Blight Update 241

[Hoberton]

Blight Delta 241 will be applied to the Blight Testing Shard on Monday, May 13th, and includes the following additions, changes, and fixes.

• Tents, Silos and Storehouses have an upper limit of 25 per type on player plots.

Note that structures currently planned on plots are not effected by these changes, and will continue to function properly.

Are you really going to put limits on Silos and such? Crafters need more than 25 Silos and Storehouses. The amount of items that need to be stored for Food production and other craftable items take many Silos and such. I tend to stock the Taverns constantly, others stock connies on New Trismus with disks, armor, tools, etc. Putting a limit on silos would have a drastic effect on the production of these items.

I have no idea why you are even contemplating this change.

[Dracillion]

It's to help the lag! Down with confectioner plots and silo farms! Even if the limitation were by tier, that would still be hosed considering someone capable should be able to build a T6 and not forced down to a T4. You want most bang for your buck, you better settle on a plan now, lol.

[Northwind]

Yep, having empty servers will indeed help with the lag.

[awdz]

Please do not limit the number of silos/storehouses/trees on plots.

[AmonGwareth]

This change does not limit you to say 25 Trees per plot. It limits you to 25 trees of one type. You could still build 25 of each type of tree. Same goes with Silos, Storehouses, decorations, anything. You can still have 25 Tier6 Silos, 25 Tier5 Silos, 25 Tier4 Silos, and so on.

[TheRock]

Amon I really don't understand this change. If you want to limit things, why not start with the resources that are in remote areas of Istaria. Would one crafter in Istaria who has harvested the resources in the far out regions please stand up? Why not remove the trees and other nodes from those areas. I can bet that some of those areas have never been touched by a crafter. I see those resources as a waste and taking up valuable game space. Seriously now!!

[Guaran]

Amon I really don't understand this change. If you want to limit things, why not start with the resources that are in remote areas of Istaria. Would one crafter in Istaria who has harvested the resources in the far out regions please stand up? Why not remove the trees and other nodes from those areas. I can bet that some of those areas have never been touched by a crafter. I see those resources as a waste and taking up valuable game space. Seriously now!!

Don't go deleting more of the game just to keep ugly silo farms. (perhaps you were being sarcastic?)

25 silo limit per tier, you could still have 150 silos on a plot if you really wanted, assuming there is actually room.

Not seeing the big deal.

[Azath]

It may just be me, but i think this change would be nice.
(besides, it would lower the jealousy of people having private silo farms teehee)
also, consider you can have 150 silos and 150 storehouses on a plot, i think that's enough, more than enough. (even if they are spread around teirs - if you've got 150 silos even the t1's will function fine in the web of storage for lots of well, storage) also, 50 tents i didn't count in them figures.
totalling 350 storages, if your plot even has -room- for it all.

[Hoberton]

I use both T4 and T5 silos on my plot, mainly for Confectioner. I also have T5 storehouses on my plots. I use them in this fashion:

Silos are for the basic item:
Raw Chicken, Beef, Gruok, Mutton, Venison
Wheat, Salt, Pepper, Tomatoes, Milk, Eggs, Onions, Potatoes, Sugar, ALL the Berries.
List keeps going but you see what I store in those.

Storehouses are for the sub items: Everything that uses the above basic items.

The amount of each item used to fill the demand on each meals is staggering. I keep as much on hand as I can.

To limit my T4 and T5 storage units will basically stop me from producing what is neccesary for the demand needed on the shard. T1s are not acceptable for the amounts I need to store. I would like to build all T6 silos and storehouses but the T5 and T4 are easier.

I am sure you will get similar responses from the other crafters.

Don't go deleting more of the game just to keep ugly silo farms.

It may just be me, but i think this change would be nice.
(besides, it would lower the jealousy of people having private silo farms teehee)
also, consider you can have 150 silos and 150 storehouses on a plot, i think that's enough, more than enough. (even if they are spread around teirs - if you've got 150 silos even the t1's will function fine in the web of storage for lots of well, storage) also, 50 tents i didn't count in them figures.
totalling 350 storages, if your plot even has -room- for it all.

