hoard sink

[LOVWYRM]

inflation is really a prob of Istaria.
Not only that there is too much gold ingame-and too few to buy for-
its even worse with hoard:

Yesterday- we found out that on our 3 plots/1 lair-there is no room left to store hoard items.
We have 6 dragons- all fed up and fat-
and I really dislike the idea to have 1000000trillons of hoard on my char.
But noone wants or needs-and- even if- giving it away like nothing-its not what the game means it to be.
(though we do whenever there is a dragon who does not look overweight^^).

We really thought about-but only 1 idea remained:

Like the npc on the bridge od Isle of Fire/Ice
let there be npc allover the world (or start with 1 or 2)
that give a) buffs that are useful in this special area
or b) buffs only this npc`s can offer
all paid with hoard no matter if bipeds or dragons.
And make it expensive/ all tiers/ and worth price and effort (maybe hide npc`s )

What do you think?
Any other ideas most welcome

[Dracillion]

Yeah something definitely needs to be done. At the rates Doom hoard is going for, this will definitely inflate prices probably to a point where some things may possibly be out of reach for a brand new player.

Granted, there is hardly an economy and most people just perform services as is, there is still the factor of how to gauge comps and the like, of which if there is more gold floating around, it will take that much more effort for a new player to achieve.

[Calyndrell]

Although I primarily play a biped I have to admit I personally believe that hoard has pretty much lost its purpose. It's so easy to come by in the upper tiers that it's not even funny. I would love the idea of a buff that can be bought from npc even if the only thing it improved speed/fly speed. However I would say since we can now sell hoard rather than be powered byl hoard have it be a money sink. This may help avoid exaggerated inflation.

My suggestions for these buffs would bee as follows.
Each buff lasts 30 mins and do not conflict with ANY current buff.

WARDS. Cost increasing
tier 1 = 1 silver 25 resist/ward element of choice may have multiple different WARDS
tier 2 = 10 silver 50 resist/ward
Tier 3 = 50 silver 75 resist/ward
tier 4 = 100 silver 100 resist/ward
Tier 5 = 150 silver 125 resist/ward

STATS
costs same as WARDS however Dex conflicts with focus and power conflicts with str...so yes we have to pick.. speed works on the same tier buff level as swiftfeet only lasting longer.

I hope this makes sense.

[Terao]

Hoard should be worth something as the descriptions and names of these items show off. I would love to be able to use it as a alternate payment option for buying tech resources from Nadja, or trade against Nature Tokens, Imperial Tokens or something of this kind. The buff idea from Calyndrell would be a nice option too, there are even ancient items you can use for this, you don't even have to involve new ones, for example the old Saja's Potions: Elixir of Saris Spirit (gives +50 Dex, +50 Evasion for 30 min.) and/or Saja's Puisant Elixir (+50 Blight Ward, -10% Delay for 30 min.). If you take some time to think on it I'm sure there are a lot of more ideas to use hoard items for and doesn't take too much time to develop.

[Arzel Rashemi]

I can not agree with half the ideas on here because I think we have enough gold and hoard sinks in game that don't work, like the techatron and formulatron. I find an easy fix to this issue. Put in hoard leak again. It was one of the reasons for the introduction of hoard items in the first place. And for gold, increase the prices of techs and formulas from all quartermasters and trainers.

[Guaran]

Although I primarily play a biped I have to admit I personally believe that hoard has pretty much lost its purpose. It's so easy to come by in the upper tiers that it's not even funny...

I don't believe hoard has lost it's purpose.

Just because players who have been around for years have plenty of hoard, new players do not. It will still take some work to get a decent hoard level, which is millions beyond 25,333,000 hoard which grants the full armor bonus of 480 armor, once a player is level 100. You will never want hoard to drop below this, so another 20 million or so for spending is good. And the level 120 hoard level would be 61,900,000. Just in case we ever got a level raise (wishful thinking I know). Players forget to use Shield of Gold which can chew through a lot of hoard, but is really helpful in tough fights.

On top of all that, hoard can be pawned now.

I would love the idea of a buff that can be bought from npc even if the only thing it improved speed/fly speed. However I would say since we can now sell hoard rather than be powered byl hoard have it be a money sink. This may help avoid exaggerated inflation.

My suggestions for these buffs would be as follows.
Each buff lasts 30 mins and do not conflict with ANY current buff...

I like the idea of an NPC which "sells" buffs that are perhaps somewhat unique, and do not conflict with anything.

Instead of charging hoard, just let the npc charge coin. If you want to pawn your hoard for coin, then spend the coin on the buffs, that effectively covers the original idea.

