WoW, This Game is Terrible

[Kesqui]

Note, I haven't played other games for very long - I've only played Istaria. Why? Because the entire reason I play is to play a dragon character. No other game gives that, therefore I'm not going to play any other game. I won't even be playing WoW with the transform-to-dragon-mount thing, because that's not the same as being able to PLAY as a dragon. I played Rappelz for a little while, and I learned I HATE PVP with a passion.

Anyway, my largest gripe is that they are money vampires. First off, you have to buy the game. Okay, last I checked, that's at least 20-something dollars, maybe more.

I have (somewhere) three ORIGINAL Horizons discs. Bought at £40 apiece. In 2003 the subscription fee was also more expensive. I quit in 2004 because I couldn't *afford* to play any more... especially not a game that so dreadfully gimped the "draw" character class. I came back in 2009 because the "draw" character class still only exists in Istaria.

And you know what? If it'd get more content into the game, and get the content players were asking for into the game, I'd BUY expansion packs, and although I know that the developers are against it, I wish there was the opportunity for microtransactions. ANY money to keep a game I love running = good money. Please, Virtrium, LET me throw you a couple of quid here and there to get little doodads in the game that aren't important to gameplay but look cool in, say, my lair. I tossed hundreds of pounds at Virtual Horse Ranch for custom horse colours, for goodness' sake... but I didn't want extra subscriptions.

[sarcasm mode]Oh that evil money-grubbing Istaria, playing a dragon isn't free after the first fourteen days, how dare they charge a subscription at all![/sarcasm mode]

Then there's the world system. Granted, Istaria has that, but only three-fold, and each that cadre to a different style of player, from role-players, to beta-testers, to the common gamer; those being the Order, Blight, and Chaos shards respectively. WoW on the other hand is a game which has little in terms of "dedicated" worlds and more along the lines of simple mass quantity to be able to accommodate for their huge player base. Problem is, in creating a character, they in turn become locked to the world in which they were created.

In 2003 in Horizons there were the European shards (good luck playing with your friends if you were an ex-pat American living in the UK...) and the American shards. In Europe we had Ice, Wind and Earth. I don't remember what shards there were in the North American region. In 2004 - shortly after I left - they merged the EU shards into Unity. And, of course, now it looks like all the American shards have been merged, and we have a mere three shards.

Although I can transfer to Blight for free, I can't transfer to Order for free - and if I transfer to Blight, that character can't be transferred back out.

Next, we have the players themselves. And, my god, if you haven't been on a WoW server, you haven't seen nasty. The people in this game can be freaking vicious--no, rabid--NO, psychotic. Yeah, that. Absolutely, crack-pot, bat-crap insane. Hostility? Through the roof. l33t-freaks? Like you wouldn't believe. Murderers? ...In some cases. Did you know?

Can you actually provide a cited reference for a death that's directly attributable to World of Warcraft?

There are a few.... odd... players in Istaria, too. Heaven forfend you should be minding your own business, playing as a dragon hatchling, and accept a group invite from another newbie dragon hatchling. You've got an even chance of getting someone who wants to show you "dragon mating positions". *sigh* Yes, it really, actually happened in game. Creepy.

On top of that, the game play is very much group-oriented.... Forced group game play is a massive no-no in my books. It should be totally optional and you should be able to solo 100% of the game without any help what-so-ever if you desire.

I wait with bated breath to see the videos of you soloing Reklar, Valkor, Fafnir, Son of Gigaroth, the Rift Bosses.... that'd be AWESOME fight footage.

I suspect that in WoW you would be able to play certain content "solo" as much as you like - it's just going to make things take longer, or be a bit more tedious, or change how you play a bit.

Playing Istaria solo is similar - your hunting style has to be different, the creatures you hunt are different.

Because obviously your player has a limited memory bank in that brain of theirs and can only learn so much before their brain seizes up and can't learn any more. Not unlike real life. Wait, no, that's no like real life at all. In fact, it's the opposite... hmm...

