Talk to the Team: Dragon Schools: New Schools

[Amerelium]

It seems to me this new thing is to make dragons more like the way most dragons wanted them tyo be in the first place, which is good I suppose.

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As I also understand it, the problem is how to implement this with already existing dragons, and I have seen one of the options here is to basically have everyone create new ones, which is something of an issue.

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If it would come to that, could there not some way of 'resetting' characters, give them all the XP points, skill points, etc, so they could just redistribute them?

[Caillie]

I was around when Istaria was Horizons and I was in the beta testing, I remember there being different dragon classes there, like dragon healer, dragon mage. I loved how it was going that route at the time, but understood it might not have been properly balanced or ready for it, so I am very much in support of having new schools to specialize our characters some more, it would add not only to the combat, but also add to the roleplay aspect in different ways for those on the RP server, seeing lots of benefits here with it.

The implementation of it I do agree should be handled carefully, as a majority would likely mind going back to square one to try out new content. So there should be a way for max level dragons to reclass into the new content when new content comes out. Give existing players a free reclass initially, if they don't like it, maybe set up a 5 dollar pay to reclass again thing, would help The company a bit because I know personally if I change my mind on my dragon's class i would pay that to change it later.

Anyways just my suggestions/ideas to add to the current discussion.

[Alisto]

5 dollar pay to reclass again thing

I personally prefer the current 'respec' way. Well...not much to actually respec beyond training points, but still. We already pay to have a dragon, for more character slots, for a plot. I don't think we should have to pay for a respec as well.

@Amon's suggestions.

*ahem* Disregarding my squeeing over the presence of gold burst in there...Looks good, except for Warrior getting Breath of Flame Burst and not the Casters. Insofar as I know, breaths in general are primarily caster territory.

In the interest of balance between the two, it'd make more sense (to me at least) to give the flat out strong damaging breaths to caster, and more utility to melee. They would both have the same breaths, but they could just do different things? Casters bofb could be as it is now, while melee would be quite a bit more damage than the current normal breath of fire does now (maybe double it to do 400-500 damage), but it would also...say, increase the damage of their next melee attack against that one target by some such percent, or any attack against that target now has a 5% chance to proc some effect.

Not saying that melee shouldn't end up with a decent aoe, but hnnnng my casters would really miss Breath of Flame Burst.

Damage Shield (vs Magic) NEW

Some questions about this - does vs magic mean it would effect any magic damage, even a..say, melee/physical attack that had the Fire Attack V Buff? If not, I think it should at least be somewhat effective against melee/physical attacks. Even though a caster will have better Ethereal armor, I've found ethereal damage isn't really present enough in the game for that to be useful. Maybe against some blighted mobs and Valkor, but I can go months without going near a mob that deals ethereal damage.

Damage Shield (vs Melee) (Spiked)

Same thing here, should be somewhat effective against spells I think. Also, the "(Spiked)" part - does this mean casters will lose spiked scales?

Could also add a different effect to each of them. Hitting the melee's damage shield in melee range could deal spiked scales damage, but one wouldn't take spiked scales damage from hitting them at a range. Hitting the caster's damage shield with a spell could result in a reflect, but no reflect if hitting them with melee damage.

Enrage (More Strength) (Hoard) NEW
Enhance Will (More Power) (Hoard) NEW (Hardened Will)

As for these - going off the current Allowance of Power buff that was recently implemented, I would rarely use such abilities if they just gave raw stats. My caster - at 2100ish power, 200 extra power does very little for her, and would probably be the same situation for my strength dragon if they had an ability like that. Why not give it an effect instead. Would it be possible to give a +dps based on how much of a stat the character has? Say, +1dps to melee skills per 500 strength(or tooth and claw?) for melee, per power(or primal) for casters and their spells. This would encourage casters to get caster stats, and melees to get melee stats, while still being somewhat useful for the hybrid.

[lightning claw]

Amon I have some ideas for this but i missed the main thread and its now locked this has renewed my hope for Istaria and would like to make suggestions would you like them hear or in a pm ?

