Breathing Life into the Economy

[Xarog]

Coin does not leave the Istarian economy very often. The two main ways that it occurs is when people buy plots, and the charge for being teleported somewhere. However, buying a plot is usually a one-time affair, and the cost of using portals is negligible for any established player. The end result is that coins have been collecting in the game world and they don't have any way of escaping.

This is a bad thing because it means that coins aren't useful. You can't do anything with them and it makes trading between players very difficult. Why would I accept something that's useless (if one already has a plot) in exchange for valuable tech resources, for example? The only time that trading is likely to occur is when two players happen to each have an item that the other wants at the right time (because most players do not have a lot of storage space lying around), and given the relatively low shard populations, this just doesn't happen very often.

My suggestion is to create a new kind of pawnbroker. This pawnbroker would have limitless stocks of every kind of resource in the game (and perhaps expert formulas too). The prices that the pawnbroker would go up as the players bought more resources from him, and the prices would fall again as players sold their resources to him.

For example :

Let's say the pawnbroker is selling unspun flax at a price of 10c each. I'm in a hurry and I want a lot of flax fast, so I buy 1000 flax. Suddenly, the price for flax is now 30c each. A lvl 40 gatherer comes a long with a cargo disc full of 500 flax and sells his unspun flax instead of processing it. The pawnbroker's selling price for flax now falls down to 15c each.

The numbers in the previous example are made up to demonstrate the principle. Because the prices would vary, the cost for buying from the pawnbroker would quickly mirror whatever people thought was a reasonable price for the resources, given the time it takes to harvest them. From a game mechanics standpoint, one could create resources using coins, giving them a purpose (much like you could use Nadia to create tech resources by buying them from her).

Players would still be ultimately responsible for the game economy, because if no one sells their wares to the new pawnbroker, the prices would quickly become exhaustively expensive (who would pay 10s per spool of flax, for example?) This would also mean that we wouldn't have to worry about the players who purportedly have over 1 000 gold breaking the system.

Also, this would allow players to use their crafting levels to subsidise their adventure levels, and vice versa. A player that's good at adventuring could gather a large number of vexator fringes, sell them and then buy iron ore to level his blacksmith school. The crafters on the shard, conversely, could sell iron and buy the fringes.

Finally, I would recommend that for "bulk items" (silk, essence orbs, bars, ore, etc.) that the price should increase by 10% for every 1 000 bought or sold. For rarer items, the prices should increase or decrease for every 10 bought or sold. The pawnbroker should charge 15% more for what they sell, compared to the price they buy things for, as this will help to slowly move gold out of the game world and will also discourage market manipulation. The 15% fee will also encourage players to trade directly with each other, ironically enough, but I consider that an added (if unintended) bonus.

[Shinkuu]

This idea does have some merit. I have often wanted to just BUY some resources instead of harvesting them. Sometimes you do not NEED that many more and you just want to cap things off but there is no one to buy them from.

Because very few people actually SELL their resources in the Market and Fewer buy them and fewer still actually manage to make any money crafting in general this just sounds like an overall very good idea.

So if they could throw that in at some point that would be nifty. ESPECIALLY if this new PB can be put onto Plots. Imagine the convenience of that? Of course the more of their stuff is bought the more selling them stuff should net the crafter. So if you can pump them full of what is on demand you should make a pretty Silver.

[AmonGwareth]

We appreciate your ideas, Xarog, and we want to encourage everyone to post their ideas and discuss them.

I have my doubts that selling resources in bulk would do anything for the economy. The problem is really two-fold. 1) Players don't charge for the products they make. 2) Items never leave circulation. Now, there are TONS of threads that have been opened and discussed about these issues over the years. You are welcome to review those.

In my opinion, the only real way to spur the economy is to create new types of items that require effort to create and then are removed from circulation once equipped or used. Thus spurring demand for more items of the same type. Confectioner, Tech-Kits that attune items, and the forth-coming Scholar revamp, are all examples of this.

[Xarog]

We appreciate your ideas, Xarog, and we want to encourage everyone to post their ideas and discuss them.

Well I'm glad I can provide you with something you appreciate.

