Constant Nerfing

[starlight]

honestly im not that pleased with the constant nerfing of dragons, i dont see any reason to be nerfing the primal rebirth as it should be left alone that it supposed to remove a single death point an not be changed. second is when with the elar quest be fixed that was messed up a few months ago by a npc removal that was part of the quest. I enjoy the game but i also would rather see immediate bug and quest issues be tended to first

[Dragonboy]

Now that this particular post has been moved to rants I allow myself to comment, as well as on the various changes stated in the thread were this post originally came from.

To begin with I must say that in an MMORPG change is good, but not all changeS are logical, needed or good.

No.1
I agree with Starlight that the only resurrection ability a dragon has should not be nerfed. Why in Istaria’s sake lower the time from a full death point to only 24 hours? Is the hoard cost also going to be lowered now? Or the 1 hour timer?
No.2
Lasting Embers only on flame damage breath abilities.
This lowers the actual usefullness for the Lasting Embers crystal from hardly to none.
Besides don’t people get blisters and burn marks when they come in contact with extreme cold (try keeping solid CO2 on your hands for about a minute and then give me the answer)? Not sure about when you come in contact with electricity. It is a real shame actually.
I already feel as if I am the only one still using the crystal as it is and with Breath of Lightning it was even still usefull at times, but it seems I need to find myself a(nother) more usefull crystal…
No.3
( http://community.istaria.com/forum/s...ad.php?t=20523 )
Has the newby crystal been fixed already which I reported bugged in this thread more then 2 months ago…

After receiving the "Aviatus's stone of vitality" I noticed it has the shape of a Tool Crystal rather then Armor crystal

I could have gone over the Beetle change again as a nerf for dragons, but I wont this time. Enough has been said about the subject.

And I know that No.3 is not a nerf, but it is part of the basic training that the new hatchlings are recieving and it is just strange that someone new to the game learns how to craft a armor socketed chest scale, but has to put a TOOL (shaped) crystal in a ARMOR socket. Have you ever seen how that looks?
Actually I am surprised I couldnt find an earlier post about this error.

[Akuluxtraxas]

Might as well add tons of new mobs with Slash immunity to the nerf list..as well as old nerfs like the event techs.

I mean come on what damage can we do that matters much that is not slash?? we have like breath of flame burst and thats it.

It seems an obvious attempt to nullify gold rage to a degree but to bad it nullifies most all of our strong attacks as spells are still horribly weak compared to our melee.

[Zexoin]

Might as well add tons of new mobs with Slash immunity to the nerf list..as well as old nerfs like the event techs.

I mean come on what damage can we do that matters much that is not slash?? we have like breath of flame burst and thats it.

It seems an obvious attempt to nullify gold rage to a degree but to bad it nullifies most all of our strong attacks as spells are still horribly weak compared to our melee.

Those mobs are highly vulnerable to primal.


Also, don't forget that dragons get 2 new abilities/spells : Drain Bolt and Acid Breath. So I wouldn't call that a "nerf".

[Vaz]

Blighted claws.

Primal Health, Gift of Velocity, Promote Intellect, gathering fish, gathering water, gathering herbs, gathering clay, Acid Breath, Drain Bolt, hatchling gliding, Khutit no longer incurs stat penalties, both factions can obtain and use both adult breath attacks and the timer linkage between breath attacks has been reduced to 50%, transmutation chamber, Dragon's Gift V, tool claws and jewelry socketed head scales, IX and X levels of the Primal and TnC quests, Nielenoss's Cargo Flyer, Primal and Dragon Breath crystals, etc.

...And I haven't even listed bug fixes, cosmetic additions/changes, new portal/destination pad locations, and the loot table cleanups that have benefited dragons. Nor have I listed improvements developed earlier in Virtrium's tenure.

That said, I don't understand why the Primal Rebirth DP removal has been decreased either.

[Zexoin]

Blighted claws.

Primal Health, Gift of Velocity, Promote Intellect, gathering fish, gathering water, gathering herbs, gathering clay, Acid Breath, Drain Bolt, hatchling gliding, Khutit no longer incurs stat penalties, both factions can obtain and use both adult breath attacks and the timer linkage between breath attacks has been reduced to 50%, transmutation chamber, Dragon's Gift V, tool claws and jewelry socketed head scales, IX and X levels of the Primal and TnC quests, Nielenoss's Cargo Flyer, Primal and Dragon Breath crystals, etc.

...And I haven't even listed bug fixes, cosmetic additions/changes, new portal/destination pad locations, and the loot table cleanups that have benefited dragons. Nor have I listed improvements developed earlier in Virtrium's tenure.

