Player Base

[C`gan]

Here's a dumb question. How much for a banner ad at, say, google?

[Frith-Rae]

Heck - why not a player-oriented banner that people can use as sigs in other places.

For example - there are several WoW player webpage banners that playres have made where you put in your player information and it posts your stats or whatever, and you can use the pre-done graphic or insert your own into the little box and it gives details about the character.

Purely to post as signatures on forums.

Something like that could totally be done here (by a player or a dev) and then it could be used as siggies in other forums .

[Vlisson]

i have some experience with webpage and how you get a better rating on pages like google


"fantasy mmorpg playalbe dragon" no result
"fantasy mmorpg dragon" i havent seen Istaria
"fantasy mmorpg dragon fiend" third rank

thats not good

If Istaria wants to get more player its great that you all show your friends the game, but i think that Vi need to do some advertising too

[Favoran]

Heck - why not a player-oriented banner that people can use as sigs in other places.

I like that idea. I'd definitely use a sig like that.

[Teto Frum]

Advertising is great, but i must agree with Velea advertising now is not the right thing to do.

This Vista thing needs solved first, i don't want break the bad news to anyone but windows 7 is really vista 2, only changed name due to bad image, windows 7 won't run this game either its a vista based os. I play alot of games and theres only one that i cant turn on my computer and play, you guessed it Istaria(while were talking name changes due to image).

What are you going to do run an add and tag it " for xp dinosaurs only". Less people have XP everyday, your customer base is shrinking daily due to this.

This is Istarias biggest enemy it needs fixed, or its dead with time, no matter how great of a job Vi does in every other area, game can't survive and grow if it needs to be played on an outdated os.

[Vlisson]

yes! i dont know why it dont run with Vista and i fully agree that this costs a lot of old and new players!

[Greenclaw1]

Kind of a goofy question. Yes, there are plans.

1. Fix bugs, reduce the barriers that prevent people from playing
2. Create content for players to enjoy and look forward to
3. Market the game by doing things that engage the community and gamers, such as the audio stories, contests, developer's discussions, etc.

I may have missed some, I'm sure Velea or Amarie will correct me. But thats a start.

4. Dryads will get their own ROP to fly higher, but never as high or fast as dragons ?

5. Other Bipeds have a great quest for a spell that allows flight, but not as high or fast as Dragons?

6. Flying carpets or mounts for bipeds, but not as high flying or fast as dragons?


Have the Dev ever thought of expanding Istaria in this way?

[Takora Drakan]

7. Takora is allowed to eat Greenclaw1. Yes? =P

[AmonGwareth]

4. Dryads will get their own ROP to fly higher, but never as high or fast as dragons ?

5. Other Bipeds have a great quest for a spell that allows flight, but not as high or fast as Dragons?

6. Flying carpets or mounts for bipeds, but not as high flying or fast as dragons?

Negative on all three.

[awdz]

flying would make a great tier VII tech for boots! *sighs wistfully*

[Thangorodrim Atanatari]

You Tube (which we've done by posting the latest video on there), My Space and Facebook (again, we have sites for both)

are we all permitted to make a myspace page with screenshots and lets say potraits of our characters?

if so lets all create such pages and add the istaria page to the friends list?
to get the hit counter up so it's shown more often to people as a result.

[Greenclaw1]

7. Takora is allowed to eat Greenclaw1. Yes? =P

Fine by me

[Greenclaw1]

Negative on all three.

Wouldn't it be grand if it was considered? . Besides Vanguard only now is another game (Aion) coming along that allows flight in a seamless world. Istaria should make more use this dimension in the game. I didn't count wow for flying as it's only in the expansion zone you fly I do believe? I remember when Istaria had not long been released David Bowman was his name if I remember right spoke of fly spell for bipeds as something he'd like to put in the game.

Wouldn't it be great if Dryads could fly higher? In a game like EQ2 it's easy to understand why their version of a dryad are limited to a little glide, but in Istaria there in a world that allows their wings to be wings! Is the idea for bipeds to mount dragons to be taken for a flight still alive? That was another one of DB's ideas he wanted to put in the game.

[peladon]

Wouldn't it be grand if it was considered? .

My words are but thewhisper of a forgotten wind. Let them be lost or found as suits the seeker.

