Market Place has turned into a useless channel for people to sit on their thumbs in..

[gopher65]

I find the most annoying bit in Marketplace the "sure I can make that. Just gather all the materials" bit. If I enjoyed crafting, I'd friggen level up the class so I could make the stuff myself! I hate crafting! That's why I try to buy stuff!

[Pharcellus]

I find the most annoying bit in Marketplace the "sure I can make that. Just gather all the materials" bit. If I enjoyed crafting, I'd friggen level up the class so I could make the stuff myself! I hate crafting! That's why I try to buy stuff!

The only thing I require is, if the customer wants teched equipment, they supply the components. I'll supply the raw materials, unless they have them already as well. Obviously I will charge less if it doesn't use up my stock.

[Casyle]

I find the most annoying bit in Marketplace the "sure I can make that. Just gather all the materials" bit. If I enjoyed crafting, I'd friggen level up the class so I could make the stuff myself! I hate crafting! That's why I try to buy stuff!

*Laughs* Ditto. I love HZ, but that part is unlike any MMORPG I've ever been in. Where you, the customer, are expected to gather either some or all of the components.

The funniest is when someone wants you to gather EVERYTHING you need THEN pay THEM to put it together....

It's going to be annoying trying to get 'em over to Casyle, but I'm going to start saving techs and forms on Casius to make him stuff. I was going to do that alloonnggg time ago, but I when I learned that, no matter how much Gold I had, I'd never have Primal Vengeance, I lost the drive to do it. This MP stuff has re-lit that.

[Valados]

The funniest is when someone wants you to gather EVERYTHING you need THEN pay THEM to put it together....

Yeah, I know what you mean. Its why I crafted everything myself. Made more sense that way. When I'm asked to craft I don't charge if they bring the comps, only thing I ask is a thank you. I feel though that the game needs an economy before it all can be taken too seriously. Friend, if you were on order I'd make you spells. Been toying around with a biped for almost a year and it is only just now getting finished because no matter how much I ask around I cannot find at all anyone to make what I need, save for spells that I can make for myself. So I stopped asking a long time ago and I scavenge now. Good thing it's not my main or I would of really been hurting. So I feel yer pain. *Nods and gives a pat on the back in comfort*

[Kala]

Some days I have problems giving stuff away in MP. And I don't mean random junk that people don't care for. I'm talking about stuff people have specifically been looking for and they don't acknowledge that I'm willing to give it to them. And since they'll respond to every other question of mine, I know it's not 'cause I'm on ignore.

The uselessness goes both ways.

[Frith-Rae]

*Laughs* Ditto. I love HZ, but that part is unlike any MMORPG I've ever been in. Where you, the customer, are expected to gather either some or all of the components.

Well I can't speak for any other game but its the same in WoW.

You have two choices when asking for a crafter to make something:

Supply the components (Or perhaps just the hard to get ones) and get it for free or perhaps a SMALL fee (or you tip them a bit) (unless you supply 100% of the components then its 99.9% of the time free - even for nameless players you never met)

Have the crafter supply the components - then its full on charge.

I know of no game, unless someone is a guildie/friend/nice person where THEY gather YOUR components and then make it for you for free.

I see nothing wrong with a crafter telling people to bring him the components of the items to craft it. As someone who doesn't really care to craft, if I was asked to make something for someone dang right I'd ask them to bring me the parts - I don't want to spend 2 hours gathering for them (Unless I was doing it for the cash).

NOW in Hz I understand its a bit different where you may or may not have the ability to harvest the materials. But if that's the case, then dang right you better be willing to pay a little extra if you're expecting the crafter to do the work for you.

I don't care if it takes "five seconds" for them to run down and dig up the iron - its five seconds they should be compensated for. They're making something for YOU.

[gopher65]

I know of no game, unless someone is a guildie/friend/nice person where THEY gather YOUR components and then make it for you for free.

We're not talking about techs or anything here. We're talking about not being able to purchase basic unteched items at ANY price. Spells are easier because almost everyone can make them. But if you ask on Marketplace "can someone make a gold earring for me" they'll say "I can if you can gather for it". If you can't supply the mats, then they won't make it for you, no matter how much you pay. I WANT to buy things. I just can't, cause no one wants to sell. So, in the end, I go to my guild and beg items from them. I'd rather not do that because it can take a few weeks sometimes, but I have no choice in the matter.

[Creme]

But if you ask on Marketplace "can someone make a gold earring for me" they'll say "I can if you can gather for it". If you can't supply the mats, then they won't make it for you, no matter how much you pay.