[AmonGwareth]

Amon I have some ideas for this but i missed the main thread and its now locked this has renewed my hope for Istaria and would like to make suggestions would you like them hear or in a pm ?

There's a thread here for each of the options. Please post them for everyone to see.

[lightning claw]

As some of you all know I love dragons and studied there lore. My ideas closely match Amons with a few key differences.

First I'm not too much of a fan of the taking a Hachie all the way to 100 then having to do it again for an adult and again for an ancient . While this greatly prolongs the life of dragon players It might drive off some new blood to the game something from my short time back monitoring the forms is desperately needed.

I'm reminded of an old Japaneses saying

"if qualities of heaven are your desire
acquire wisdom and knowledge to take your mind higher
if earthy qualities are what you lack
then train your body and prepare to attack
when heaven and earth are open together
the path of peril path will be righteous forever"

I have always seen the dragons in Istaria in 2 ways that follow both Istarian lore and dragon lore altogether

Lunus = Earthly quality's strength Epion's fighting style is that of earth brutal fierce and lacking elegance but it gets the job done . I made him to be a "Master tank" with a side of one hell of damage dealing . My spell book is limited. The only reason I put any training points in primal is for Primal boon for the elusive Reclar hunt

Heilan = Heavenly quality s or Mind/Primal/Arcane.
This side of dragons was never really thought throw all the way and while a great deal of dragons i know would love to use magic to fight are forced to using the powerful multi strike attacks .

Hears my Idea

Bring back Lost Knowledge , In order to obtain players must start new chars. I love that idea! For once that will put the flame war to bed "The only reason why your so bad a-- is because you have epic weapons that no one can get anymore "

Upon completing your rights of passage Lunus 50/40 or heilian at 60/50 several "quest " shale be available from your faction leader. To Prove your worth . Of learning to be one with the elements .

This will ultimately finally balance the power of gold rage at Gold Rage cap at 3

Lunus multi class Concepts

Earth dragon ( this will allow the player to continue down gold rage and silver strike to be Damage dealers . Earth dragons will also be able to use limited nature ability's such as damage shields and enhanced Malay Attacks ( Please note gold rage will be caped at gold rage 3 to continue gold rage line you must become a Lunus damage dealer.

Wind ( this is a big part in dragon lore but im not too sure how to fit this class in yet it should be sub Prestige school for storm dragons )

Storm Dragon ( In dragon loar this is also known as a regal or King class of the dragons ) often summoning massive thunder storms and dealing massive area damage they tend to never be in the thick of things for too long and prefer mid range to long range combat elements used are water and energy

Fire class don't really need to go in to the back story you basically set fire to every thing. Special ability's are entombing our body with your breath similar to spiked scales very proficient at flame with some good pulling flame spells and new Malay attacks Like Inferno flaming charge flame wing burning wind ect with 2 or three self heals solid close range combat and

Helian concepts
Spirit class ( healer and Ethereal damage dealers ) wide range of spells and heals

Water class (sub prestige class ) specializes in mid range combat with water/ ice ability's such as Tidal Force Spell (aro multi hit ) the lower the level of this spell the more damage it dose to you gives resistances and stuns foes with most of there attacks

Ice ( ancient prestige school) to be an ice dragon you need to be devote to the teachings of Heilina obtaining 100 in adult school competing quests for her along the way and also joining the water class and taking that to 100 as well Ice dragons have found how to freeze there talons and focuses there hoard to bring icy death to there foes All ice magic can be used 5 or 6 new spells for Icd (Ice dragon class) as well as 5 attacks and one HOT ( Heal over time ) close range combat types can be made to be mid range

Forest class : similar to dru line in using spells like DC and regrowth ect this dragons are close range combat that ensnare there enemies with trees and plants and poison them till death

Basically im giving more depth too the factions making them have some type of meaning and defined roles in the game

Im agreeing with you that dragons should not be like bipeds . Thus I have thought of 8 schools 4 per faction . hears the kicker 2 of the schools are (Dead ends ) Powerful in there own rights but will stop at 100 1 Sub school which leads to Prestige school. Having players think about the end game and what they want to be other then I want to fly as a dragon race throw there rights and quit .

also special dragon scale sets will be made for each class see the arop head scale maker they will be called "Scales of the first "


My I have other ideas and Im in game programing so I know what a pain this might turn in too but you opened up the can and with dragon crystal shape school working you demonstrated adding schools are with in Istarias Current Capability

Ps Amon if you take this type of idea into consideration I want you to be nothing more then Absolute Evil in making dragons change schools quest that require groups and team work and crafting Oh my.