I have my doubts that selling resources in bulk would do anything for the economy. The problem is really two-fold. 1) Players don't charge for the products they make.

You're right, but I think my suggestion will have an impact on this.

From personal experience, I don't charge gold for what I make simply because it's too much effort for too little reward. I can't do much with the coin I'd make, and trying to trade resources in large quantities is actually quite a headache. You either have to dump it in a connie (location dependent, since you need a friend/guildy with a consigner on a nearby plot close to the resource you wish to work on), or trade very very slowly. And if you don't have access to silos, then you have a very limited amount of space to work with. For example, Vault X barely provides you with more space than a high-end cargo disc. If I want to spend a few hours gathering a resource to sell, I would have to find a seller every half-hour or so. I just don't find it practical or convenient.

But on the other hand, if there's a place I can sell the resources where I don't have to worry about a buyer coming to pick them up in the next 5 minutes, then it becomes far easier for me to go about my day without having to wrack my brains over the logistics of exchanging items.

2) Items never leave circulation. Now, there are TONS of threads that have been opened and discussed about these issues over the years. You are welcome to review those.

This isn't strictly true. There's lots of items that leave the game. Trophies, when handed in, are one example. Crystals can be consumed (although they rarely are). Tech resources are consumed every time you make an item. And finally all the resource items are consumed in the process of leveling a craft school. There's also a vast number of plots with unfinished buildings; I'd be sorely tempted to buy cobalt bars instead of making them myself if it meant that I could finish my JM shops a little more quickly.

I know there's a demand for trophies, for tech resources and for raw materials, because my typical day in Istaria revolves around collecting them and using them. But what is really difficult is collecting them for someone else, but still with the prospect of an exchange for something of similar value. And that's precisely what my suggestion is aimed at changing.

In my opinion, the only real way to spur the economy is to create new types of items that require effort to create and then are removed from circulation once equipped or used. Thus spurring demand for more items of the same type. Confectioner, Tech-Kits that attune items, and the forth-coming Scholar revamp, are all examples of this.

Yeah, it's really nice to see new items making it into the game. Especially the adamantium keys, which gave me an excuse to make a full set of cargo gear teched with Tinkering V.

[Xarog]

This idea does have some merit. I have often wanted to just BUY some resources instead of harvesting them. Sometimes you do not NEED that many more and you just want to cap things off but there is no one to buy them from.

Because very few people actually SELL their resources in the Market and Fewer buy them and fewer still actually manage to make any money crafting in general this just sounds like an overall very good idea.

So if they could throw that in at some point that would be nifty. ESPECIALLY if this new PB can be put onto Plots. Imagine the convenience of that? Of course the more of their stuff is bought the more selling them stuff should net the crafter. So if you can pump them full of what is on demand you should make a pretty Silver.

After giving it some thought, I think having the new trading npc on player plots would be pretty much essential.

The reason for this is that many many resources are far away from anything but player communities, and getting the resources to a trader could take a really long time otherwise.

But again, it would open up a gold sink :

Let's say that ironsilk is trading at 200c/230c each. I wish to get some weaving donw on my plot. I go to rihki, make the ironsilk spools, and sell 10k ironsilk to the trader. No one buys the ironsilk, and the price has now fallen to 100c/115c. I go back to my community, and use one of the traders and buy back 10k ironsilk, turn it into canvas, and apply it to my plot. The npc price for ironsilk is now back at 200c/230c.

I only sold and bought my own ironsilk, and in the process, I gave away about 200s to the trader.

Edit : Actually it's not likely to be 200s. In the above example, the average price the merchant would pay for the ironsilk would be about 150c each. Selling 10k ironsilk at that price would yield 1g 500s. I doubt players would buy ironsilk at those prices. However, if the prices were to be 20/23c and 10/12c, then suddenly the income is 150s for selling them. And if you're buying back, the whole excercise cost you approximately 20s. I think those figures are more reasonable for all concerned.