I can't recall when this trend started, but it seems counter to being a crafter. There's a few VERY VERY great, helpful crafters in game that don't expect you to supply all the processed resources, I can give you their names if you like, but I would agree, from what I've seen lately many crafters *expect* the buyer to provide everything, they just want to combine ONLY.

So, in the end, I go to my guild and beg items from them. I'd rather not do that because it can take a few weeks sometimes, but I have no choice in the matter.

Wow, a few weeks to get your guild to make you something? Ouch.

[Casyle]

@ Frith-Rae - WoW, eh...... It seems to be a recent trend. Before HZ I played UO *still the best MMORPG ever as far as I'm concerened, from '98 to 2001'ish*, Asheron's Call, and Asheron's Call 2. I purposely avoided EQ/EQ 2.

A crafter expecting you to gather components then pay them was unheard of in UO or AC... Though it was starting to creep into AC 2 near the end of my stay.

[velveeta]

having just recently moved into the ability to craft easy for others, i feel i should add my 2 cents.

i am in the middle of building my very large plot. on this plot i have 21 silos, which when done, i plan on filling with the basic resources to quick builds and teching.
until then, and indeed, most times, someone needs something when i am doing something the complete opposite - by that, i mean someone needs a mith socketed tool when i am in armour and arms out hunting. asking someone if they can gather/get as many of the resources as they can speeds things up - by the time i get my harvesting tools and make my way to a node, harvest the material, get the tech resources, and make the item, the person has waited for an hour or more.
i have no prob with doing that, but most time peeps would like the stuff pronto. so, sometimes i ask peeps to get what resources they can or i ask for them in chat. for me, its not being a wench, its saving time and effort - which i guess is kinda selfish. if someone is not able to take care of the resources, i have no prob fetching them, as long as the person realizes it will take much more time to make.

so while i would never force someone to get the resources, i do recommend that it is only good courtesy to have at least the tech resources you need for the techs you want, if not the whole resources. tech resources can be expensive, even at the lower prices (i say this for the live servers, on blight we have little enough use for money and several ways to get it anyway...), and unless the crafter charges a fee for the item creation, it is only common good manners to obtain those if able.

[Oakleif]

I haven't run into crafters that expect you to supply the basic resources, but many will ask if you have the technique resources for what you want. Mainly because its a bit of a pain to try to keep a large stock of them on hand to be able to satisfy any order that comes along. Unless you're already maxed out level of course.

[gopher65]

Wow, a few weeks to get your guild to make you something? Ouch.

In my old guild, yeah. I haven't asked for anything since I came back to the in september. Dunno what my new guild is like. So far I haven't needed anything but spells and I was able to get them from a helpful dragon.

[Frith-Rae]

If you can't supply the mats, then they won't make it for you, no matter how much you pay.

Ahhh okey, gotcha.

In such cases then I'm only of the mind that its their choice - and obviously they can't be bothered to help out.

Sucky and sad - but I've been there myself - on both sides.

((but yea I did say that if you gathered all the components in WoW then yes 99.9% of the time its free - though myself I"ll usually tip them something to encourage the niceness and "pay it forward" - heck I'll go to 99.99999% of the time - cuz that one crafter trying to make money by doing nothing usually doesn't have any customers heheh))

[Kala]

We're not talking about techs or anything here. We're talking about not being able to purchase basic unteched items at ANY price. Spells are easier because almost everyone can make them. But if you ask on Marketplace "can someone make a gold earring for me" they'll say "I can if you can gather for it".

I'm guilty of doing this, though it's mostly because I'm in the middle of something and don't want to go out and harvest stuff. I'm not keen on interruptions, but if someone can get the stuff together for me, I'm happy to make it for tips next time I pop into town. Otherwise, they'll just have to wait till I have the time to gather the stuff.

If you can't supply the mats, then they won't make it for you, no matter how much you pay. I WANT to buy things. I just can't, cause no one wants to sell.

I keep confectioner resources on hand, so if someone wanted to buy something I don't have up for sale somewhere, I'm happy to make it. I just don't keep resources for everything else on hand. (Except for miscellaneous lairshaping bits.)

[Casyle]

I haven't run into crafters that expect you to supply the basic resources, but many will ask if you have the technique resources for what you want. Mainly because its a bit of a pain to try to keep a large stock of them on hand to be able to satisfy any order that comes along. Unless you're already maxed out level of course.

That I can understand. Like in AC 2, "trophies" can be a real pain to stock up on, especially popular ones like Blue Vexator Fringes.

