A Heads Up on a hidden change

[GalemThawn]

Knut's Fire Wiskey's effect Totally Hammered no longer stacks with Promote Vitality.

also,

Granny Nuffle's Festival Cookies effect Taste of Home does not stack with Promote Intellect.

[GalemThawn]

Totally Hammered and Promote Vitality both must have a matching keyword, something like Strength_Kicker.

However, Promote Vitality gives bonus to Strength and Dexterity.
Totally Hammered gives a large Strength Bonus, yet an equally large Dexterity subtraction.

I'm not sure about the weighting of all tiers of Promote Vitality, but I believe that the T5 version overwrites Totally Hammered.

This presents two situations:
1. If you have a short supply of Knut's Fire Wiskey, be sure that you don't get Promote Vitality cast on you while using it. I used 2 shots tonight before I realized the conflict.
2. Totally Hammered is supposed to be 'cannot be removed'. If you are Totally Hammered now and need to regain that speed loss, get a Promote Vitallity cast on you.

[Velea]

This was not a "hidden change", Galem.

I believe you that it is happening, however, it was not planned. Whether it will change or not, I can not say for certain. But I can tell you that no one sat down and thought "Let's make sure that Promote Vitality doesn't stack with Totally Hammered", etc.

[SinOfSuns]

This was not a "hidden change", Galem.

I believe you that it is happening, however, it was not planned. Whether it will change or not, I can not say for certain. But I can tell you that no one sat down and thought "Let's make sure that Promote Vitality doesn't stack with Totally Hammered", etc.

That would be rather amusing if that's what devs did in their spare time. "Oh hey, let's find two awesome buffs... and make them cancel each other out! Mwahahahaha!"

[Velea]

Oh, I'm not saying we never do that. Just that we didn't in this particular case.

Mwahahahaha

[SinOfSuns]

Oh, I'm not saying we never do that. Just that we didn't in this particular case.

Mwahahahaha

Do you perchance bake brownies during these sessions as well? Because you totally owe me some :P

[Frith-Rae]

Well I personally find that if I get Totally Hammered my Vitality definitely goes down...though usually that debuff is delayed to the next day.

And if I could find a way to instantly remove being Totally Hammered before falling asleep - that would be awesome. But really, you shouldn't be able to do that!

(see it is somewhat on topic yet amusing play on words too)

[GalemThawn]

Thanks for letting us know, Velea. I guess this should be under Bugs then.

Hopefully it does get changed back since the buffs are not both direct Strength kickers. Totally Hammered does come with its share of offsets.

[AmonGwareth]

They don't stack because they both increase strength.

[GalemThawn]

Enhance Strength, like Promote Vitality, is a spell that also increases Strength. So does Bolster Strength Potion.

Currently, Enhance Strength still stacks with Totally Hammered. Promote Vitality does not.

Are we going to see a trend of more items not stacking?
Should we be looking for Enhance Strength / Enhance Dexterity and Promote Vitality to soon be unstackable?

I'm not trying to turn this into a rant, I'm just asking a serious question about the direction that this is going.

[Aaelefein]

The more I read about this, the more it makes sense the two cancel each other out. Please...here's my reasoning.

Okay...so this Fire Whiskey (Never used the stuff) gives you "Totally Hammered"...a huge strength boost with a corresponding dexterity decrease. This totally makes sense...look at all the bar fights.

So now you have Promote Vitality...giving both a strength and dexterity boost. In this scenario, I see promote vitality as a super strong cup of coffee or some other form of sobering method...nice strength increase and wipes out the affect of the drink...not only removing the dexterity hit from being drunk, but even boosts it higher.

Looking at this from both a real life and role play stand point...it makes sense to me. Just my thoughts.

[Guaran]

Enhance Strength, like Promote Vitality, is a spell that also increases Strength. So does Bolster Strength Potion.

Currently, Enhance Strength still stacks with Totally Hammered. Promote Vitality does not.

Are we going to see a trend of more items not stacking?
Should we be looking for Enhance Strength / Enhance Dexterity and Promote Vitality to soon be unstackable?

I'm not trying to turn this into a rant, I'm just asking a serious question about the direction that this is going.

[ut oh]

They don't want you hitting 1600 smelting anymore, so they nerfing your buffs.

[/joke]

Honestly I don't know if it was intended or not.

[GalemThawn]

If a Strength Boosting SPELL like Promote Vitality can't stack with a Strength Drink, I would expect that we will see the Strength Boosting SPELL of Enhance Strength also not stack with it. Likely that we will see Enhance Strength and Promote Vitality soon not stacking since they both increase Strength. Is it possible that Bolster Strength Potion will soon not stack Enhance Strength, Promote Vitality, or Totally Hammered? I mean, after all, they all increase Strength and that seems to be the reason Amon gave "They don't stack because they both increase strength."

[GalemThawn]

Honestly I don't know if it was intended or not.

From Velea's remarks, it was not.
From Amon's remarks, it may not have been intended, but it appears to be the way it will be.

[Guaran]

If Potions didn't stack with everything (same can be said for eaten crystals' effects) it would be a huge nerf to Alchemists. I would hope it never goes that far.

[Aaelefein]

If a Strength Boosting SPELL like Promote Vitality can't stack with a Strength Drink, I would expect that we will see the Strength Boosting SPELL of Enhance Strength also not stack with it. Likely that we will see Enhance Strength and Promote Vitality soon not stacking since they both increase Strength. Is it possible that Bolster Strength Potion will soon not stack Enhance Strength, Promote Vitality, or Totally Hammered? I mean, after all, they all increase Strength and that seems to be the reason Amon gave "They don't stack because they both increase strength."

The main difference I see between buffs, potions, and this Whiskey you speak of...most buffs and potions affect a singular stat.

Where as this whiskey and promote vitality affect 2 stats...the former with a positive and negative affect and the latter with two positives on the same stats. And remember...you can't have a raise and enhance buff of the same kind either.

To me...it looks like it's working as it should...except for casting Promote Vitality cancelling out Totally Hammered...if it's not supposed to be dispellable, then you're totally hammered for the duration and the PV shouldn't take hold in the first place.

[Creme]

If one needs to cancel another effect, I would prefer to see the following options:

1. User gets a message that they do not stack and the 2nd buff applied is not allowed (nothing is consumed, nothing is overwritten).

2. If there is no way to prevent the 2nd buff from not firing, then please let the consumed items not be overwritten.

There's too many times players start casting random buffs which could cancel a consumed item that's costly (i.e, the whiskey).

Although I frequently ask players to please NOT buff, there are far too many players that feel that it's polite and nice (not to mention get offended if you don't want their buffs) and don't consider that they're cancelling out buffs/effects that you already have (and would PREFER to keep).

Please don't allow buffs to overwrite consumed items.

I think my spider goo went away too, now that I think of it, and I couldn't tell offhand what was making it vanish from my buff bar.

I think I also consumed something when I already had PV and it allowed me to eat it but the effect wasn't allowed and I got a message that it was because of conflicting buffs. I can't remember for sure if I did consume the item (and got no use from it).

[AmonGwareth]

Its going to happen sometimes regardless. Some levels of PV will be overwritten by the totally hammered effect. Most PV will overwrite instead.