-ers in other online games. Who knows! They could also go on to become ar$eholes.

In terms of 'our' kind of game, WoW is a stepping stone in the wrong direction, but at least it's attracted the eye of the media towards online worlds and brought the potential of some large investment. There will be lots of casualties, but a few gems will emerge for sure! Hz's is one such gem, hurt by an early release and everything else you already know about.

I liked WoW, but not enough to even get one char to 60 let alone 70. When in Istaria I feel I'm achieving something more meaningful and the character is more a reflection of me. In WoW I was just another pointy eared night elf with a cute a$$

Rakku

[Magnir]

I basically got burnt out on WoW.

Horizons is my game, it's the only one with such an extensive crafting ability that doesn't feel like an afterthought or that the devs don't feel they have to balance with drops from mobs that, invariably, are easier to obtain and more powerful than the crafted items.

That's pretty much what I can't stand about WoW, there's nothing you can make with their crafting system that is better than a most raid drops... unless the crafted item requires 1 (or more) raid drops itself.

[Raeshlavik]

Quoted from a piece I wrote over on MMORG.com:

To directly answer the OP, yes, people still play this game.

Since the acquisition of all game assets by Virtrium the number of new players I've seen of an evening has gone up by a lot...

I've tended to re-sub to Horizons every year, around November, since I purchased the Atari box at Best Buy back in 2005(?)... I'd log in, see what was going on, see if things had improved any, then log out and unsubscribe after a few days.

Needless to say I didn't progress very far in the game with this play style.

About a month ago I did the free trial just to see if anything had changed and, oddly enough, they had. Sure, the game is still a collection of old battle scars and has more rough edges than smooth ones, but that ads to its charm I suppose.

Ultimately, last week I went ahead and gave Virtrium the $150 or so for a year's subscription... I've been playing every night for the hour or so I get after work a month now, so I figure I might be in it for the long haul.

As I've played a lot of MMOs over the years, I guess I should draw some comparisons for anyone curious. For this I will contrast and compare Horizons with World of Warcraft as that’s the game the majority will have at least come in contact with:

Firstly, Horizons is not a "gateway MMO" (a new term being tossed around GDC these days). If anyone remembers the internet before AOL, that's Horizons - lots of mature folks co-habiting a virtual world and most have had some kind of stake in its creation such as building homes, bridges, entire towns or freeing some of the playable races.

This is completely counter to something like WoW, which is a textbook "gateway MMO". WoW has a very shallow learning curve and very little in unsupervised "figure it out on your own" - in fact you'll be told, shown, and have beaten into you everything you need to know by level 5. This, much like AOL did with the internet, makes it very easy for people to get into the 'MMO thing' with WoW... Where the problem lies is that the lower the bars for entry, the lower the level of person partaking - and before you know it you have forums full of useless trash and a game full of smack talking 12 year olds.

In something like WoW there is no connection between the player and the world... The world exists for you to exploit by way of providing things to kill to gain levels, but little else. The world is a backdrop for the fighting that you do and actually matters so little that Blizzard would prefer you to use a flight point or a flying mount to avoid it all together once it has done its time sink function.

In Horizons the game *is* the world and centers on the players trying to save it, and themselves. To this end Horizons features functionality that allows the all-pervasive ‘bad guy’ to wreck your stuff, which you built, and which will require rebuilding to be used again.

Which leads us to another difference: In Wow the ‘bad guy’ can be anyone who is usually holed up in the bottom of some instance and who has some plan for this, that, or the other and must be vanquished – and there are hundreds of little bad guys scattered around the world for your enjoyment. The other form of ‘bad guy’ in WoW is the opposing faction – we don’t exactly know why we hate them and are allowed to off them every chance we get, but that’s the way it is.

In Horizons the ‘bad guy’ is the Withered Aegis, a nameless, faceless force of evil and it’s everywhere, all the time, and trying like hell to kill you. This leads to every player being on *your* side against the unified forces of the ‘bad guy’ and creates a much more epic feeling than beating up Gruul for the 10th week in a row… I mean *why* are we killing Prince Malchezaar again? Oh, right, tier 4 helm - I forgot, sorry…

And this segues into the differences in loot: In WoW you beat up a stream of increasing level of difficulty bad guys who drop fun prizes so that you can collect the whole set.