Guaran and Azath, you are probably not serious crafters or have any idea what it takes to be one. Silo Farms are not ugly.

[Dracillion]

What is the difference, for example, of someone loading up solely T6's on their 80x80 vs splitting T6 and T4, maybe T2 as opposed to all T6? It would interesting metrics. Is bulk really a lag monster? As old as the game is, and with the hardware issues as there have been within the past six months, I'm just not seeing it.

[Calyndrell]

I use both T4 and T5 silos on my plot, mainly for Confectioner. I also have T5 storehouses on my plots. I use them in this fashion:

Silos are for the basic item:
Raw Chicken, Beef, Gruok, Mutton, Venison
Wheat, Salt, Pepper, Tomatoes, Milk, Eggs, Onions, Potatoes, Sugar, ALL the Berries.
List keeps going but you see what I store in those.

Storehouses are for the sub items: Everything that uses the above basic items.

The amount of each item used to fill the demand on each meals is staggering. I keep as much on hand as I can.

To limit my T4 and T5 storage units will basically stop me from producing what is neccesary for the demand needed on the shard. T1s are not acceptable for the amounts I need to store. I would like to build all T6 silos and storehouses but the T5 and T4 are easier.

I am sure you will get similar responses from the other crafters.




Guaran and Azath, you are probably not serious crafters or have any idea what it takes to be one. Silo Farms are not ugly.

Firstly I fail to see what your concerned about hob. They haven't said pre-existing plots will have to lower their silo limit to the new restriction. So your plot is safe.

Secondly if you were as serious a crafter as you make out you'd go to the effort of building tier 6 silos and be damned with the effort.

Thirdly silo farms are not aesthetically please to say the least.

[Guaran]

Guaran and Azath, you are probably not serious crafters or have any idea what it takes to be one. Silo Farms are not ugly.

Do not assume you know who or what I am.

Firstly I fail to see what your concerned about hob. They haven't said pre-existing plots will have to lower their silo limit to the new restriction. So your plot is safe.

Secondly if you were as serious a crafter as you make out you'd go to the effort of building tier 6 silos and be damned with the effort.

Thirdly silo farms are not aesthetically please to say the least.

/signed

[Azath]

Guaran and Azath, you are probably not serious crafters or have any idea what it takes to be one.

You're right in some respects..however; i do not have a biped nor do i know what it takes to be a good biped crafter. But, my dragon is coming up to be exceptional with craft. If it wasn't for the lack of biped experience with craft, and lack of plot space, i might know more. But i know my dragon only really needs a stock of 12 things (for what i craft often). therefore i could have 25+ silos per item (well; 25 as sort of a middle line - more silos on low teirs, less silos of high teirs) and still get the same amout of storage, and alot of it too - if my plot could fit that many that is.
As for biepds, i have no clue abouts the storage they need...but i get an idea it would be alot.
though of the way i'll be raising my ped, i'll be focusing one one or two schools to keep mats for constantly (so to keep itself and alts in stock and guildies). Because of how fun it can be; this is likely to be alchemist and scholar. Which means i'd need a store of 46 (not counting t6 and counting primary ingredients) different things...*does some calculations* Ah, yes, i see the problem now. I suppose from that point of veiw it is very very troublesome

[Hoberton]

Firstly I fail to see what your concerned about hob.

The concern is new players finally getting to the level of crafter I am at and buying a plot. Those players will be limited and find they will not be able to do what seasoned players are capable of doing.

Look beyond the here and now and to the future of these new players.

[Sindala]

I have to chime in here for a minute.
I am a Confectioner and I see no problem with this change (we use storehouses AND silos) 25 of each is plenty.
If you can fill 25xT6 storage silos and normal T6 silos (not to mention any other tier) and still need more, you need to start playing with others. This is an MMO not a solo RPG.

The only place I could see this is yes, the Silo farms!. Which in my opinion were the downfall to community crafting anyway.
Why ask the community if you can just raid your own overstocked silos?