Elder and Wise.... I would speak again those words I have spoken in tides past to this thinking... but there would be little purpose. In some part, the reason there be no mounts that others might ride in our land is that the Gifted hath beaten them all to death and past dying so oft and many times. It seems that they yet stand, undead. Mayhap the Aegis hath taken them among their forces .

Suffice that, to mark thy words, no. Grand I do not think it would be. But the speaking of that thought I speak for myself alone.

And as to the words of old gods... thy speaking may indeed be words that were spoken. Or words that those of us old remember in some manner less than whole.

But words they be of old gods.

I do not look for salt rock gain when I dig sandstone... for that is a thing of a tide long past. Nor do I do wait for an old wind from an old god's words to blow today ( and that no disrespect to that old one or any other).

My words are but the whisper of a forgotten wind. Let them be lost or found as suits the seeker.


Sephiranoth, called by some ShadowSeeker
Nobody and Nothing ever, save The Five do Feast
A Fool that walks among the Wise

[Vahrokh]

Preamble: the following is not to blame or flame this game, which I really LOVE, it's just an outsider view without censorship.

Sites like MMORPG are great for reaching current players of MMO's. For the most part, however, Istaria has been in existance long enough that current players of MMO's have tried it, are aware of it already, and if they have any interest what so ever in where the game is going, follow it voluntarily. We do need to keep reaching those people with news, and are doing so when we have things that qualify as "big news" enough to generate interest.

Istaria's fame as I can report after playing multiple main stream MMOs:


"What's it? Never heard of it"

"Well, it's also known with the former name: "Horizons" "

Average player answer:

"Boh, still don't have an idea about it".

If I convince them to go on the WEB site: "site looks like 1980, no way I try it".


More MMO "lived" player:

"Ah, that lame game that can't show more than 5 players on screen. Tried it for 3 months, will never touch it again with a pole. By the way, did they add pets and mounts like every other game?".



I have a feeling Istaria could indeed use a big advertisement pass.

But first of all it should have a new client (nowadays people demand pixel shader engines, responsive mob spawns etc.), possibly a client that runs on Vista.

In case this slipped trough, Windows 7 is going to be marketed sooner than later, and it won't run Istaria either.

Problem is, Windows 7 is not lame like Vista, it's FAST, people will want it, you can't market a MMO that can't run but on two generations older Windows with hope of success.

Just CURIOUS.
Do other games have such GREAT documentation? (obviously not great enough to attract my attention or making me want to play it )

No, they take the new players with super-easy animated tutorials, then have a "canned" (but easy) storyline that "naturally" brings them gradually exploring the world.

Istaria now got some fine tutorials but:

- it's not a trivial joke of MMO: it got MANY things to learn and people manage to stumble on some concepts. Ie. I got newbies asking all the time about recipes and what to do and expecially about how to use them once they "disappear" (are learned).

- the game story halts past the first levels. You are not going to get to 100 following a quest line but by grinding, grinding, grinding, grinding...

Dragons are something that comes close to having a storyline, bipeds should have something similar for the game to appeal to more players.

Finally, the quests used to have broadly vague indications. Someone not hell bent at spamming chats with questions, will read how his item is "somewhere in the south of the world". He'll promptly imagine "let's use Thottbot"... oh wait.

These things actively keep less than dedicated players off the game.

I advertise for Istaria on the forums I frequent, and I've brought a few players over to at least play the trial period. Maybe some form of incentive would help encourage more people to spread the game through word-of-mouth? XD

I keep talking about the goodness of this game everywhere even in WoW and Warhammer, but those who manage to fulfill the requirements (ie having Win XP, not liking PvP, liking crafting...) end up asking me why they don't meet anyone in any town and that an empty game is not fun and quit :S

[awdz]

I keep talking about the goodness of this game everywhere even in WoW and Warhammer, but those who manage to fulfill the requirements (ie having Win XP, not liking PvP, liking crafting...) end up asking me why they don't meet anyone in any town and that an empty game is not fun and quit :S

i suspect that to draw a large player base all at once, it'd need an expansion or relaunch

[Hrough]

I could see a 'relaunch' of sorts, once they get the Blighted Labyrinth in, and get some (important) things fixed. Once they get it more presentable, I can see them going ahead with a full-force campaign, marketing it as if it's 'new'.