In real life you don't see people who know everything there is to know about Biochemistry and Blacksmithing and Gemcutting and Sculpting, yatta yatta yatta... people tend to either be a "journeyman" at multiple trades, a "beginner" at ALL trades or a master of one or two related trades.

I have an Istarian character who is a Confectioner. She may someday be a confectioner/alchemist. Because someday I'd like to be able to make some of the fancy-coloured dyes that are only available at Master alchemy level. But I really, really, really can't be bothered training her up in everything else (not least because I don't LIKE playing a biped particularly).... even if I know I can train her up in all of them.

I think the whole idea behind buying a game and still paying a subscription is just a way to milk your players for money.

Factoring in the cost of the game and all the subsequent expansions, assuming you're hardcore and buy them on the day they come out, when they cost the most, then, no, it's not. It's still a huge cash-cow to them and nothing more.

Games need money to survive. If the cash cow stops giving milk, they starve and die. EVERY game needs a cash cow... they aren't being run "out of the goodness of someone's heart".

You shouldn't have to create 50 different characters just so you can experience everything a game has to offer. You should be able to do it in 1.

Please explain this to Virtrium, that I should be able to experience all of the game's features with just one character. I would like to have a dragon confectioner character. I would like my dragon confectioner character to be able to make alchemical dyes. I would also like my dragon confectioner/scalecrafter/lairshaper/crystalshaper/alchemist/warrior to be able to join the Cleric school. Kesqui's always wanted to be able to cast Group Heal.

Whoops. I've gotta have at least two characters to play those schools - a dragon and a biped. And I don't like playing bipeds.

As for switching characters to other worlds, I was comparing it to Istaria's three because there's only three.

Because the game population is too low to support having more. Historically there were more, and if the game had a huge boost in population they'd probably have to open more shards simply to reduce lag issues.

It is if it gets harder every time, with the enemies employing new abilities or "tricks" to fight you with. Getting smarter, getting stronger, using new attacks, etc always ensures the battles are never quite the same. And besides, it's not like you're being forced to do them again and again, like you said.

The 97th Fire Opal Golem I fought pretty much was the same battle as the second Fire Opal Golem I fought... they don't come up with new tricks. And if I was supposed to switch to some other mob for "new experiences" ... well, that doesn't work with the "playing solo" aspect very well. Fire Opal Golems just happened to be the most efficient mob to fight in order to gain experience for what I was doing.

I'm sure I had more to say, but I've got to go to work now...

[Armameteus]

Note, I haven't played other games for very long - I've only played Istaria. Why? Because the entire reason I play is to play a dragon character. No other game gives that, therefore I'm not going to play any other game. I won't even be playing WoW with the transform-to-dragon-mount thing, because that's not the same as being able to PLAY as a dragon. I played Rappelz for a little while, and I learned I HATE PVP with a passion.

I have (somewhere) three ORIGINAL Horizons discs. Bought at £40 apiece. In 2003 the subscription fee was also more expensive. I quit in 2004 because I couldn't *afford* to play any more... especially not a game that so dreadfully gimped the "draw" character class. I came back in 2009 because the "draw" character class still only exists in Istaria.

And you know what? If it'd get more content into the game, and get the content players were asking for into the game, I'd BUY expansion packs, and although I know that the developers are against it, I wish there was the opportunity for microtransactions. ANY money to keep a game I love running = good money. Please, Virtrium, LET me throw you a couple of quid here and there to get little doodads in the game that aren't important to gameplay but look cool in, say, my lair. I tossed hundreds of pounds at Virtual Horse Ranch for custom horse colours, for goodness' sake... but I didn't want extra subscriptions.

[sarcasm mode]Oh that evil money-grubbing Istaria, playing a dragon isn't free after the first fourteen days, how dare they charge a subscription at all![/sarcasm mode]

There are games and websites much on Istaria's level that are run, in most cases, purely on the money that can be collected from subs. Making the player pay huge sums of money for the disks is outrageous because of that fact. All that money goes straight into the developers' pockets because, hey, it's a cash cow--all it's about is the money. I'm aware that everyone needs money to make a living, but it's the fact that such a huge sum of said money goes toward anything but the game that money came from.

