Tokens for plot reclaims?

[Creme]

About a week and a half ago a staff member mentioned in dragon chat on Chaos the upcoming transfer of Unity characters to Chaos/Order. I missed the start of the discussion, but I did see something mentioned about the possibility of tokens being awarded to those who owned lairs/plots.

Could we get some confirmation on if this is to occur?

I know a number of long time players that have been wanting to upgrade to a larger plot, or get a lair that have been unable to and a token situation, if managed the same way in previous plot auctions, would mean that no amount of gold bid could compete against a token bid.

So someone with a token from a 20x20 plot could wind up winnning a lair bid when longtime existing shard players would not be able to win a gold bid on the same property.

Please consider the implications and fairness of a token system and the impact on existing long time shard inhabitants, prior to implementing this.

As I mentioned above, it was stated it as a possibility, not a certainty.

[LaughingOtter]

About a week and a half ago a staff member mentioned in dragon chat on Chaos the upcoming transfer of Unity characters to Chaos/Order. I missed the start of the discussion, but I did see something mentioned about the possibility of tokens being awarded to those who owned lairs/plots.

I might be mistaken, but I think I recall that discussion, or on every like it. If I'm correct, I gave the response in question as a statement of personal opinion regarding plot reclaimations. I recall making a point of stating that it was only my personal opinion as a player, not any form of official statement from Virtrium, but it sounds like that part of the statement might have been missed.

[Creme]

I logged in to a discussion of syntax, the use of the word "merge" versus "transfer" and then saw a statement of the possibility of using tokens.

I'm looking for feedback/input and the pros/cons of using a token compensation system and how it would impact existing players.

Coming in at the middle of a discussion, it's not possible to know if a player/staffer is speaking "ex cathedra" or as a player, unless there are disclaimers made every few sentences.

[pevil2000]

I would assume (or like to assume) that if this goes ahead it would work as a set amount, rather than "take any lair/plot you want". Being one of those from Unity wanting a new lair on Chaos, the way I envision it working would be that I get a 'token' worth 518s (what I paid for my lair) that can be used to purchase another lair/plot that costs 518s or less. Buy a smaller/cheaper one, I would lose out on the money. Perhaps if I bought a more expensive one, then it could be used for 518 of the value and I have to pay the rest.

If it goes to auctions, then either it should work the same way or no, tokens shouldn't be used. Having not been through a plot reclamation, I'm kinda hoping it won't take the form of auctions anyway, and that lairs will simply be emptied and put back up for sale. *shrugs* I wouldn't be too thrilled with an auction simply coz I never had much extra money to bid against people with, plus will most likely either be at work or asleep when these auctions would be taking place due to the time difference.

But considering its supposedly planned for when the Unity transfer happens, and that isn't even going to be in testing until "sometime in the new year", I don't think we really need to speculate and worry too much for the time being.

[Jayne]

Sadly, I have heard much concern that many will not have a fair chance at a good plot to due others having excessive amounts of gold aqquired in an unfair fashion.

Perhaps this can be address too, along with the token issue.

Not sure how things would be made fair, a very tough issue and task to deal with, but maybe Virtrium can sort it out.

[Creme]

This could be said of gold acquired on any shard. No one but the GN developers/WMs would know what type of enforcement was performed with some of the various "bugs" that were present in game at different points in time. Hard work will let anyone gain coin, the harder the work and the more time spent in game, whether it be from working highly funded plots/lairs or from specializing in the sale of hard-to-acquire components (I recall some players demanding the removal of Nadia so they could charge 50-100silver prices on some comps) or from killing mass quantities of the coin dropping mobs in game, the greater the earnings.

And to some, anything earned above and beyond what they have managed to accumulate in their own time playing is unfair, in fact, if someone has something and another doesn't, you can pretty much guarantee that someone will cry unfair, it is, sadly, in some human nature to cry unfair rather than put hard effort.

The token situation is different than how much work 1 player puts in versus any other player. Now, were tokens granted to ALL players that own plots/lairs on any shard (should they choose to turn in their existing plot/lair for a token), then this might be something to be considered.

[Jayne]

True Creme.

I do think Unity deserves something for losing there plots and everything though. How or what, again hard to say. I would think that there would be enough plots/lairs to go around, but I have no idea on the player status of the game.