We have in this game a thing called Guilds....Join one and share the load.
Greedy 1 man guild plots are another that may be affected.....but so what!
Get some people to join your guild and use another of the plots on the guildplot.

Which brings me to my last remark.....If it bothers you that much that you can only have 25xT6 silos on a single plot......BUY ANOTHER SUBSCRIPTION, get another plot and actually help the game rather than trying to turn it into WoW.

ps, did somebody really just call Guaran NOT a serious crafter??? Lol, I almost spat my coffee over the screen on reading that

[Aaelefein]

Seems this silo limit thing is bringing up LOTS of old issues...accessibility, lag, the so-called silo farms, etcetera, and of course stack...

Many crafters, I number among them, want to be able to make things, whether it is for self, guild, or others, at a moments notice without having to spend the time to go all over the place to make a single item or two. Not including tinkering, confectioner, alchemist or lair shaping which are by far the worst...other simple things you've got Wood x6; Stone x6 (Double for spell shards); Metal x9; Leather x6; Essence x6; fabric x6 and gems x18 - that's 57 silos right there if one wants to keep in-stock the stuff needed to make weapons, armor, spells and jewelry. Add in tinkering, alchemy which practically triples most things (metal powers, 2 additional types of essence, gem powders), and confectioner...well that's a couple dozen storehouses at minimum.

So...people don't like silo farms...a known issue for years in this game and how many times have people requested something different? Probably too numerous to mention. When I returned I saw the barn and thought hey, great...then I learned how very limited it was and how very little it held vs. footprint.

What is harder on the system...multiple single-stack silos or fewer multi-stack silos? From everything I've read over the years, bulk isn't the issue when it comes to lag. If the answer to the above question is they are equal...then maybe other things should be looked at for streamlining the system (if this is even possible).

My opinion, except for leveling or building large projects (thinking T6 here), to keep in-stock stuff one doesn't need massive bulk. So give me some resource specific warehouses that at say T1(or 2) are 6-stack and 48,000 bulk - enough to hold 1000 of each resource type (wood, metal, stone, etcetera) - and upper tiers only add bulk. Now you've got 1 structure vs. 6. Perhaps more specialized ones for gems (15-stack, 18,000 bulk - or about 200 of each gem t1-5, holds cut or powered), Alchemical Essence (orbs or can't recall the alchemical version), Precious Metal Vault (Silver, Gold, Platinum) - but I think you see where I am going here, and my proposed numbers are just an idea, a starting point to get the idea across - but shouldn't be so low that making say a full set of armor (metal, cloth or leather) - used up the entire stack of the resource.

There are several options available before just arbitrarily deciding to impose a limit without regard to the effect it has on the current game play style without anything to fix or alleviate the situation. Make those new structures and you could seriously limit the number of silos even more.

I had more thoughts as I started this, but kind of forgot them as I thought out the above idea and of course my habit of rambling...so I'll cut it off here.

Aaelefein

[Northwind]

This is just sad.

I only see envy and jealousy - you cannot/don't want/what not/ own a silo farm so they are suddenly ugly and useless and denote selfishness and one man guild mentality.
Seriously??? Do you really hear yourselves? The owners do fill the silos on their own, then they make stuff that fill the consigners or they can fulfill your random order in a minute by picking resources from a silo farm instead of sending you to gather them personally.

You don't like the silo farms? Then don't look. It's a really big world - you are not forced to lurk around a silo farm.
Not to mention that "like" is a really ******** personal thing. I don't see the ugliness in silo farms. Not at all. While I do sense some beauty in their utility.

And it's not the number of silos that create the lag, but the number of general buildings and bad engine / client that are lagging the game.
How about we flat out Feladan and Tazoon? There i get the most laggy experience OR in the most populated communities like Morning Light and Lerena - with their marvelous grand plots with a ton of buildings and complete flooring - and not because some random plot has 100 t4 silos on it.

PS. There is a reason for building only t4/t5/t6 silos. It is called efficiency.