I don't mind buying the games and expansions, sure. Just so long as they are stupid-expensive. But they are.

Alright then, how about the subs? Surely, since the game already costs so very much to buy, the subs must be a bit cheaper to compensate? Nope. Didn't think so.

I'm not saying I don't agree with the idea that money going into the company = content going into the game. Hell, if it meant I could make games I enjoy better, I'd donate money to the cause. It's the fact that huge amounts of that money don't even go toward the game's development. Kind of like WoW and Blizzard. I don't know about Istaria, but they don't accept those kinds of things, as you've said, so I can't really compare the two.

In 2003 in Horizons there were the European shards (good luck playing with your friends if you were an ex-pat American living in the UK...) and the American shards. In Europe we had Ice, Wind and Earth. I don't remember what shards there were in the North American region. In 2004 - shortly after I left - they merged the EU shards into Unity. And, of course, now it looks like all the American shards have been merged, and we have a mere three shards.

Although I can transfer to Blight for free, I can't transfer to Order for free - and if I transfer to Blight, that character can't be transferred back out.

The points you're making are all in the past. In the past WoW didn't exist. Does that equate to saying that This game was more popular than that one because at some point in time Istaria was more popular and at some point in time WoW wasn't?

The reason I'm not playing WoW now is because I don't like it now. The reason I play Istaria now is because I like it now. As I said in another post here somewhere, the changes that are made to a game can't simply be ignored because "it used to be like this, you know." Changes, deliberate or otherwise, wanted or not, for the "right" reasons or the "wrong", have made this game at current better than WoW. Less servers means less need for world-hopping--oh, I've already said all this.

Can you actually provide a cited reference for a death that's directly attributable to World of Warcraft?

Admittedly, no, I can't. The only reason I brought it up is because I remember watching it on the news one day. They'd reiterated about it constantly for quite a while. Watching the full hour, seeing it over and over, I assume that my memory hasn't completely failed me of yet.

But, no, I don't have anything I can actually cite. Then again, if you look something up on google, I'm sure you'd find it somewhere, eventually. Regardless of whether or not it's legit, hearing even rumors about something like that is enough to at least put me off of it. Again, this whole thing is more about my opinion than actual evidence, so I'm really just stating what I've heard and following my gut. Even if it's not entirely true, I still don't feel right about it.

There are a few.... odd... players in Istaria, too. Heaven forfend you should be minding your own business, playing as a dragon hatchling, and accept a group invite from another newbie dragon hatchling. You've got an even chance of getting someone who wants to show you "dragon mating positions". *sigh* Yes, it really, actually happened in game. Creepy.

Why doesn't anyone realize, no matter how many times I say it, I'm not trying to put Istaria into the "perfect" category by any means. I know there are weird people on here. I've had the unfortunate chance of encountering one. I just told him to bugger off, but, yeah, it was still pretty messed up. The reason I prefer Istaria over WoW is simply because it occurs far more in WoW.

I wait with bated breath to see the videos of you soloing Reklar, Valkor, Fafnir, Son of Gigaroth, the Rift Bosses.... that'd be AWESOME fight footage.

I suspect that in WoW you would be able to play certain content "solo" as much as you like - it's just going to make things take longer, or be a bit more tedious, or change how you play a bit.

Playing Istaria solo is similar - your hunting style has to be different, the creatures you hunt are different.

And the same goes for this comment too. Never said Istaria was perfect. Just said it was better. It still has these problems and after being told so many times in this thread, I'm well aware of that fact. Really, it's when people don't take the time to hear the whole story that they jump to conclusions like this. I've already said this. It's not perfect and I'm aware of that. There, I said it again.