[Calyndrell]

I love it all but... not this bit... seriously you go ahead with that and your alienating your loyal veteran dragon player.. yes some will like it but i think the vast majority won't.

Bring back Lost Knowledge , In order to obtain players must start new chars. I love that idea! For once that will put the flame war to bed "The only reason why your so bad a-- is because you have epic weapons that no one can get anymore "

[Machaeon]

Use this thread to discuss new dragon schools (replacing the existing one).

(Emphasis added to make my point)

Notice that the new schools will be replacing the old one so 'retiring' our characters is out of the question both IMO and with the dev's intentions. Give us new schools to branch out with along with a school to replace the current one and I'll be more than happy. Adding more classes to dragons could definitely bring new players in and even bring old players back to check them out. I fully support Amon's suggestions for the schools he described and I look forward to seeing them come to Blight and later to Order and Chaos.

Bring back Lost Knowledge , In order to obtain players must start new chars. I love that idea! For once that will put the flame war to bed "The only reason why your so bad a-- is because you have epic weapons that no one can get anymore "

Yes! Bring back the lost knowledge! I'd trade my wings to get the old techniques like Primal Vengeance and Eminence back ingame. But it would be a dealbreaker for me to have to make a new character just to get the new content... I'd have wasted 100% of my previous time getting my main to 100 in every currently available school just to have to do it again with a brand new hatchie.

First I'm not too much of a fan of the taking a Hachie all the way to 100 then having to do it again for an adult and again for an ancient . While this greatly prolongs the life of dragon players It might drive off some new blood to the game something from my short time back monitoring the forms is desperately needed.

As far as I can see that's not what's being suggested, the 'Juvenile' school isn't necessarily a hatchie school and the other two schools would be what we can branch out to not depending on faction but on what we choose to do so we could eventually have all 3 schools to 100.

I have always seen the dragons in Istaria in 2 ways that follow both Istarian lore and dragon lore altogether

Lunus = Earthly quality's strength Epion's fighting style is that of earth brutal fierce and lacking elegance but it gets the job done . I made him to be a "Master tank" with a side of one hell of damage dealing . My spell book is limited. The only reason I put any training points in primal is for Primal boon for the elusive Reclar hunt

Heilan = Heavenly quality s or Mind/Primal/Arcane.
This side of dragons was never really thought throw all the way and while a great deal of dragons i know would love to use magic to fight are forced to using the powerful multi strike attacks .

Hears my Idea [...]

Upon completing your rights of passage Lunus 50/40 or heilian at 60/50 several "quest " shale be available from your faction leader. To Prove your worth . Of learning to be one with the elements .

This will ultimately finally balance the power of gold rage at Gold Rage cap at 3

Lunus multi class Concepts

Earth dragon ( this will allow the player to continue down gold rage and silver strike to be Damage dealers . Earth dragons will also be able to use limited nature ability's such as damage shields and enhanced Malay Attacks ( Please note gold rage will be caped at gold rage 3 to continue gold rage line you must become a Lunus damage dealer.