In Horizons you do something very similar so that you can get item drops that allow crafters to make some seriously epic weapons, armor, spells, and utility thingies…

Ultimately the major difference between WoW and Horizons is that WoW is kinda like a neat amusement park; it’s full of fun rides and neat stuff to see – and every now and then they add a ride or two, maybe even a themed section, and some times if you’re lucky there is some gangland violence to partake in.

Horizons on the other hand is more like a summer camp set in a horror movie…You spend a lot of time building things, hiking around the woods, hanging out with friends, learning new skills to broaden yourself as a person - and dodging the otherworldly skeletons, zombies and demons bent on global domination or at least separating you from your soul, permanently.

[LOVWYRM]

well spoken, dragon.!!

[Tryagain]

Lots of false remarks made in that post.

Namely there is no withered aegis... hasen't been since well release. Its just not something you can debate.... ever till Vitrium adds the core opposition for the gifted. In that regard WoW's bad guys are a part of a rich and deep IP. Read some of the books they have out they are pretty good. Where WoW fails and so does HZ is that the world is static. Doesn't make much sense to kill Illidan if the next guild does it the same day. HZ and WoW are plagued here just like most games are. LOTRO makes a nice attempt at actively immersing the game's lore into mainstream play. But MMO's aren't quite there yet.

With that being said I pretty much tore the post up. The author is making the assertion that the HZ game world is dynamic when it clearly is not. Sorry but a festival does not a dynamic game world make.... ever period. Now had the game world existed as Bowman original envisioned it I would give that diatribe some credence.

Do not post BS about HZ. You will surely sell someone on that used car salesman pitch there. But you will just set people up for disappointment according to that post. The game you describe does not exist.

Of course wow is no stellar example of an MMO. Yes its very much like an amusment park. Doesn't have much depth at all... however neither does HZ.

If you want a quality MMO experience neither WoW or HZ will fit the bill. You will have to wait and be happy with whatever game you are playing at the moment.

[Velea]

Now had the game world existed as Bowman original envisioned it I would give that diatribe some credence.

Just a point of clarification, as well as a reminder...

It was not Bowman who had the "original vision" for Horizons. And from everything I've read, what Allen had as an "original vision" wasn't only totally unrealistic, but borderline impossible for a scope of any MMO anywhere.

And, I'm not saying anyone has, but remember when disagreeing with someone, disagree with their ideas, not them.

[Spirit]

It was not Bowman who had the "original vision" for Horizons. And from everything I've read, what Allen had as an "original vision" wasn't only totally unrealistic, but borderline impossible for a scope of any MMO anywhere.

I'm with you there Velea... Allen's idea was grand, but perhaps more the scope required for a series of novels rather than a game. Perhaps in time the tech will be able to do that original vision justice. i.e. when you can plug leads into your brain and literally 'live' istaria. That'll be cool for swooping on some unsuspecting gnome.

Rakku

[Raeshlavik]

Lots of false remarks made in that post.
Namely there is no withered aegis... hasen't been since well release. Its just not something you can debate.... ever till Vitrium adds the core opposition for the gifted. In that regard WoW's bad guys are a part of a rich and deep IP. Read some of the books they have out they are pretty good. Where WoW fails and so does HZ is that the world is static. Doesn't make much sense to kill Illidan if the next guild does it the same day. HZ and WoW are plagued here just like most games are. LOTRO makes a nice attempt at actively immersing the game's lore into mainstream play. But MMO's aren't quite there yet.

Actually, what I said was that HZ has the *functionality* for this sort of dynamic world: The game was designed to have real-time terrain updates and destructable player-built structures so that GM run "events" were a possibility. This functionality was even mentioned recently in the "Landscape Rendering" discussion (http://community.istaria.com/forum/s...ad.php?t=17424) on these very forums... Something like WoW cannot change anything really without pushing a client update and is therefore staic... An HZ GM could drop the land you're character is standing on into the sea at a whim or turn New Trismus into a crater, live, and is therefore dynamic.

Just because the tools are not currently being used does not mean they don't exist.