[Vahrokh]

I could see a 'relaunch' of sorts, once they get the Blighted Labyrinth in, and get some (important) things fixed. Once they get it more presentable, I can see them going ahead with a full-force campaign, marketing it as if it's 'new'.

Nope.

A relaunch needs a "fresh" situation. The newer playerbase consists of many players but they are much, much, MUCH more demanding than the past and it takes a glitch to make them quit with great crying and negative PR.

Head to the VN forums about Warhammer for an example. Warhammer is not the goodness it was hyped to be, but it's still very nice in many features. It's also much, much more polished and "new" than Istaria. But look how spoiled they are and how heavy flames they bring. And those flames propagated in the game as well, yelding a loss that I can estimate in about half the playerbase past 2 months.

The key is that they did not adapt to the game as it was intended but demanded it was something like "WoW2" and polished like that 4 years old game since War was at day 1.

Now, older players would cope with a new game being rough for the first months, the new playerbase would bury a "relaunch" of Istaria in 2 days.

Moreover the newer playerbase have been "WoWized" (they are "sons" of that game, brainwashed to want a precise kind of game) in every way and demand a totally smooth and super-polished game with easy quest chains, DX9+ graphics, raids, PvP, prompt in game CSR response, stunning web site including "armory" (name changes with MMO but it's here) and most of all they are min maxers that would NEVER accept starting a game where "elders" already have max level and un-attainable recipes / plots / status.

Basically, there'd need for a big, BIG shoulders company to incorporate Vitrium and redo Istaria from zero and release as a new franchise / brand.

But there won't be such company, for Istaria got some technical solutions and challenges no current other game maker can afford.

Istaria has some supreme underlying technology, I never end to be amazed at the work they managed to implement for the time (early 2000s), but the client never gave justice to it. It's something not easy to replicate, just look at how many MMOs implement two games in one (with dragons and their separate paths).
To make things harder, the MMO programmers are not here any more (I envy the company who could put their hands on the likes of Smeglor) and for what they themselves said, it's poorly documented, making a refactoring attempt even harder.

[Vahrokh]

Rereading my last posts they look negative and I am sorry for that.

I am trying to stay realistic to what a good willed but extremely small company can afford in these days, from my experience as former software company owner and being a programmer for a living.

I still believe the game will basically evolve on the current "rails" of adding new nice content and stuff but it'll remain "Istaria 1.0", too much work and too many costs to jump in a release 2.

I think a realistically feasible course of action for Istaria 2 would be playing small & smart like the new musical groups. They start with some "mouth to mouth" advertisement, some youtube / the other dedicated sites feature of their work, and try grow their fame off there.

In Istaria's case, there's be a new, 2008 hardware small server, a project director in charge. "Normal" Istaria would keep running untouched.

Phase 1: the new server would "branch" off the current one to save on costs and time. Art & quests can be made later.

Phase 2: the server code is reviewed to add modern features, like a true 3rd dimension, new (and not ancient hardware + OS size constrained) mobs spawn code, instancing.

Phase 3: announce the specifics about how to interact with the server (some are floating the net already) and launch an open source initiative to create a new game client connecting to the above server. The above director would insure the project follows the guidelines.

Phase 4: extensive testing of 2 and 3, something easier to do in volume when the client is open.

Phase 5: once at beta stage, begin spreading "rumors" about THE game with <place Istaria many features here>. There might be need for some limited PvP implementation, it's just too good of a seller to leave it out. It might be limited to "PvP servers" (even Warhammer and WoW have RP, PvE and PvP servers).

Phase 6: start a serious, not hobbystic marketing campaign. I mean putting some ads on magazines, on Google and big gaming sites. Not some "my aunt designed a banner and we put it in a 1985 unknown general gaming site no one looks at, for 1 week".

Phase 7: pray and hope. I see a potential for 25-50k players. Not many, but enough to grant a proper development path that can look at the future without immediate fears.

[Vlisson]

thanks Vahrokh!

a very good summary of the situation at the moment.

there are a lof of new games coming out 2009 or good games already released 2008.

Who wants to join an oldie game? without features which are standard in other games?

With Perfect World and Aion flying will maybe become standard too! why not use this feature before the other games will do?

i dont know how to get new players

will WAR or AoC survive? will they get new players after they lost so much and got bad publicity?