Also, I should point out that with the prices floating around, all the items will eventually reach parity in terms of what players buy and players sell. If the price is low, then more will buy than will sell which will push the price up. If the price is too high, then more will sell than will buy, pushing the price down. Eventually, all items will reach parity in terms of buyers and sellers, and at that point the trader will for all intents and purposes only pass on items that it got from other players. (A nice side effect of this will be that the devs would be able to tell at a glance whether or not certain tech resources or trophies or resources were too rare or too difficult to gather. If most of the t5 tech resources are trading for 15s, and mithril golem fragments are selling for 50s, then you instantly know that the fragments are much rarer relative to the other t5 tech resources).

[AmonGwareth]

You can build a trader on your plot right now - a Pawnbroker. You can sell resources directly to it.

[Shian]

I have my doubts that selling resources in bulk would do anything for the economy.

Really? I pay quite well for resources. They're nice and universal. I can choose how to use it instead of buying an item I can only use in one instance that I may or may not be doing at that moment.

Thus spurring demand for more items of the same type. Confectioner, Tech-Kits that attune items, and the forth-coming Scholar revamp, are all examples of this.

I prefer consumables that don't restrict where and how I will store it. Trophies, crystals, potions etc. Don't know how other players feel about this issue.

I don't buy or use any of the the new tech kits because it would mean I could no longer keep my scale sets in my lair. I paid good subscription money (and about 6 months of play time as I'm a fast builder) so I could store them there. I am given the choice of getting better equipment but losing the storage for them, hence I stick with the lesser equipment.

I really loathe the person who came up with the attune/soulbound/fused MMO mechanic because it does nothing but restrict already difficult to juggle storage space. Often in other MMOs I'll delete the uber nice item because I have to keep it in my inventory forever instead of letting me put it in my own storage. Already games hug to this mechanic like candy because it is an easy cure-all for them.

"Can only be used by this player" would be a more preferred mechanic to me, like how the boar mask works. I don't have to feel I used up 6-12 months of playtime to build more storage for nothing and you still achieve the effect of only one character able to equip/use the item.

I realize that players already have a large footprint of storage, but adding more quantity of items only compounds the issue. Like food that requires 16 item stack to get rid of a single DP. Thankfully Istaria seems to have this taken care of by being able to buy and store food at the tavern, where players will end up using it.

[Xarog]

You can build a trader on your plot right now - a Pawnbroker. You can sell resources directly to it.

Indeed. But what does it benefit me to do so?

If I sell items to a pawnbroker on my plot, I get coin for it. That coin is very difficult to spend. If not for the coin, what other motivation is there?

Speaking from 2nd hand reports, the last time there was a plot auction, a selling frenzy occured before the auction itself. People spent a lot of time and effort gathering as much as they could from the PBs because they foresaw the need to have a large pool of wealth to outbid other players for what they considered to be "choice plots".

Because of this, I come to the conclusion that the main problem with the economy is that it is hard to spend coin. If players had something they desired and which they could buy with coin, then they would spend it. And if they could spend coin on items they wanted, then it stands to reason that they would sell items for coin too, were they afforded the opportunity to do so.

Nadia used to be considered a goldsink, but from what I can gather, some players and the devs felt that she completely stopped people from hunting for tech resources, so she was removed. Crafters used to sell large volumes of resources to pawnbrokers to buy the items she sold. My suggestion not only gives them an opportunity to do so once again, BUT, it also requires players to still go out and hunt those tech resources. (I.e. the good parts of having Nadia in the game, without the bad parts of having Nadia in the game.) Clearly, if you give people something worthwhile to do with their coins, they will do it.

The pawnbroker and consigner system has some very serious flaws when it comes to facilitating player transactions. Namely :

The items in the pawnbroker disappear shortly after they are sold. This means that items do not stay on pawnbrokers for very long, and players have no control over the prices.

The items on consigners only remain for a week, and since the player retains ownership of the items until such a time as a trade is actually completed, they have to plan in advance unless they wish to suddenly find themselves out of vault space. Also, any items not sold translates players paying a fee for nothing, discouraging players from taking a risk by putting items on a consigner unless they know for a fact that it will sell. This encourages players to use a consigner as a way to help guildies get access to certain consumables for a pittance (since the fee is based on sold cost, a small cost = negligible fee, which players can subsidise for the sake of convenience), negating the prospects of using the consigner for outright trades because access to anyone not in the guild or small circle of friends needs to be restricted.