And regarding your mention of WoW's bad guys being part of a rich and deep IP, I've read all the books and have even discussed the backstory of Warcraft with Chris Metzen at both Blizzcon '05 and '07 lore panels, yet I have never seen most of the instance bosses mentioned... Sure, Ilidan and some of his cronies are brought up, but where is there mention of, say, Charlga Razorflank in Razorfen? The next expansion for Wow prior to Northrend is even being put in place to try and explain Karazhan, as the Medivh we read about in the books you mention was a hardcore recluse; not only would there not be a town just outside the tower, Medivh certainly wouldn't have had some big banquet going on or large stage performances.

With that being said I pretty much tore the post up. The author is making the assertion that the HZ game world is dynamic when it clearly is not. Sorry but a festival does not a dynamic game world make.... ever period. Now had the game world existed as Bowman original envisioned it I would give that diatribe some credence.

I think I've explained this enough up above. And you argued one point of a post containing 5 separate points - a far cry from 'tearing it up' in my humble opinion.

Do not post BS about HZ. You will surely sell someone on that used car salesman pitch there. But you will just set people up for disappointment according to that post. The game you describe does not exist.

If you would kindly correct any "BS" I've posted, I'd appreciate it.

Of course wow is no stellar example of an MMO. Yes its very much like an amusment park. Doesn't have much depth at all... however neither does HZ.
If you want a quality MMO experience neither WoW or HZ will fit the bill. You will have to wait and be happy with whatever game you are playing at the moment.

As this is a civil discussion on the subject of MMOs, what is your pick for the best MMO out there right now? Currently *I'm* having a lot of fun with Horizons after having played, roughly, 70% of the MMOs available to at least half way to their level cap - or in the case of WoW, end game raiding till my eyes bled.

[Tryagain]

those tools ?

Do not work and never have in a reliable fashion. They require to much babysitting and would have required 1 GM full time 24 hours to administer just such a system as you claim.

If they do why are they not used more ? Even when Bowman Shelled the game off to Tulga with ZERO debts why did we not see event after event ? Something that would have totally revitalized the game. Why was this not something that was actively engaged in ? The answer is simple they do not work in the fashion you believe they do. So yeah ok they exist. But so does a broken hammer... doesn't mean you can use it to pound a nail in.

Ok then your mentioned the Withered Aegis and active opponent that you battle ? Where as WoW has none... and it really doesn't. But when was the last time you battled on a front line with the Aegis ? What are its LT's ? Its captains and generals in this war ? You can hit them where it hurts I suppose ? Can you cut off their supply lines ? Can they cut off yours ? Can the withered Aegis pound the walls down in Augendahl and make the dwarves run ? Anchors were a nice attempt but they to failed. Personally I think they failed because the folks at Tulga had'nt clue one about their own game and well they were.... buggy and didn't work.

The Withered Aegis does not exist and never has in Horizons. The idea that Bowman originally had WOULD HAVE BEEN FANTASTIC !!! But we all know about that kettle of fabrications and deflection.

Now ok.... my point really is thus and its just thus. What you stated was false non of those points exist in HZ and never really have. If it was possible why has it never been done ? In doing so you will sell some on that pitch there. They will play the game and have fun till level 20 if they are a biped, a little more of they are a dragon. But as they play they will be asking where was this world you spoke of ? I believe in not setting one up for disappointment it makes them less likely to return.

There is no best MMO right now. The industry as a whole is in a nice rut and no game since UO and EQ has been able to really make the gamer go wow... now that was cool. Now there are some decent games out there. But none of them are really that great. I said you had to have one that you enjoyed. What you enjoy will change. Does HZ have the depth you require to be playing it 3 months from now ?

But if I were to rank mmo's based purely on their merit ?

1) Vanguard - was junk performance wise when it came out - loads better now but still suffers performance problems. But gameplay and design along with crafting offers the game one of the better experiences you can find right now. I would say its crafting process rivals if not surpasses HZ because it offers everything HZ does and more.

2) LOTRO - if you want a game rich in lore and very well put together for a PVE experience designed for the journey rather than the end game you can't go wrong here.

3) WoW - despite its generic appeal its a well developed game. But I think Blizzard has become complacent and is ready to be toppled.


HZ is an ok game. My objection was that I wasn't sure it was Horizons you were talking about.