I'm not happy about the fact that, if I want to fight those bosses, I'll have to group up with people. I hate asking for help in MMOs (for good reason) and even with Istaria's community, it's practically hard-wired into me by now. You bug somebody online, nine times out of ten, they get hostile. That's just how it is on big MMOs. Istaria isn't like that, and that's great, but it doesn't mean I actually like to bug other people to help me. If I could, I would solo them. However, it's obviously not possible, given what you and many others have said over and over again. Do I think it's a flaw? Yes, I do.

[sarcasm mode]There, I said it; Istaria is flawed! It's not perfect! Oh dear god, the world is ending! I'm admitting Istaria's not perfect![/sarcasm mode]

You'd think that, since I never openly stated it was, people would get the idea that I like it more, but not to such a degree that I think it's perfect. I didn't think it was something that needed to be said. I'll have to remember to be more blunt next time I rant. Or, is it more obvious?

In real life you don't see people who know everything there is to know about Biochemistry and Blacksmithing and Gemcutting and Sculpting, yatta yatta yatta... people tend to either be a "journeyman" at multiple trades, a "beginner" at ALL trades or a master of one or two related trades.

And, once again, as a result of not reading my responses to other people, I find myself repeating... myself.

I compared it to real life in the sense that grouping up with other people easily is in fact non-existent. You can't just ask someone to be a friend and they'll say "sure". That's not how life works. However, in many MMOs, they force you to buddy-up with multiple people to combat a single challenge. This I find annoying because, in more cases than not, if you attempt to ask people to help you on WoW, you get shunned. Why? Because, as Shian put it, being anonymous somehow gives people the right to also be a jerk, as most seem to believe.

Istaria is better than WoW because, at current, it's not like that at all. If I did ask for help, nine times out of ten, I can expect to either be accepted from the get-go or at the very least politely told that they're too busy. Which would you choose? The countless hoards of jerk-offs that call you some derogatory word for even asking? Or the Istarian community that, at the very worst, will tell you they're sorry that they can't help out? Kind of a no-brainer there.

I have an Istarian character who is a Confectioner. She may someday be a confectioner/alchemist. Because someday I'd like to be able to make some of the fancy-coloured dyes that are only available at Master alchemy level. But I really, really, really can't be bothered training her up in everything else (not least because I don't LIKE playing a biped particularly).... even if I know I can train her up in all of them.

And, like I've already said to someone else, it's all your preference. I don't like the bipeds much either. I mean, the biggest attraction that brought me to Istaria was the ability to play as a dragon, yeah. Add to that, they're actually a pretty good beginner creature if you ever want to play the game, because right now they're really simple, with few classes to worry about (Not that a few more wouldn't be welcome, but that's beside the point).

Does it mean I'll never play as a biped? Probably not. I've wanted to try a Sslik for a while, but I'm the type of guy that likes to "finish" a character before going onto another one. So it might be a while until then. Does that mean though that I'm not going to try for a max in every singe class? Heck no. I take it as a challenge. Would I give it every last ounce of my effort? Too right I would. Why? Because I can. If that's not your cup of tea, then it's just not. Am I trying to dissuade you from playing WoW? No. I'm just stating my opinion. If you don't like the idea of grinding up your character (or at least trying in come form or fashion to gain them a fair number of levels), then don't. I'm not forcing you.

What your saying is almost like you're attacking my opinion. It's my opinion, not some rule you're being told to follow. Basing any argument on opinions is pointless because they don't get anywhere. People all have different opinions. Unless you're giving some form of valid argument against it (Ie. finding some reason other than "I don't agree") to oppose my statement, then I don't even have any reason to be defending myself.

So, to reiterate once again, it's my opinion and nothing more. What you've just said is your opinion. And nothing more. I don't have to take it any more seriously than you do for mine.

*sigh* Anyway, back on-topic...

Games need money to survive. If the cash cow stops giving milk, they starve and die. EVERY game needs a cash cow... they aren't being run "out of the goodness of someone's heart".