Pawnbrokers and Consigners mainly appear on player plots, and by default, only pre-approved players have access to those NPCs. This means that by default, the majority of pawnbrokers and consigners are inaccessable to any player selected at random. This forces players to travel prohibitively long distances if they wish to make use of a PB or consigner for the purposes of trading with other players.

(On a personal note, I went from lvl 60 to lvl 100 gatherer by grinding away ironsilk recently. Given the long distances that I would have had to have travelled to store or sell the ironsilk, I just deleted it when I was done with it. It just wasn't worth my time to store it or sell it. I am 100% sure that this ironsilk would have been bought by someone if the price had been reasonable and they had easy access to it, because that much ironsilk could easily get 3 people from lvl 80 to lvl 100 as a tailor or outfitter.

I have a consigner on my plot in South Gate. The ironsilk is in Rihki. Running to South Gate with a full cargo disc to dump the ironsilk there would increase the time it took to level one of the slowest crafting schools by a factor of 10 at the very least. What reasonable person would subject themselves to this on the OFF chance that they may be able to make a few hundred silvers?? But on the other hand, stick a merchant such as I have suggested on a nearby plot, and I can conveniently offload my large bounty of ironsilk and any player who happens to be looking for ironsilk can decide whether or not they wish to purchase it at the current trading price.)

Trading via consigners or PBs requires exhaustive advertising on the part of the players. There is no easy way to look up what is being sold, and because the general presumption is that one does not have access to it, people do not tend to randomly look at consigners or pawnbrokers for items worth purchasing. You have to hope that your message finds a person who would want to use whatever you are selling. This also means that you have to hope that the person has made themselve available for such advertising by joining a channel such as marketplace. And given the likelyhood of having to travel large distances before even setting up such a trade, it makes the whole affair unattractive for both buyer and seller.

My suggestion completely solves every major obstacle that stands in the way of trading goods between players. I am 100% positive that I have demonstrated in these posts that it is those obstacles which is the real problem with the Istarian economy, and that without these obstacles that trading will pick up dramatically between players. As long as there is still levels to be got, there will be a demand for the items that give those levels. Give the players the facility to supply that demand effeciently and trade WILL occur.

[Guaran]

..Edit : Actually it's not likely to be 200s. In the above example, the average price the merchant would pay for the ironsilk would be about 150c each. Selling 10k ironsilk at that price would yield 1g 500s. I doubt players would buy ironsilk at those prices. However, if the prices were to be 20/23c and 10/12c, then suddenly the income is 150s for selling them. And if you're buying back, the whole excercise cost you approximately 20s. I think those figures are more reasonable for all concerned..

I can't approve of a suggestion like that since it would simply be way to easy to level craft schools by simply buying and burning thru resources. Unlimited stocks of resources? Bad bad bad idea.

I think you are overstating the "problem" of people having coin. If people have excess and they feel it is "worthless" then for all intents that coin has already "left the game".

Coin isn't worthless. It's used for trading so that you can buy and sell resources without making the difficult bulk trades you mentioned.

[Xarog]

I can't approve of a suggestion like that since it would simply be way to easy to level craft schools by simply buying and burning thru resources. Unlimited stocks of resources? Bad bad bad idea.

The more you buy, the higher the price goes. Unless someone else starts selling repeatedly, you'll quickly be paying 50s per item. Would you pay 5 gold for an inventory full of silk? I don't think so. This is why I said that no matter what the item, there would quickly be a balance in terms of buyers and sellers. This means that for all intents and purposes, the economy is still 100% player driven. It also means that for all intents and purposes, there is an elegant way to exchange almost any resource for almost any other resource in a manner which keeps the game's supply and demand of items in balance.

I think you are overstating the "problem" of people having coin. If people have excess and they feel it is "worthless" then for all intents that coin has already "left the game".

I never said there was a problem with people having coin, though. If that is what you think I said, then I think you should re-read what I said.