[Velea]

First, Tryagain, please, please stop blaming David Bowman for the "original vision" of the game. It wasn't his, it was David Allen's. It is true that there would be NO Horizons what so ever without Bowman's leadership and drive. But this "original idea" wasn't Bowman's.

Thought I'd chime in on the "best MMO's list", though.

I disagree about Vanguard and their crafting system, at least as it was when the game was first released. I've no idea if it has been changed since about a month after release, as that is when I left the game in total frustration never to look back. I found crafting in Vanguard to be a tedious time and money sink. You didn't make items that anyone could use in order to gain levels, you did tedious grinding "quests". I was one of the highest level crafters in one area for weeks after the game came out because I pushed hard to get there figuring that would be the only way to have a market for the few goods I could make. I was wrong there, players didn't need what I crafted. And what I crafted every other crafter could also make, there was nothing special about what I could do.

Oh, and don't get me started on how factions were tied in to crafting so that because of the race I picked I could only craft a "short list" of items compared to what the tailor an island over could play. I had to turn a character from good to evil because of this poorly designed faction system. Ironically, a character that started out life due to the game storyline as evil and turned to good. In a world where good and evil didn't mean anything, I might add, beyond "have" and "have not" lists.

I'm a crafter at heart, have crafted in every single game I've ever played if there is a crafting system. Vanguard is one of the few that I've left in total frustration.

I totally agree with LoTRO. If I had time to play multiple MMO's, I'd keep my subscription on that one just for the adventuring, and that's a first for me.

WoW was way to "cartoony" and "childish" for me, so even though I played for about 6 months, I can't really say much about it.

For me, the "glory days" of MMO's will always be my time in Everquest. There was something magical about that time which had nothing to do with what the designers of the game did or didn't do, it was what the players brought to the game. And while I obviously can't speak for everyone, I have a feeling that if you surveyed most who are still playing Horizons, they would say the same. It isn't so much what the developers have done, or do, with the game that makes the magic. It's the people who play the game with them and create the world in which they play. Horizons supports that well with the ability to build communities, to change the world through world building projects (though probably most are done by now), and to have made a mark on history by participation in world events. I doubt even the most hardened skeptic can deny that.

[Raeshlavik]

those tools ?

Do not work and never have in a reliable fashion. They require to much babysitting and would have required 1 GM full time 24 hours to administer just such a system as you claim.

If they do why are they not used more ? Even when Bowman Shelled the game off to Tulga with ZERO debts why did we not see event after event ? Something that would have totally revitalized the game. Why was this not something that was actively engaged in ? The answer is simple they do not work in the fashion you believe they do. So yeah ok they exist. But so does a broken hammer... doesn't mean you can use it to pound a nail in.

I cannot say if the tools work or do not work as I'm not privy to that sort of information, but I can say that AmonGwareth indicates that these realtime tools are used on Genesis all the time for development... So I'll figure they in fact work.

The previous few companies had no interest in spending money on something as frivolus as GM hosted events. The current owner seems to be spending the lion's share of thier time fixing the game... Sure, they have done some small events, but it really does look like fixing the renderer, getting billing working, and switching over to Visual Studio .Net 2005 are the big priorities.

I'm sure once a few monitors over there in Apache Junction stop being framed by post-its, we'll start to see some of the real-time features included in Horizons utilized to a greater extent on the live servers.

Ok then your mentioned the Withered Aegis and active opponent that you battle ? Where as WoW has none... and it really doesn't. But when was the last time you battled on a front line with the Aegis ? What are its LT's ? Its captains and generals in this war ? You can hit them where it hurts I suppose ? Can you cut off their supply lines ? Can they cut off yours ? Can the withered Aegis pound the walls down in Augendahl and make the dwarves run ? Anchors were a nice attempt but they to failed. Personally I think they failed because the folks at Tulga had'nt clue one about their own game and well they were.... buggy and didn't work.

Again, I said "functionality".

In short, the answer to your questions is yes. When we have a GM core for the live servers, we can have fully tactical battles. What I stress here is that Horizons has the ability to allow a GM to enact any sort of event they desire. This is because MOBs can be spawned in and the world manipulated in real time... Most MMOs have the ability for GMs to spawn MOBs, but those MOBs can't do anything but fight the players. In Horizons, if the GM controlled WA were to break down the walls of Aughendel, the GM could right then wreck the walls, kill off the Dwarves, and everyone in the area would see it happen and it would remain so until fixed... Outside of SecondLife, Horizons is the only thing I know of with the ability to do this due to it's streaming archetechture.