Refer back to the first response of this... set of responses. I don't know what it's called. "Response tree"? Whatever it's called, it applies here too.

Please explain this to Virtrium, that I should be able to experience all of the game's features with just one character. I would like to have a dragon confectioner character. I would like my dragon confectioner character to be able to make alchemical dyes. I would also like my dragon confectioner/scalecrafter/lairshaper/crystalshaper/alchemist/warrior to be able to join the Cleric school. Kesqui's always wanted to be able to cast Group Heal.

Whoops. I've gotta have at least two characters to play those schools - a dragon and a biped. And I don't like playing bipeds.

You forgot your "[sarcasm]" "[/sarcasm]" tags.

It's a different situation when the character you've chosen to play is deliberately shaped to be different from every other character in the game. WoW's doesn't quite fit, because it's two whole factions that are different from one another. Istaria's is one single type of creature, making it unique, rather than simply "different from these guys, but the same as these guys". I like to think of it as a game within a game. It does encourage you to play as other creatures to be able to utilize other abilities, but it's not forcing you to be one of every creature to get everything in the game. Just either dragon or biped. Two characters is not asking much.

WoW's character system on the other hand works on the basis that the two factions are different from the other, but the creatures within each are incredibly similar to one another in terms of abilities/stats/weapons and armour, etc. However, each type of creature within that faction also follows a very linear plot progression based around their race. Even though they're part of the Alliance, Elves have to follow the elven plot and cannot take part in human plots, for example. This makes experiencing the full, all-encompassing plot tedious because it's sort of like playing the same character over and over, just through different storylines. Essentially, it's asking you to play as one of every character to get the full story, even though many characters are tediously similar. That is asking too much.

Much of what can be done in Istaria is different. As far as I've seen, Dragons have their own major plot based around their race, but can still interact to a degree into the biped's plots, though, of course, not to a very intimate one. To experience the full biped plots, you need only choose a biped and start playing because you can literally do everything every biped can do as only one biped. You don't need to switch races over and over, playing the same general type of creature to experience numerous plots. It's either Dragon, with their own plot, or biped with their own plots. Far less demanding for a player then WoW.

Again, it's like a game within a game. The dragon campaign or the biped campaign. For WoW... it's just a mess.

Because the game population is too low to support having more. Historically there were more, and if the game had a huge boost in population they'd probably have to open more shards simply to reduce lag issues.

Refer to me second response in this "response tree" (yeah, I still don't know what it's really called). Stop living in the past.

As for the future, yes, Virtrium would likely need to make more servers again. But that is not for us to see. For it is currently the present, and my argument is not based on where both games will be in so much time, but where they are now. For all I know, in 5 years, Istaria could become the single most popular MMO of all time. Same as WoW could fall of the face of the earth and vanish forever. We just don't know. Right now this game is, in my eyes, better than WoW (not perfect, mind you, but better).

The 97th Fire Opal Golem I fought pretty much was the same battle as the second Fire Opal Golem I fought... they don't come up with new tricks. And if I was supposed to switch to some other mob for "new experiences" ... well, that doesn't work with the "playing solo" aspect very well. Fire Opal Golems just happened to be the most efficient mob to fight in order to gain experience for what I was doing.

When I said that, I was referring to the hypothetical difficulty system that I already talked about before. In which, by increasing or decreasing the hypothetical difficulty, it would cause said mob to react in battle accordingly. Easy = easier battle, but with little reward, hard = harder battle (perhaps only doable in a group), but with huge reward. The idea was that this would allow a player to solo everything, with little reward, but still be able to experience the full content of the game. Harder difficulties would then create the need for groups, as well as make the mobs smarter, stronger, use different abilities/attacks, and so on. Hypothetically, it would solve the problem of forced grouping up to a point so players could get a full play-through of the game up to the "final boss" (if there is one) and still allow for repeat run-throughs of the battle(s) in which said mobs would employ better tactics as listed above, thus making the battle slightly different every time and ensuring that the game play not go stale very easily, still allow group play, amass greater reward every time, etc, etc, etc.