[Creme]

Absolutely, there should be some compensation for the property they lost. This thread is not intended to say that nothing should be awarded, or that the loss of property is not serious. Rather it is to bring up issues that may arise out of a token-system, for example, a token for a 20x20 plot could beat out a coin bid (as was the case in the initial auction post-merge, where a token outbid ANY coin bid).

[Deth]

Well One thing. maybe it is taking so long as they are trying to figure out a way to pull every thing on the toons along with the toons. Maybe they are trying to figure out how to do a full novian pull as well as anything that may be in storage on the plots of the toons so that when they do transfer you open your vault and it explodes in your face it is so over stuffed with your plot stored items and all the novians from your buildings.

[Jayne]

ROFL Deth,

Yea you open inventory or vault and all of a sudden a whole pile of stuff rolls out onto the ground, looters come out from nowhere and start grabbing all they can including the clothes on your back

Yea hope they working it all out.

[Aaelefein]

I do, in part agree with the token idea. However...

I think if tokens are issued at all, it should be just for the Unity-alts that are ported over to Chaos/Order. Why you might ask?

Easy...Order/Chaos players have had more than ample time to find, buy, earn gold, build plots, etc...even with the derth of owned (but unplayed) plots out there.

Of course there is the slight problem of Unity players that have already made toons on Order/Chaos and may already have a plot...not sure exactly how to approach that problem, though I am sure it is doable.

One problem I see with having tokens trump coin bids is what if there are multiple token-bids on a single plot? My suggestion for tokens in general, and this inevitable scenario is rather complicated:

• Token's are assigned a value based on the Unity Plot previously owned and are 'worth' a predetermined value, maybe 2 or 3 times the value of the unity plot (An increase to partially recompense for their loss, but doesn't just drop coin into the toon's pocket)
• Only Unity-Alts that had a plot to begin with can get a token.
• Not sure if current auction-coding can handle this, but allow for additional funds to be added on top of the 'token-value'.

I am very much against the idea of token's trumping all-coin bids. The last auction I saw (Last one done actually) I saw plots that sold for 10-20 times their listed value. What might normally cost 500s sold for as much as 10-20 gold.

Yes...long time Chaos/Order players may have had plenty of time to earn that much gold...but giving a token that much value without actually earning it is wrong in my opinion...regardless of the problems Unity players have been subjected to.

There are a lot of large, high-value plots I see going up for auction after reclaimation and a slew of Unity players that only had say 25x25 plots and no gold can all of a sudden wipe out the large plots (worth 5-12g) with no competition? No way and even though they haven't been able to play their toons for well over a year, is totally unfair to those that have been working hard for the coin to place a bid on a much larger plot.

Anyways...my two-cents on the subject

[awdz]

Absolutely, there should be some compensation for the property they lost. This thread is not intended to say that nothing should be awarded, or that the loss of property is not serious. Rather it is to bring up issues that may arise out of a token-system, for example, a token for a 20x20 plot could beat out a coin bid (as was the case in the initial auction post-merge, where a token outbid ANY coin bid).

Frankly, with what Unity folks have had to go through, I think they've more than earned that little bit of recompense. Then again, the guild plots were created for the original merge, for those guilds that had built up communities together to ensure they'd stay together. Would large Unity token plots be feasible this time around?

[Romirez]

About a week and a half ago a staff member mentioned in dragon chat on Chaos the upcoming transfer of Unity characters to Chaos/Order. I missed the start of the discussion, but I did see something mentioned about the possibility of tokens being awarded to those who owned lairs/plots.

Could we get some confirmation on if this is to occur?

I know a number of long time players that have been wanting to upgrade to a larger plot, or get a lair that have been unable to and a token situation, if managed the same way in previous plot auctions, would mean that no amount of gold bid could compete against a token bid.

So someone with a token from a 20x20 plot could wind up winnning a lair bid when longtime existing shard players would not be able to win a gold bid on the same property.

Please consider the implications and fairness of a token system and the impact on existing long time shard inhabitants, prior to implementing this.

As I mentioned above, it was stated it as a possibility, not a certainty.

time to add my two cents

well, the tokens are for the Unity players to gain their plots back after the merge, simple as that. if they get the best plot, that means they must have seen it first. but the only issue i see is enough plots for everyone after the merge.