That said, I don't understand why the Primal Rebirth DP removal has been decreased either.

<3 Can I have your babies plz ?

[Shian]

I mean come on what damage can we do that matters much that is not slash??

Essentially?
Everything....

[Dragonboy]

Shian, good to see you were lucky enough to actually loot those things. I looted a lot of blighted stuff, but never a damage converting claw.

The fact is... Some have the luck of looting that stuff and others dont.
But making the proper handling of mobs depend on having such a claw is the worst thing possible.

Another fact... first I was made happy with having Primal Rebirth... Now I have to give a piece of food to the player I give a rez as well.

Yet another fact... The lasting embers nerf... The only thing usefull about that crystal was that every hit had a 33% change of activating. So in a fight against 6+ mobs you always had atleast 2-3 times it activates when using Breath of Lightning. When finishing of mobs 1 at the time I dont need breath of fire to weaken them so I wont need the crystal. And having it only activate on Breath of Flame Burst or Breath of Fire makes it now useless in my eyes.

Maybe the dragons need to be left alone for awhile and some positive changes to be made to biped schools.

[Shian]

Not lucky. I just happen to think more highly of my blighted gear than most folk.

All too often, blight items are viewed as 'junk'. I get in grind groups that are crystal hunting. They get the crystals, I get the 'junk' loot for the sole purpose of getting cores for crafting new scales.

[Steelclaw]

From what I understand in this thread, the complaints center around three things:
- A change to Primal Rebirth that leaves rating 100 and higher players with 4 hours of death point.
- Mobs that are immune to slash damage.
- A change to the Lasting Embers crystal that prevents it from proccing on non-flame breath attacks.

I think that those claiming that the above constitutes 'constant nerfing' need to step back and ask if they're being reasonable in their claim. I certainly do not believe such a claim is reasonable nor fair to the devs.

Making a new mob that is immune to slash damage flat out does not constitute a nerf. Nothing is being taken away; the dragons' ability to fight existing mobs has not been altered by the introduction of new mobs. Yes, few of the new mobs can be one-shotted with a plain Gold Rage. So what? Go find their weakness and attack it. Dragons have attacks besides Gold Rage. Learn to use them.

Lasting Embers, I suspect, was a fix. Consider the last part of the name: 'embers'. Those are the little smoldering bits left after a fire dies down. Neither lightning nor ice leave embers. Therefore, logic follows that Lasting Embers was intended to be used in conjunction with flame breath attacks only. Assuming the above is true, Burning Embers proccing on a non-breath attack was a flaw.

I'll admit that I've used my Lasting Embers crystal to cause an AoE DoT and I'll miss being able to do that, but I hardly consider such a change a nerf and certainly not a big one. (Hint: how about suggesting a crystal that procs a DoT when used with a specific breath attack?)

That leaves the death point reduction of Primal Rebirth. I want to make sure that the effect of the change (leaving 4 hours of death point to burn off) was intentional before saying anything further.

Anyway. I fail to see what the big deal is. Save the complaints and cries of 'nerf!' for when they're really needed; they're not for use for when anything different comes along. Should those complaining here choose to continue to pick petty fights that are really of no consequence, the devs will have no patience to cooperate with the players when there is a true need to. In other words, stop whining lest we all get screwed.

[Takora Drakan]

About the blighted claws, while it is difficult to loot damage converting ones, it would help greatly if finnaly a blighted claw formular would be patched it that we can at least craft them.

[Deth]

I think they are adding more slash resistant mobs just to break people of the habit of using just Goldrage. I would guess they reduced the Primal rebirth to a more Pre-T6 ability as we get it before level 100. I am not sure at which Healers get super rez, but being as we are not healers I would guess that is another reason it was reduced. So we did not take something away from what makes the Healer special.

[velveeta]

in the words of inigo montoya
'you keep using that word - i don't think it means what you think it means'...

[Firebrand]

- Mobs that are immune to slash damage.

This is a good change for me. That makes spellcaster Dragons more useful... for once.
And there are other ways to deal different types of damage with Blighted Claws or Flame/Ice/Energy Attack from bipeds.

- A change to the Lasting Embers crystal that prevents it from proccing on non-flame breath attacks.

It sounds more logical, but is a little annoyance (less convenient). However, this won't change our life and there is no need to make a fuss about it.

- A change to Primal Rebirth that leaves rating 100 and higher players with 4 hours of death point.