Now ok.... my point really is thus and its just thus. What you stated was false non of those points exist in HZ and never really have. If it was possible why has it never been done ? In doing so you will sell some on that pitch there. They will play the game and have fun till level 20 if they are a biped, a little more of they are a dragon. But as they play they will be asking where was this world you spoke of ? I believe in not setting one up for disappointment it makes them less likely to return.

I have to simply say that you are wrong. The things I have mentioned do exist in the game; there are discussions regarding this functionality here on the boards, many players have seen these tools work real time, there are screen shots of drastically altered landscapes available with a simple Google search...

I've heard this level 20 thing bandied about on MMORPG.com many times and I just don't see it... I'm level 23 with my Dragon and 32 with my Satyr and I find there are still plenty of quests to do, things to learn, places to see, skills to master... I can see how a player used to being led about via a ring in their nose would find the post-20 game to be a bit disconcerting, but as I'm a bit more 'old school' and come from things like UO and EQ, I don't think it effects me.

If I were to only listen to the doom-sayers on the gaming forums I would have never tried Horizons after Virtrium's acquisition... But because I did read some of the other posts from people who are happy with HZ, I'm having fun every night.

There is no best MMO right now. The industry as a whole is in a nice rut and no game since UO and EQ has been able to really make the gamer go wow... now that was cool. Now there are some decent games out there. But none of them are really that great. I said you had to have one that you enjoyed. What you enjoy will change. Does HZ have the depth you require to be playing it 3 months from now ?

In a word? Yes.

But that is mostly due to the people in the game. For me HZ is more of a virtual world than an MMOG... Sure, there is the level treadmill and quest system just like every other MMO in existence, but what you don't get in every other MMO are the people who play Horizons.

In WoW I would log in and spend the next six hours with my guild on Vent (some very good/funny people) raiding some 25-man instance. But as far as the game was concerned I wasn't "Dillan, level 70 Draenei Shaman, master of elemental forces, defeater of Illidan, exalted with all, and Duelist titled arena combatant" - I was one of the DPS gears in an end-game raiding machine. I never got to be "Dillan", I was "That Shaman with the full Catacysm set"... In fact, the only things that ever differentiated me from every other Draenei Shaman on the server was that I had more uber gear, an epic flying mount, all of the trophy pets (mini diablo, murkey, the baby hippogryph, etc.) and the murlock suit... But I was still Draenei Shaman #237641.

In Horizons, even on Chaos (the non-rp server) I'm Shalkyn, the slightly silly hatchling dragon who is part of the Dragon community and has had everything from chartered hunting expeditions to teach me how Dragons fight to watching sit down debates between Ancient Dragons on the Helian and Lunus belief systems...

Even though HZ doesn't have the plethora of quest-driven content that WoW has, for me it has been a much more in-depth game overall - just because of the people playing it.

[LOVWYRM]

I agree with Velea and Spirit.
And with Raesh naturally

*takes a breath*

PLEASE, Tryagain:Lern about communication rules/science:
Basically is essential: I´m o.k.- you are o.k.
(you in the following is not you personally but generally!)

And
If you answer to an opinion- add yours- but don`t say the other one is wrong.

If you answer to feelings- don`t give your opponent the feeling he/she`s insane, only because you don`t (can`t) feel the same. There is NO right or wrong, concerning feelings.

If you answer to facts- add yours and try to argue to the purpose, use reliable sources.

Learn to differ beetween this 3 kinds

Your opponent is not your enemy-RESPECT is the key

(gosh, Ì sound like a teacher- this was the last time, Try- promised^^)

[gopher65]

I can't say exactly what Tryagain is talking about, but if I were to say "I liked the original David Bowman concept of the game" I don't think that would be an incorrect statement. It isn't stating that you liked DA's original thoughts, but rather that the redesigned post-blackout version put together by DB and the devs at the time was what you liked.