Wind ( this is a big part in dragon lore but im not too sure how to fit this class in yet it should be sub Prestige school for storm dragons )

Storm Dragon ( In dragon loar this is also known as a regal or King class of the dragons ) often summoning massive thunder storms and dealing massive area damage they tend to never be in the thick of things for too long and prefer mid range to long range combat elements used are water and energy

Fire class don't really need to go in to the back story you basically set fire to every thing. Special ability's are entombing our body with your breath similar to spiked scales very proficient at flame with some good pulling flame spells and new Malay attacks Like Inferno flaming charge flame wing burning wind ect with 2 or three self heals solid close range combat and

Helian concepts
Spirit class ( healer and Ethereal damage dealers ) wide range of spells and heals

Water class (sub prestige class ) specializes in mid range combat with water/ ice ability's such as Tidal Force Spell (aro multi hit ) the lower the level of this spell the more damage it dose to you gives resistances and stuns foes with most of there attacks

Ice ( ancient prestige school) to be an ice dragon you need to be devote to the teachings of Heilina obtaining 100 in adult school competing quests for her along the way and also joining the water class and taking that to 100 as well Ice dragons have found how to freeze there talons and focuses there hoard to bring icy death to there foes All ice magic can be used 5 or 6 new spells for Icd (Ice dragon class) as well as 5 attacks and one HOT ( Heal over time ) close range combat types can be made to be mid range

Forest class : similar to dru line in using spells like DC and regrowth ect this dragons are close range combat that ensnare there enemies with trees and plants and poison them till death

No, absolutely no. I do not support this, it makes dragon classes too similar to biped classes primal magic is what dragons deal with and only bipeds have split the primal magic into elemental magic so it would go against current lore not to mention needlessly complicate things for the devs and us, and put an unnecessary division between the factions: Why should a Lunus have access to something a Helian doesn't and vice versa?

[Spyrioyo]

I feel that making people having to restart is a very bad idea as the other players have stated that they have put blood, sweat and tears and even their soul into their characters it will make some people quit and I heard rumors of people leaving cause of the recent update changes.

Crafting has two prestige schools. It would be better to add new dragon schools as prestige adventure schools like the bipeds have that you can unlock after reaching a certain level or certain skill and can you can switch back and forth and ties in with each fraction choice you choose and just revamp the current dragon adventure school and rename it and use it as the main base. This would be less code work and it won't anger the community.

The community matters if you ignore the community the game will be sure to fall. The lore of the game is important and defines the soul and spirit of the game any new content needs to make sure it fits the lore of the game and fits well with game universe to not create a plot hole or discontinuity.

As for lightning claw there will be new breaths coming out using rift tokens I remember amon mentioning something like that, so there is no need to create classes based on elements. A dragon knows fire breath and all the ancient dragons in istaria are born from Druklar and have to travel threw the fiery rift to reach istaria, but they can learn and adapt to new breaths. To create new classes based on breath will possibly go against the lore of the game.

My final thoughts is that any new dragon schools must be easy to add without forcing or messing up the old system, not shut out the old characters and players and respect the hard work done by them, must be approved by the community, flow with the lore of the game, less need for coding as just one bad code can cause a crash or disrupt something as I seen recently after the update therefore it needs be easy to implement.

I do support what Amon is trying to do and accomplish which I believe is improving the dragon race and its schools and bring new fresh content to the game. I want this game to truly succeed and last for many more years as this is one of the best MMORPGs out there and the others don't really compare to it yet.

[Terao]

The basic class should stay on the Dragon Adventurer we have now. It might be a lot of work, but giving it some thoughts IT IS possible to get a dragon multiclassed. It need to be thinked over which of the quested abilities should get masterable, and the one or other of these abilities might be bound to be used by dragon adventurer and other to the new classes.

For me it's a absolutly NO GO, not even debatable, to set existing dragons into a holding track, and that only newly created dragons are able to take the new classes. As I've a high rated biped, aswell as two ancient dragons, I know both sides very well. Even if the only way is to lose more or less of the abilities we have now, everything is better then being forced to have to start a new toon to be able to take the new dragon classes.

[Levana]

There is absolutely no way I would retire my dragons and start them over just for the sake of new schools. There is time invested in those characters and items I do not wish to lose. The best is adding new branches of school to the existing schools in my opinion. Unless there will be a way for us to change our old characters' schools into the new ones, now that would not be so bad.

[Nyya]

The best is adding new branches of school to the existing schools in my opinion. Unless there will be a way for us to change our old characters' schools into the new ones, now that would not be so bad.

I support this.