I don't see the point of this one either. Making Healers unique? OK, but the recycle of this ability is one hour: you can't really abuse of it.
That just brings an useless slow down to players' hunts. Especially when we will certainly have a good harvest of Death Points in Dralknor's Doom.

[peladon]

Not lucky. I just happen to think more highly of my blighted gear than most folk.

All too often, blight items are viewed as 'junk'. I get in grind groups that are crystal hunting. They get the crystals, I get the 'junk' loot for the sole purpose of getting cores for crafting new scales.

My words are but the whisper of a forgotten wind. Let them be lost or found, as suits the seeker.

Elder and wise, I am but the least of draku. And that any word of mine should stand before the word of any other is no thing I seek.

But must it be that our kind must themselves step into the shadows to balance their very nature? For the Blight is a thing we seek to remove from the very land, and yet it seems the Blight is a thing to be preserved to retain the effectiveness of which ye speak. Well and all. If I must be less, then I will be less... but the Blight is no thing I will have as a part of my nature, save that... that Oath that yet stands and those that set it upon me. And as I am the least of warriors, that less is no loss to those that are mighty in the land, no doubt.

Must it be that our kind be so dependant on a thing that, even do they find it, be so subject to decay and damage of its nature, in a manner that others are not? For the Blighted things decay and pass, and must be remade... and there are others that may dance and dance and dance and dance, and choose the woe they wield without such decay.

Must it be that our kind must seek and find these things ye speak of ere they may stand shoulder and wing, foot and claw... such poor, poor claws... with those others that defend the land?

To the matter of the Rebirth... I will speak nothing. If that also must be lessened, then that is but one more part of our fall. If I must become less of aid to the lightning for this... then it is no news to any. Though it is strange that a thing found from draku standing before two leg evil and taking triumph is lessened, where two leg nature is not.

My words are but the whisper of a forgotten wind. Let them be lost or found, as suits the seeker.


Sephiranoth, called by some ShadowSeeker
Nobody and Nothing ever, save The Five do Feast
A Fool that walks among the Wise

[LOVWYRM]

Sephiranoth speaks wise words- as usual.
A agree with him in all points.

..flickering shadows...

[Galdethriel]

/rant on

I'm not sure about some of the nerfs being passed, but I was/still am quite annoyed about the weakening of primal rebirth. I thought the whole idea behind it's expensiveness and it's long timer was that it would completely remove a death point. Now that it will only remove a death point in some cases, I'd like to see it's hoard cost or it's recycle altered.

And yeah, there's the whole healing is a healer's job argument, but healers I'm pretty sure get their rez that removes a death point way easier anyway, no hoard cost, and a puny recycle compared to dragons. I heard they get superior rez somewhere between 50-60 in level, though don't take my word for that. Also, they don't have to do one of the biggest and most demanding quests in the game to get it.

So I really don't know what the devs were thinking on that one. Sometimes I get this odd impression that they do things 'just because'. This change definately feels like one of those 'just because' changes. I know a primal rebirth will probably remove a death point from a maxed dragon (not all too sure about that though) but anything else will have to put up with the death point. So it's pretty much just making dragons even less useful to the bipeds than they already are. (Dragon's usefulness consists of Gold Rage, Donkey, and Gold Rage. Oh and Gold Rage. )

I appreciate the things dragons have recieved, but the primal rebirth change takes one of the areas that dragons suck in most and makes it suck even more. What this game has a problem with when it comes to dragons being useful to bipeds just as bipeds are useful to dragons, I will never understand.

/rant off

~Galde

[Deth]

A level 100 Dragon falls into the 28 hour DP I do believe.

[AmonGwareth]

Slash resistance is not on all monsters. More thought has gone into the preparation of resistances and vulnerabilities in the newer monsters. Every monster touched in this content update has at least two areas of extreme vulnerability and two of extreme resistance.

The goal is these changes is to encourage players to use more of the tools at their disposal when fighting monsters. Try other damage types, such as Primal or elemental types or even etheral.

Primal Rebirth has been lowered as a temporary measure. Values over 86400 were throwing quite a few errors on the server. We'll be working on getting that fixed, but in the meantime we've temporarily lowered the value. Superior Resurrect will be lowered in the next patch to blight (this week).

[Galdethriel]

Primal Rebirth has been lowered as a temporary measure. Values over 86400 were throwing quite a few errors on the server. We'll be working on getting that fixed, but in the meantime we've temporarily lowered the value. Superior Resurrect will be lowered in the next patch to blight (this week).

Ah, alright. I'm good. XD

~Galde