[Silverblaze]

I feel horrible for what happened to unity. Id want people to care if it happened to me. Id want some kind of compensation...but its not artifact Entertainments fault, its not tulgas fault, its not virtriums fault. Its GN's fault.

Now... I'm sure compensation will occur. However I know if we get a large amount of unity players added to chaos in particular, that there are not enough plots to go around.

I also know the old plot tokens beat out *any* amount of coin. I personally dont wanna lose out on a grand plot because random person had a token worth a tenth of my bid. I'm sure people can sympathize with my fear.

Dont get me wrong, if I had one of those plot tokens Id use it, id love it and Id take a nice 100X100 plot...Id expect them to do the same...therefore, I hope this is given much thought. Isolating long time players in that fasion could be disastrous.

I'm lucky enough to have a finished lair. I can have a second plot. I sincerely hope I can get a good one for my biped.

Thats all I got.

peace

[brainbasher]

Does plot/lair include a token if you had a Guild plot....not to get unother guild plot..just a plot....also wonders about distribution of guild estates..most unity guilds had those as well....mention for discussions sake...will be happy with anything
But i do see its could be problem on size envy
Also some of the smaller plots have been altered in size compaired with Unity,
will this continue?
The current population has built a good selection of work shops ,so i have found don,t need to build them...just storage

[TelShyia]

Posted by Romirez:
time to add my two cents

well, the tokens are for the Unity players to gain their plots back after the merge, simple as that. if they get the best plot, that means they must have seen it first. but the only issue i see is enough plots for everyone after the merge.

Just how in the heck do you figure that is fair? MY wife and I have been waiting for OVER 3 years for some of the NICER LARGER plots to open up, simply because some old account has gone stagnant or the player has left and the plot still have unfinished structures on them. We started out with a 25x25 little plot that BARELY had room for a t1 GH on it, and have 'found' some larger ones that we, THROUGH VERY HARD WORK aquiring coin, were FINALLY able to purchase! Now we have been here 3 years, and still the nicer larger plots are STILL in the same state they were when we started, but we have the coin to be able to place a bid on these larger plots! Having some body with a token that can 'outbid' us simply because it trumps every coin bid is unfair and not right IMHO.
To say that they have 'seen them first' is foolish. The better solution would be to 'create' new land areas for the unity players with 'plots' on them, ports, etc., and let them use the tokens there to get what they want. IF they use the 'tokens' on other areas, then let them be worth what the cost of their original plot was on Unity, maybe 2x more, but not to trump me "just because'...
The plot reclamations should be handled as an auction. If you want a large plot, then start making money now....
Sorry to be so callous...
Telshysia

[TelShyia]

ps. I agree with silverblaze...to miss out on a 100x100 or to be able to upgrade some of our plots to larger ones, would alienate some of us that have stuck through the good AND bad times, when others jumped ship...

[Zexoin]

Well... Why give a token because they come from Unity ? They also had 3 years to earn money there. If their whole inventory, vault, coins and stored items are transfered, there's no point giving any token. A compensation for the transfer should be given though, maybe like a few more gold pieces per char transfered.

[Tarot]

Well... Why give a token because they come from Unity ? They also had 3 years to earn money there. If their whole inventory, vault, coins and stored items are transfered, there's no point giving any token. A compensation for the transfer should be given though, maybe like a few more gold pieces per char transfered.

Well okay. Your post gives me the feeling that unitarians are not welcome. We have had no server to play on for over a year now. Time in which all us player could make money also. So why not give them tokens to get their plots back?

I for myself after reading such posts will not return, because i am not welcome to us player. And like me many others will act. So dont fear that ill get an plot and you not: a plot token and a lair token from two accounts will not be used! have fun.

[Takora Drakan]

It's a wired feeling when players say in a other thread that they are happy when we join them with our old characters but only if we don't get plots/lairs? And how we are supposed to make money when we can't play our chars?

I hope we get at least the stuff back that was in our plots/lairs, 100% novians and the coins that we spended on buying the plot. Because the plot/lair is the only thing that keeps most players in the game. Without a plot/lair, you dont have much else to do in HZ.