Coin isn't worthless. It's used for trading so that you can buy and sell resources without making the difficult bulk trades you mentioned.

Except you're still forced to make the difficult bulk trades for various reasons.

[Shian]

I can't approve of a suggestion like that since it would simply be way to easy to level craft schools by simply buying and burning thru resources. Unlimited stocks of resources? Bad bad bad idea.

It wouldn't be wholly unlimited. If someone has not sold that resource to the merchant in a while, the prices would be too high for a new or leveling player to feasibly buy to level, but someone making something that requires one of each resource would buy.

Someone that is leveling off it can choose to sell bulk resources for coin so they can get the coin to buy a different resource. At the very least such a thing would make coin very valuable very quickly.

The problem is not that people don't charge for the items. Yes, that is part of the problem, but there is no easy way to fix it without a dramatic need for it like this suggestion.

I've tried charging for items, but people don't want to spend coin. I've tried offering to buy large stacks of resources, but people don't want to keep coin or trade it for time. Coin just seems to be not a valid exchange item in the current economy.

[Guaran]

...I've tried charging for items, but people don't want to spend coin. I've tried offering to buy large stacks of resources, but people don't want to keep coin or trade it for time. Coin just seems to be not a valid exchange item in the current economy.

If people do not want to spend coin, then what point would this npc serve? People not wanting to spend coin implies they are already placing some value in it.

Coin is a valid means of exchange.

As I have said before in many other threads discussing the "economy" or lack thereof, the economy will fix itself once there are more players.

The problem of people "not wanting to pay", basically expecting things for free: these people I tell to find someone else to supply them. This is a problem of the current player populations' own creation.

As far as "bulk trade problems" thats what consignors (the regular type) are for. Alternatively you can use a silo. Set permissions as needed if you need to sell/trade something that is a large stack. Your suggested npc from the sounds of some of the examples Xarog has provided simply sounds like a way of transporting resources from npc to npc, bypassing the use of cargo disks. Can't say I recommend that. The other half of the suggestion: Trading mithril bars for dim orbs via some kind of exchange npc is simply another type of shortcut. Because the Mithril bars will have to be classed with a higher value. i.e. spend 20 minutes making mithril bars and get 90 minutes worth of Dim orbs. Cheating the timesinks of the game. Bad idea.

Use a regular consignor. This is how we already do it on chaos and it works fine. Need 5000 dim orbs? Mention it in marketplace and what you are willing to pay, and ask for them to be listed on the Bristugo consignor. Someone, even multiple players may respond to the offer. You come back a few hours later and pick up your order.

[Sigi]

Since coin is needed now instead of lore tokens for buying forms the value of coin has already raised.

Agree with Guaran for the rest.

[GlindorOcculus]

The other half of the suggestion: Trading mithril bars for dim orbs via some kind of exchange npc is simply another type of shortcut. Because the Mithril bars will have to be classed with a higher value. i.e. spend 20 minutes making mithril bars and get 90 minutes worth of Dim orbs.

Where did you read anything about this being an "exchange npc"?

[Xarog]

If people do not want to spend coin, then what point would this npc serve? People not wanting to spend coin implies they are already placing some value in it.

I'm quite happy to spend coin, but there's never anything I want to buy. For example, I've been looking for radiant holding crystals. I'd even offer 100s each. Haven't had a single person wanting to trade yet.

Coin is a valid means of exchange.

Why, because the game has designated it as the official means of exchange? You still can't trade the coin in for anything useful. The coin never vanishes. All you are doing is swapping it around a bit. It's like trading large numbers of beginner formulas instead. Who cares if you have a stack of 10k? At least the beginner formulas have a theoretical use.

As I have said before in many other threads discussing the "economy" or lack thereof, the economy will fix itself once there are more players.

That would be wrong, and in all my time being part of this game, I have never seen any indication that the playerbase is going to suddenly increase. It's silly to pin your hopes on a solution that requires something that is probably never going to happen.

The problem of people "not wanting to pay", basically expecting things for free: these people I tell to find someone else to supply them. This is a problem of the current player populations' own creation.