Examples of some buffs the npc could sell, would be
+200 evasion for 2 hours, cost 100s.
+200 magic evasion for 2 hours, cost 100s.
Magic Affinity (+15% chance for a guaranteed hit for spells) 25s.
Eye of the Sword (+15% chance for a guaranteed hit for melee attacks including ranged) 25s.
If the npc couldn't be made to target the player and cast the buff, then make it a vendor, and the buffs in the form of attuned potions. Be certain they conflict with nothing.

These buffs would be for anyone, not just dragons.

[pevil2000]

I don't have an excess of hoard, in fact I'm way below my actual level for hoard so I'll be your sink!

On a more serious note perhaps something to do with crafting? It's shiny and valuable so why wouldn't crafting dragons use it too? Perhaps as a required component for certain sought after techs (any hoard item of value x or above would do, rather than it has to be a priceless earring for example), or it could be that if you choose to add in hoard as an optional component there is a very small chance (say 5%) to gain an additional effect? Nothing overpowering but it could be a way to get some of the blighted effects onto player crafted items.

Or use it in lairshaping as part of a third design set. We already have Helian and Lunus versions of everything, could be nice to have a faction neutral "shiny" version of everything, more of a sparkly diamond effect in everything. In theory it should just be a recolour of the existing sets so nothing too taxing for the devs (I'd hope).

[Arzel Rashemi]

Or use it in lairshaping as part of a third design set. We already have Helian and Lunus versions of everything, could be nice to have a faction neutral "shiny" version of everything, more of a sparkly diamond effect in everything. In theory it should just be a recolour of the existing sets so nothing too taxing for the devs (I'd hope).

I love that idea. I was always thinking we could use it as part of a special ingredient for a hoard room in the lairs. How much you would have to use depends on the tier hoard room you would want to build. Greater Tiers having more visible hoard and treasure in them since you've put more hoard into them. We already do special items in our murals in the form of the Queens hair and patterns. Don't see how hard it would be to do this with hoard items.

[Calyndrell]

Chuckles I can see it now "******** it I need just one more barasavian breastplate.... I already have the other99.. this is taking forever"....

Dragon liars are already ebil.

[Guaran]

I don't have an excess of hoard, in fact I'm way below my actual level for hoard so I'll be your sink!

On a more serious note perhaps something to do with crafting? It's shiny and valuable so why wouldn't crafting dragons use it too? Perhaps as a required component for certain sought after techs (any hoard item of value x or above would do, rather than it has to be a priceless earring for example), or it could be that if you choose to add in hoard as an optional component there is a very small chance (say 5%) to gain an additional effect? Nothing overpowering but it could be a way to get some of the blighted effects onto player crafted items.

Using hoard as a comp in a lair mural sounds like an easy idea. Some interesting mural related to the item being required. Like the Dwarven Magical Relics collection, could be a comp in a dwarven magics styled mural. Maybe a mural of the special hammer that's referenced in some of the doom quests.

As far as a "Hoard room" which I think is a great idea... perhaps this could be implemented as just a mural? So it "looks" like you are seeing into a room, but it is overflowing with hoard so you cannot actually enter it. And all it really is is just a picture. Easy hoard room, and could have nothing but some hoard pieces used to build it.

Or use it in lairshaping as part of a third design set. We already have Helian and Lunus versions of everything, could be nice to have a faction neutral "shiny" version of everything, more of a sparkly diamond effect in everything. In theory it should just be a recolour of the existing sets so nothing too taxing for the devs (I'd hope).

Nice idea's. I like the idea of the faction neutral room. I chose Helian rooms for everything because the Lunus ones were too dark. And a brighter, diamond style room sounds like a nice option.

[Alisto]

Hoard is sell-able to pawnbrokers, last I checked.

You can get a random tech/form from the trons in Dali and New Rachival, though I just tried it and 500silver for something I'd have a better time just hunting for is....*bleh*. Fix the ones we have before asking for something new.

I don't know about anyone else, but I'd definitely vendor all my hoard and spend all the coin at the tron thingies if there was a chance - even a horribly small chance - for the lost dragon techs to drop, or Thundercloud V, Dismissal, some old crystals/weapons (Ex: The Zealot) or...I'm sure I've forgotten something, but still. Even if it was only a fraction of a percent of a chance to get something rare, hoard I got would quickly become coin and all that coin would quickly disappear into that machine.

[Dracillion]

Hoard is sell-able to pawnbrokers, last I checked.

You can get a random tech/form from the trons in Dali and New Rachival, though I just tried it and 500silver for something I'd have a better time just hunting for is....*bleh*. Fix the ones we have before asking for something new.