And if that is what Tryagain means, then I agree with him. Honestly the original DA version of HZ was not something I would have been likely to play, even if it were possible. It would have been an uber hardcore PvP game that would have been played entirely by 14 year old kidlets. It would have been the counter-strike of the MMOG universe.

The post-blackout version though? Sweeeet. A constantly shifting narrative rich persistent world filled with 'World Events' and giant storybook raids into enemy territory. Frontiers could be overrun, and player owned towns could spring up anywhere.

Maybe that was just as impossible as DA's version, but it caught my interest in a way that no description of another MMOG ever has, before or since.

[tjl]

a thread like this on the WoW forums would be approaching 15 pages of ascii art, l2p, and various other derogatory acronyms. the community does not feel like a MMO community. like others have stated, it feels like watching 12 year olds argue in line at a theme park or something. it carries over into the game, and it's very hard to separate yourself from it... due to the massive amounts of subscribers.

/off rant.

[Lillyjo]

I played wow for almost a year when I left horizons, got burnt out and was bored to death, then went to eq2, been in there for a while and still hated thier crafting and hated the quests that you had to get a group together to complete, and hated the diffent dungeons that your (Set Armor pieces) were scattered in. after 8 months of eq2 I couldnt get horizons out of my memory, and wondered if it was still around, I happened to log onto the community forums in July and saw some activity on the game, it was rising again from its dust, and still some of the oldtimers stuck by the game even though the mismanagement of EI..curses.. who tried their best to totally desetroy a good game, a family game, a community based game, that people worked to gether in those who helped one another..for free or pay..
My computer burnt and i had to get a new one and was totally upset when I couldnt play Horizons again, couldnt buy a new machine without special order with windows xp.. my machine cant support the xp the maker of it doesnt provide drivers for xp so I am using a borrowed machine, I have a level 60 on wow..and highest in craft if you can call it that..and eq2 I have a level 72 and 70 crafter, and I hate their craft system, . and you can only make 1 type of crafter per character, not a master builder or master crafter in those games. Just imagine i can make a shop that i can use to build things in and it workss..and my shop gives me a bonus to my skills above a commuity shop..
I miss the traveling blights and the cores that would spring up and I also miss some of the live events when the dM's would come into game and create the monsters that would wipe out the groups trying to defend the towns but thats ok.. it take time and attention to do that. but it was fun and funny and at times not too funny like the meeting on the isle of drowned when the confectionary meeting was taking place and at the end they called the son of someone forgot his name and he killed all of us crafters there in our crafting gear..lol very unexpected...funny but not so funny..but when the anchors would appear near the towns ..everyone would go to kill the anhcors, and the blights that defended it..it was something to see everyone working together to rid a town or community of the problems in the area.
I think horizons is the best basic game out there that teaches people that working together for the betterment of all is a good way to go.
Lillyjo...chao's server

[LaughingOtter]

The answer is simple they do not work in the fashion you believe they do. So yeah ok they exist. But so does a broken hammer... doesn't mean you can use it to pound a nail in.

Your assertion here is totally inaccurate. The landscape & spawn tools work exactly as Raeshlavik described in his post. In fact, they work dangerously well.

It is possible to use them on live servers, in real time, with players logged in. Doing so is a great way to trash your game world, destroy player properties (and everything stored in them), and leave players stuck in impossible situations (want to screw someone VERY badly? Move their bind point to the Forbidden Zone! There's a forced-recall effect for non-WM characters...).

Sorry, Tryagain, but the truth is that Horizons has the capability of being 'dynamic' in the fullest sense of the word. Why isn't it used, then? Because realtime changes must never, ever be made on a live server. The risk of damage and loss of playability is too great.

[gopher65]

Sorry, Tryagain, but the truth is that Horizons has the capability of being 'dynamic' in the fullest sense of the word. Why isn't it used, then? Because realtime changes must never, ever be made on a live server. The risk of damage and loss of playability is too great.

This may be true, but what I heard was that the use of these tools was forbidden on live servers because it slowed the hamsters down to a crawl and caused the server to attempt to commit Seppuku. Kinda like how when I attempt to run HZ while doing a full scan with McAfee and having MS Excel compute a self referencing recursive matrix it overloads out my computer and each individual action progresses at a snail's pace. That was the rumour going around pre-merge anywho.