When you can't do anything with the coin, trading for coin is the same as giving it away for free. Because the coin is useless. It serves no purpose. Why would anyone cause themselves the extra difficulty of finding someone willing to give away some coin? Masochism?

Without other players, I can make use of and enjoy : trophies, crystals, raw materials, formulas, tech components, tech forms, hoard. I cannot do this with coin. Because I cannot do this with coin, other players are similarly stuck. Coin needs a way to be useful and to be consumed, and my suggestion provides for that need.

As far as "bulk trade problems" thats what consignors (the regular type) are for. Alternatively you can use a silo.

Provided that you can find someone who is online and willing to give you such access. Given the large breaks paying players take, this is NOT as easy as you make it sound. If you fill a silo with goods, trading the goods can take a good hour, because the person buying the goods has to move it somewhere else and then come back etc. Why am I going to waste all that time sitting around bored for coin that I can't use? Why do you think I deleted 40 gatherer levels worth of ironsilk? Do you really think it was something I wanted to do?

Set permissions as needed if you need to sell/trade something that is a large stack. Your suggested npc from the sounds of some of the examples Xarog has provided simply sounds like a way of transporting resources from npc to npc, bypassing the use of cargo disks. Can't say I recommend that.

Because all the trades would incur a fee from the npc (I suggested 15%), such behaviour would become quite expensive. Also, there is nothing stopping anyone else from buying what you have sold, so the behaviour carries an inherent risk.

The other half of the suggestion: Trading mithril bars for dim orbs via some kind of exchange npc is simply another type of shortcut. Because the Mithril bars will have to be classed with a higher value. i.e. spend 20 minutes making mithril bars and get 90 minutes worth of Dim orbs. Cheating the timesinks of the game. Bad idea.

You didn't read my posts properly, Guaran.

Had you done so, you would know that the costs for the items are determined automatically. As more people buy items, the price goes up. As more people sell items, the price goes down. If no one sells dim orbs, then the price will quickly be equal to that of mithril. With this system there is no such thing as cheating the timesinks of the game. Those items that are quick and easy to supply will be quick and easy to get to the merchant NPC as well. If no one wants to sell an item, the price will go up until such a time as the selling price becomes attractive. The stabilisation of price for any trade will occur when the effort required to aquire the items is at parity with all the other items in the game.

Or to put it another way : I have 1 hour to play the game. It takes me 5 minutes to get a cargo disc full of dim essence to the trader. It takes me 10 minutes to get a cargo disc full of mithril to the trader. Now let's say that the trading prices on that day has mithril being bought by the npc for 3 times that of the dim essence. So let's pretend its 5c for the essence and 15c for the mithril, and that a disc can hold 1000 essence or mithril. Given that I have 1 hour to play the game, would I rather make 90s gathering mithril, or would I make 60s gathering essence?

Obviously, I'm going to spend time gathering mithril. However, every time I sell mithril to the npc, the price for mithril drops. So after an hour, maybe the cost is only 10c for mithril now. At that point, I can make 60s an hour whether or not I gather essence or gather mithril. At that point, no matter which way I spend my hour, I'm more or less going to be making the same amount of money. Because all the players will be searching to get the best possible deal at any given time, any anomalies in terms of coin per hour will quickly get evened out. The timesink is the timesink, and players will not be getting around it any time soon.

Use a regular consignor. This is how we already do it on chaos and it works fine.

If it worked fine, there would be a functioning economy. There isn't one. As I have stated above, when there was an actual use for coin (plot auctions), players spent a LOT of effort gathering as much coin as possible. When there is a use and a demand for coin, players will trade for it (both ways).

Need 5000 dim orbs? Mention it in marketplace and what you are willing to pay, and ask for them to be listed on the Bristugo consignor. Someone, even multiple players may respond to the offer. You come back a few hours later and pick up your order.

I have never seen this happen. And if I need orbs for whatever reason, frankly it's less of a hassle for me to gather them myself and process them instantly than it is to wait for someone else that "may" respond to my offer. As a person gathering orbs, I'm not about to respond to someone asking when I don't even know if they'll log on tomorrow to pick it up.