I don't know about anyone else, but I'd definitely vendor all my hoard and spend all the coin at the tron thingies if there was a chance - even a horribly small chance - for the lost dragon techs to drop, or Thundercloud V, Dismissal, some old crystals/weapons (Ex: The Zealot) or...I'm sure I've forgotten something, but still. Even if it was only a fraction of a percent of a chance to get something rare, hoard I got would quickly become coin and all that coin would quickly disappear into that machine.

That is good.

I had thought those gamblers were disabled. Will check out tonight.

[AmonGwareth]

Finding more use for hoard is certainly a valid goal, though it would not be as easy as you might think to find a good use for it. Ideally you would use it more during regular adventuring (for example, if most abilities consumed significant amounts of it). However, that isn't how the game is setup and isn't something we're going to do so that is out. Giving alternative ways of spending it is a good idea, though things that must be kept in mind are that a) you should not actively cut out the possibility of encouraging player-to-player interaction (i.e. by creating Wards that can be acquired via NPCs instead of through players) or b) by re-introducing items that may be unbalanced, are most likely not valid at all tiers, etc.

So, contrary to what you might think there would need to be design work, planning, and implementation and it would require some thought so that the feature was balanced and available to all tiers of Dragon.

[Alisto]

Go to the bottom of the post if you don't want to read my ramblings >.> I sort of got carried away *flail*

Found another thread concerning the bloat of coin in the game (I know this is a thread specifically for hoard, but wanted to just stuff everything in one place >.> Apologies if it would've been better to have a separate thread for coin-bloat and hoard-bloat)

I found this...

We've got adventure and crafting trainers, right? Why don't we spend coins to the trainer and get some training (xp)?

In another thread, and respond with -
Going under the assumption 'useless coins' is = silver, copper, gold etc...

I would say it's a bad idea.

1) Too much coin in the game, and to make the feature 'balanced' the coin:exp ratio would have to be decently high on the coin side, so high that I don't think people who don't spend all their time hunting for money and such would be able to use the feature all that well. It'd certainly take some money out of the 'economy', though.
2) Paying for adventure/craft exp...? I don't see it. How do I gain experience in a crafting or adventure school simply by paying someone? Though this is a 'it doesn't make sense' thing and that could be solved by saying that you could pay for 'lessons', etc.
3) Personally, coin for raw exp just seems /wrong/ - far too quick and easy, could be easily abused as well
- Newbie asks for some coin to 'buy some tech forms they need' - coin ends up being spent on levels. Perhaps I'm just jaded >.>

And in an indirect way, we already have coin - > exp. Just pay someone to hunt some trophies for you.

If it's a "we need more ways to take money out of the 'economy'" thing, then I think the best route to be would be vanity things. I'd love to be able to draw a pattern on my armored scales and would pay a couple gold for it (on the icon of the scale, anyway) or even millions of hoard.
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As for the 'build hoard into lairshaping somehow' thing - I don't like the mural idea. If hoard is going into building my lair, I want to be able to sit on the hoard and look dignified - being able to only look at something my precious hoard went into is less than attractive. I would simply hoard pieces instead of building a mural like that.


On another note, I really like the idea of a hoard room. Off the top of my head, a t6 one could take -
-1000 Antiquated Breastplates
-1000 Ornamental Breastplates
-500 imperial crowns
-250 imperial scepters
-250 priceless mirrors
-1000 imperial urns
-1000 imperial coffers
For one room, or perhaps one room could require 'x' of one piece of hoard, and it would display a lot of that single piece. Multiple rooms to build, each one displays a difference piece.

And then a a small bunch of LSH resources so the hoard doesn't fall through the floor.
*these numbers come from my own experiences on how long it takes to get a certain number of items that can be hoarded. It takes me a day or so of hunting to get a hundred or so of the cheap stuff (chestplates), while I only end up with maybe 20 priceless mirrors. Getting the suggested amount would take a good amount of time.



Or something along those lines, and when completed, there would be (among other things) a giant mount of hoardstuffs in the middle of the room on which a dragon could plant its rump.
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could be that if you choose to add in hoard as an optional component there is a very small chance (say 5%) to gain an additional effect? Nothing overpowering but it could be a way to get some of the blighted effects onto player crafted items.

Yes please! Perhaps hoard + blighted item = chance to get the blighted effect onto an item that doesn't decay, and more hoard + even more blighted items (or cores?) = a higher chance.
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Here's all my thoughts on the matter - except condensed
Money for exp = No. Too easily abused, doesn't make much sense, too easy to use.
Murals requiring hoard = I'd rather be able to sit on something hoard is required to build. A hoard room that I can go into sounds quite nice.
Hoard as a required component for some techs = Yes! \o/ Involving blighted items sounds nice too.

Sorry for the wall of text! /o/

Edits because my organization is terrible.