PS2. Yes, the change will not affect Hob (or anyone else who already has a so called silo farm), unless he wants a change in scenery that will involve dismantling and rebuilding in some other spot. Like many already did when ML and Lerena and Selen were opened up with nice and large plots.

[TheRock]

Don't go deleting more of the game just to keep ugly silo farms. (perhaps you were being sarcastic?)

25 silo limit per tier, you could still have 150 silos on a plot if you really wanted, assuming there is actually room.

Not seeing the big deal.

Your opinion of players who have many silos for their (guild) plot is wrong. Call them what you want but they are very useful. And to add to that guild members worked hard to have this available. Count the player plots in istaria and tell me then if we are actually creating lag for this game. The paying players are dropping like flies because of things like this. We are scrambling to build structures to assist the low population here now. Some dragon players don't really care about this change until the bipeds close the public silos on them... it will be too later then. If you don't have a biped character with a plot and plans to lvl many craft classes, you don't really understand what this change will do. I am just tired of changes that are geared around limiting players and hoping some of us will buy extra subs. It wouldn't hurt for some to read the 'goodbye' threads and see the 'hand writing on the wall'.

[Arzel Rashemi]

This is just sad.

I only see envy and jealousy - you cannot/don't want/what not/ own a silo farm so they are suddenly ugly and useless and denote selfishness and one man guild mentality.
Seriously??? Do you really hear yourselves? The owners do fill the silos on their own, then they make stuff that fill the consigners or they can fulfill your random order in a minute by picking resources from a silo farm instead of sending you to gather them personally.

You don't like the silo farms? Then don't look. It's a really big world - you are not forced to lurk around a silo farm.
Not to mention that "like" is a really ******** personal thing. I don't see the ugliness in silo farms. Not at all. While I do sense some beauty in their utility.

I could say the same for the trees and other decorational items North. Do the people on this thread defending there right to silo farms hear themselves too?? I've noticed one thing in this thread and the other about limitations on plot items. Only two people between both threads have vocally stood up for those players who like to build their plots for aesthetics qualities with decorations, trees, and fluff rather than crafting optmizational qualities with silos and storehouses. (Neither way of building is wrong.) It wasn't until the proposed changes affected their own game and interests that they spoke up, and all of a sudden there is a hullabaloo about it. So yes, very selfish indeed.

Frankly, I don't find a big deal in the limitations set down. I think its quite balanced with the limitations as it is in line with the rest of the plot items that are being limited. I'd rather nothing was limited at all so we are all happy, but that isn't going to happen. So the choices are:

-buy another plot for more storage
-do some more gathering than usual to make the items
-prioritize your crafting by storing only the sub items that you need most or are hardest to make/get.

At least those who really love their silos and are into building for optimization of crafting have that option of buying another sub to make up for what they are losing, where as those players who find their enjoyment playing and building for purely aesthetics can't even get that. A player who likes that sort of thing can't put the trees they want down or like best because of the limitations and they can't just buy another sub to fix that problem on the plot they are working on.

So go figure, with all of the changes to the silos and storehouses we might have to actually start working as a community again and rely on more than just one person or ourselves alone to provide a service or item to everyone else. It also opens it up for the newbies to have the chance to make themselves useful to the community as a whole too and find a niche with in it for crafting. And that's probably the most unselfish thing about this.

[Steelclaw]

Wow. I'm a little surprised at the direction this thread took. Sure, I expected to see some backlash about the limits the moment I saw them in the patch notes, but I was not expecting what appear to be passive-agressive personal attacks. I can see that this is a sensitive issue, but please, focus your criticism and praise on the structure limits, not the people commenting on them. It's a thin line, but when your post makes implications about demeaning the worth of another player, you've crossed that line.


As for getting on topic, some useful criticism and work toward alternatives will be helpful. How does this change impact the way you play? What kind of alternatives could reduce that impact while maintaining the goal of the change? (i.e. keeping the number of plot structures to some restricted limit) Aaelefein is on a good track and asks some helpful questions. That post is a good place to pick things up.