This was all my attempt at finding a solution to the forced-grouping problem that many MMOs employ today. I was speaking as if it were existent in WoW, Istaria and other various MMOs. Which it's sadly not. Yes, Istaria does it too, with those final bosses, but WoW does it even more so throughout the entire game. I don't mind missing out on a few bosses as much as I do missing out on a massive chunk of the game itself. WoW does this. You want proof? Ask Shian.

[Kesqui]

All that money goes straight into the developers' pockets because, hey, it's a cash cow--all it's about is the money. I'm aware that everyone needs money to make a living, but it's the fact that such a huge sum of said money goes toward anything but the game that money came from.

*shrug* I wouldn't be so sure that so much money goes into "anything but the game". Game servers aren't cheap to run, neither is it cheap to keep developers on staff. I work in IT - and believe me, I see first-hand how expensive it CAN be to keep just a simple brochure website running.

I don't begrudge anyone earning a living, even if they're making more money than me.

Admittedly, no, I can't. The only reason I brought it up is because I remember watching it on the news one day. They'd reiterated about it constantly for quite a while....
But, no, I don't have anything I can actually cite. Then again, if you look something up on google, I'm sure you'd find it somewhere, eventually. Regardless of whether or not it's legit, hearing even rumors about something like that is enough to at least put me off of it.

Fair enough; I don't put that much stock in rumour, and prefer to see actual evidence and proof. Anyone could be axe crazy - for all we know, there could be an axe-crazy member of this conversation. Some people might nominate me for that position seeing as I keep snakes, simply because "snake keepers are tattooed motorcycling weirdos". (I look like a librarian.)

But I refuse to tar fellow gamers with the "some people who play X game might be axe crazy, therefore they're ALL axe crazy" brush.

And the same goes for this comment too. Never said Istaria was perfect. Just said it was better. It still has these problems and after being told so many times in this thread, I'm well aware of that fact. Really, it's when people don't take the time to hear the whole story that they jump to conclusions like this. I've already said this. It's not perfect and I'm aware of that. There, I said it again.

And I'm not arguing that Istaria is perfect - or that it's fundamentally flawed - I'm just saying that a number of things you've mentioned as being bad things about WoW may ALSO be bad things about Istaria.

I'm not happy about the fact that, if I want to fight those bosses, I'll have to group up with people. I hate asking for help in MMOs (for good reason) and even with Istaria's community, it's practically hard-wired into me by now. You bug somebody online, nine times out of ten, they get hostile. That's just how it is on big MMOs. Istaria isn't like that, and that's great, but it doesn't mean I actually like to bug other people to help me. If I could, I would solo them. However, it's obviously not possible, given what you and many others have said over and over again. Do I think it's a flaw? Yes, I do.

And, as I said - if you don't get out of that mindset with Istaria, you will find that there are bosses you CANNOT fight on your own and you MUST rely on the assistance of strangers - or friends you don't know yet, as I tend to think about 'em on Istaria at least. Even to progress your own character to ancienthood (and likely to progress your character to adulthood unless you're going to go for 80+ADV/80CRA hatchling).

Why is it a flaw to ask players to hunt in packs, to help each other, and to provide content where if you refuse to hunt in a pack you can either try (and fail) or just not do that content? If you want a game that doesn't require multiple players, why play a multiplayer game?

And, once again, as a result of not reading my responses to other people, I find myself repeating... myself.

I read them. I am responding to what you have said in my own way - as I felt that MY responses to your points are different enough to the responses of others to your points that they were worth making.

I compared it to real life in the sense that grouping up with other people easily is in fact non-existent. You can't just ask someone to be a friend and they'll say "sure". That's not how life works. However, in many MMOs, they force you to buddy-up with multiple people to combat a single challenge.