Everyone should be happy, though, that HZ's "trophy" drops are not like AC 2's. I remember spending half a day killing lvl 100+ Banderlings and I'd be THRILLED if I got TEN teeth! *Laughs* Oh, my, and NOBODY wanted to try and get Reedshark Fins... Getting 2 or 3 a DAY was considered good.

[brainbasher]

I must admit when i first read this thread i was suprised...
I log into Mp as well as many other ch,s mostly to see if their is anything i can help with....no don,t laugh
For example i have made various T1/2 items...cargo/spells etc.
Even though i am miner i do stop what i,m doing to help where i can.
Even if i have to get new formula,s.
I do ask if requester can get some of the resourses(they don,t have to)as a lot of the time they can do at least 1 item...they also sometimes get craft exp where i don,t in the gathering.... i don,t recall as yet charging for directly made stuff...sometimes i dump on consigner(so their is charge their).

Being in a helpful guild is most useful to me,get a lot of support in the var projects i do in game.And try and give back where i can as well...
But yes i do see what you mean...i have kept an eye on Mp and their are times when requests go unanswered....

I,m not sure their is solution,its the luck of the draw who,s on the ch and then if they are free to help....
One thing a learned early on is keeping a list of helpfull peps on my friends list with tabs on the type of work they have done for me...most the time i can contact them dirrect for a upgraded item when needed.
Their is also a large number of high level players that do try and stock Consigners some...though getting loads of unsold items back in your vault can be a pain...

Well that,s my pounds worth....
I still find the ch usefull

[Casyle]

heh heh ^ I about ranted in this post again. Went Healer and needed some more spells as well as a shield and weapon. Made the mistake of trying MP again.... I wish there was a way to customize my own chat list so I could remove that useless P.O.S.

Thank heaven for friends. IF they're not on, I just don't get anything I need anymore.

I need to get Casius more forms and techs, but.. If no friends are online to hold them for Casyle.... It's pointless. *Still mad that I went and paid for the extra log-in that I can't use without another computer*

[C`gan]

From my POV, what good is MP with all the ones looking to buy in it with no one there to sell? That's why I prefer to lurk in it. also, when people ask for certain general things, I like to help them narrow down all the different options and hopefully find someone to make what they're after if I can't myself.

For example, last night a person asked for a fitter or tailor. I asked which they wanted, construction units or clothing. They were after armor (outfitter, tailor, tinker, or armorer type armors?). Well, as it turns out, they were looking for cloth armor for monk and had no idea that leather would suit them better. After a brief discussion the lot of us there helped the person find someone to be able to make the armor and the handwraps that they hadn't figured on as well.

So, don't be too harsh on those of us not flooding the channel with offers of selling our wares. Sometimes, having people asking questions makes all the difference.

Now, as far as pricing, that's really up to the individual selling. Personally, if the buyer is providing a tech or form to scribe, base resources, or components I'm rather happy to make whatever for little to no charge (Yes, there goes the economy of coin again!). Otherwise, I have a price in mind based on tier of materials used.

[Casyle]

From my POV, what good is MP with all the ones looking to buy in it with no one there to sell? That's why I prefer to lurk in it. also, when people ask for certain general things, I like to help them narrow down all the different options and hopefully find someone to make what they're after if I can't myself.

My frustration isn't that people lurk. My frustration is.... when I log onto MP almost almost no trading ever goes on. Nobody advertises that they're selling anything, people rarely, and I mean rarely, respond when I or someone else needs something. About the only time anyone talks is to talk about a non-trading/buying/selling related topic, like, where do I find so and so?

For example, last night a person asked for a fitter or tailor. I asked which they wanted, construction units or clothing. They were after armor (outfitter, tailor, tinker, or armorer type armors?). Well, as it turns out, they were looking for cloth armor for monk and had no idea that leather would suit them better. After a brief discussion the lot of us there helped the person find someone to be able to make the armor and the handwraps that they hadn't figured on as well.

That's nice of you.

So, don't be too harsh on those of us not flooding the channel with offers of selling our wares. Sometimes, having people asking questions makes all the difference.

Except that my frustration is that no-one answers.

[gopher65]

The thing is, I know that people are out doing their own thing, and that nobody wants to stop what they are doing just to go make me some item, even for coin (cause coin is largely worthless to most players except for a few specific things). And I don't expect them to drop everything and run to me. Just answer and say, yeah, I can make that tomorrow for you if you want. I'm fine with that, I have patience.