[LOVWYRM]

Xarog, I agree with most of what you`ve said.
(I made a thread with similar request, some weeks ago)

This is an important prob, and sry Amon, I see no way to get it solved, even in the far future if nothing is done about it.

*sigh* do we live in different worlds? Is there such a big difference between the shards? Or between the vet players and middle term players?

Though we never shared coin in the 6 years we play Istaria, we have lots of gold- not as much as our friends have- but lots.
And nothing to buy for. Not in consis, not from not-befriended players.
Its- as you said- useless for me and my friends.
I bought a little plot (made an extra sub for) and would have given all our gold for getting it build. I did not want to ask my friends for help this time- they build up the other 2 plots I own^^- for free^^.
After 2 month I sold this little plot again. Same with a friend who had 3 plots and a lot of gold in it.
I would pay for a lot of things: Ressis, comps, fluff, services, boss mob parts-
in the meantime I give coin to players who need it-and give away other things for free, and do not charge for services.
And THAT is bad for the economy

Its time that the devs do something about it

btw- if you play on order Xarog, contact me for the holding crystals-
I have enough- and do not dare to offer me coin for that

[AmonGwareth]

Allowing resources to be sold directly from a NPC in virtually unlimited quanties is not the answer you are looking for. I'm sorry, Xarog, Lov, but you are wrong about this.

Gathering resources and crafting is a time-sink. If you remove that time-stink you devalue things even further. Time is the only truly valuable commodity in an online game. It takes time to grow your character, to gather resources, to earn coin. I just don't feel that you can alter something so fundamental to the game as that without serious consequences in the long-term. Consequences that would be difficult to plan for and which aren't guaranteed to be positive for the game's future.

Ultimately changes of this type effect players in a major way and while some will almost surely like it, some won't. But ultimately it will have an impact and my gut tells me that it would be a negative one.

I'm sorry, I just don't see it as a viable solution.

Boiling down your argument I see it as this: You need things to spend your coin on. Things that other people or the game itself can provide. You mentioned trophies and tech comps, but that isn't enough. And so we're working on adding more things for you to spend your coin on.

[LOVWYRM]

I was not clear in my last post: I did not mean buy ressources from npc
but from players- sry

Thy much Amon for your answer and the chance for nice things to spent our coin for in the future

[Mearis]

Good morning my fellow Istarians, Amon what about putting one castle in game. I know they require a ton of graphic resources. So how about a new project. Open a new island, pretty much void of anything except a portal that can not be reached by anybody even by dragons until the passage is complete. We players will have to build the portal to reach it, once dragons build out the passage way to it through a mountain to reach a where the portal was lost on the "mainland". Once we manage to build the passage to the portal. We would have to build the portal itself. Then we would be able to port to the island and find a castle in ruin. On this island we would find a few NPCs one of which sort of acts as a consigner of sorts except with no fees. Accepting a new item similar to the old Imperial Parcels. Which would need to build out massive quantities of. Or even just make it so a player can a deposit of a disc full of normal resources for someone who has the skills to process them in to the "parcels". However these resources would not be allowed to construct anything other then the "parcels" once the "consigner" on the island trades them. This way there is a new project that will use more resources then any we have ever undertaken. Of course with the runined castle there we would need to repair parts of it and completely build out missing parts of the castle. Or we could pay an NPC an insane amount of coin that will instantly mark part of the castle like a half of a percent complete. This would be a huge coin drain, resource drain, and would open up something the majority of us have never seen in game. This would also be a perfect opportunity to open more quests about the lore.

Hope ya have a great one!

Mearis

[Xarog]

Allowing resources to be sold directly from a NPC in virtually unlimited quanties is not the answer you are looking for.

You are 100% correct here. That is not the answer I am looking for.

Gathering resources and crafting is a time-sink. If you remove that time-stink you devalue things even further. Time is the only truly valuable commodity in an online game.

Again, I agree completely. Which is why I feel I have to ask : Why do you think my suggestion does not preserve the time-sink nature of the game? If the price only stops rising when players add as much to the npc as they take, doesn't that mean that at some point, players will simply be trading with other players?