I suppose I see things a bit differently - I have to ask total strangers for help, assistance or services every single day, and I get asked for help or services by total strangers every day too. The only difference for me is that in-game, it's not important if someone doesn't want to help me (or if I don't want to ask, or I don't want to help) because it's just a game. In real life, I have to obtain the help of others (or help others) and it DOES count and HAS to be done, no choice about it.

Istaria is better than WoW because, at current, it's not like that at all. If I did ask for help, nine times out of ten, I can expect to either be accepted from the get-go or at the very least politely told that they're too busy. Which would you choose? The countless hoards of jerk-offs that call you some derogatory word for even asking? Or the Istarian community that, at the very worst, will tell you they're sorry that they can't help out? Kind of a no-brainer there.

Which is fair enough - as I've said, I don't PLAY any other games, so I don't know how WoWers react to new players asking for help, and I don't really fancy trying WoW because they don't have the one thing I want to play if I'm playing an MMORPG. Until and unless there's another MMORPG with player dragons that does them as well as or better than Istaria, you won't get me on another MMORPG.

You forgot your "[sarcasm]" "[/sarcasm]" tags.

Probably because there was absolutely no sarcasm intended. I genuinely DO want to be able to play a dragon Healer or a dragon Scholar or a dragon Jeweller ... if I could program an MMORPG, it'd have nothing BUT nonhuman characters, all of whom could do a lot more than Istarian dragons can. Heck, if I could finance Istaria (and boy, I wish I had the disposable income to do so) I'd be asking them to introduce more schools to their "flagship" race.

It's a different situation when the character you've chosen to play is deliberately shaped to be different from every other character in the game.

Oddly enough, Caquix and Kesqui (and Malencontri, my ex-hubby's character, and my partner's original Atrinoch) both started playing on Istaria when it was still thought that there might be additional dragon classes added in like they had been in Beta (not just DADV and DCRA - LSH was added years later), that it might be possible to play as a pure crafter or pure adventurer (and ascend to adulthood)... and boy were all three of us shocked (the other two "fatally" as they stopped playing) when the ROP requirements were released.

Two characters is not asking much.

Other than asking me to play a creature I don't like playing, no, it's not asking much at all. I suppose I'm going with the stated policy on that one - "if I don't like the conditions that come with the content, I don't have to play that content." I don't like the conditions that come with being a Cleric or a Confectioner or an Alchemist... so I don't play one very often.

Refer to me second response in this "response tree" (yeah, I still don't know what it's really called). Stop living in the past.

*shrug* That's your choice - not to think about what could have been, not to think about what WAS. I am a player who played in 2003. I am a player who plays in 2009-2010. I remember both, and I remember why I bought the game (three copies of, remember) in the first place.

The issues that plagued Horizons in the past are the reason the game is as it is now. I still can't play with my American friends.... because they stopped playing six years ago, when the game was still so borked that people were offended by the idea of playing a subscription-based Alpha release.

It's far from perfect, and without personal experience of WoW I couldn't tell you whether WoW is bad or better. That said... they have an awful lot more players than Istaria-of-Today has.... the players can't all be insane.

[velveeta]

i dislike wow. i would dislike it even if horizons did not exist.
but i dislike wow because it doesn't suit me.
it's a lovely looking game, and it must be doing something right to be so popular.

i have played wow, and altho it is not for me, i have no prob seeing how it would be a great game for those who like that sort of thing.

in the same way that d&d online, rubies of eventide, ryzom, flyff, or any other game you can name is not my cup of tea, wow is a terrible game to me, but that is because i am a console/pc gamer, not an mmorpg player - now that snake got me a copy of fallout: new vegas, i am not sure how much istaria will see me for the next few days or weeks (altho i need to make a concerted effort to be on, if i am ever to get the industrial complex done)......

if you don't like wow, that's kewl with me, but many peeps here do play both, and i feel they have a valid and most important accurate viewpoint.
so i listen to them with particular attention, even tho nothing i have heard so far is changing my opinion of wow....

altho i wouldn't mind being hit with a mohawk grenade....