The Elder Game

[AA0]

TG is currently in the process of having meetings for the design of the Elder Game for HZ, in IRC we've come up with an idea that we think would work, and satify most people. Not every detail is thought of, tell us what you think.

The elder game exists in the Eastern Deadlands. A series of fortresses would be placed inside the deadlands, all owned and occupied by the WA. The idea would be to attack the forces inside the deadlands, destroy the fortress, and rebuild them in the name of the Empire.

Once rebuilt the WA will attempt to recapture the fortresses (what happens during building, I'm not sure of). The gifted must defend the fortresses (which would probably have a machine type npc similar to the satyr islands, and a bind stone). If the gifted fail, the fortress is captured by the WA and you must retreat to the last fortress that is built.
If the gifted succeed in defending the fortresses, they will need to attack and destroy the next in-line (the building of the fortress would make the next vurnerable to damage). And again rebuild it, as you get closer to the edge of the world as we know it, the attacks will get harder to defend against.

A key to making this work is a few things.

Non-repeatitive battles. The invasions on the fortresses should come in many types, from boss mobs that are random, to a couple large groups of mobs, or maybe even a series of 2 or 3 blight anchors that spawn and being launching attacks on the fortresses.

Reward - There are a lot of different types of loot rewards you can gain, but I was thinking along the line of the emblem reward in kion right now. Quests can be giving that are extremely vague and extremely difficult to complete, they will give you rare titles and possibly bonuses to combat, or crafting (depending on what you did to get it) These should be very hard to get, and not possible by just killing a named mob or something similar.

I personally feel this system will work for quiet a long time. It gives the adventures a big challenge, the battles will be difficult, the reward rare and valuable. It gives each class a job, there will be use for mages and archers in defense of our fortresses, melee classes battle along the front lines, while healers run to where they are called for most. It can bring our shard together, make the community strong again.

At the same time the battles keep raging, the crafters will need to supply the adventurers and the crafters will need push their limits and run into dangerous areas for this. The forts might require supplies to "repair" the machines the WA damage, and a steady set of building materials (hopefully some novo types).

One issue we have is timezones of course, since the EU have their own server, the number of people that play 4am in NA is very low, attacks and defenses will need to be adjusted.

Any other ideas, or changes that could be made?

[Kael Morbane]

AWSOME idea, in fact, coupled with my idea, it'll be VERY hard to be bored, whether you are speccing crafter or adventurer. Once I get my laptop up and running I'll try to join IRC chat and work out a system that will fit with storyline, design items on the work list, etc etc. I'll post the link to my idea because its not very dissimular from this idea. In fact, what I thought of would only serve to enhance this one, because think about it, ED and the fortresses there will always be a battle. Period, whether attacking, protecting the construction, or defending against attacks. My idea would serve best if the WA attack in Elite Sorties instead of battalions as I mentions, and used as a diversion. We are fighting the WA on the ED, trying to drive them from our lands forever, and in attempt to keep us guessing, the WA sends out sorties to try and take out one of our precious racial cities. For me, Dalimond, Falathien, and Tazoon are VERY important to me and I would defend with my very many lives....untill I have so many DPs I can't breath. =) But yea, like my suggestion, set up an Imperial Army, assign rank, involvement should determine rank, not actions, if a multiclass 100 just walks in at the right time once a month and dominates the field compared to a wittle 28 Reaver such as myself is there everyday. I would deserve the promotion, unlike the level 100. Vice Versa, like I as long as I am in the military, will be a casual gamer due to my job, therefore achieving rank for me will be hard, but as long as I'm out there, kicking butt, and taking charge, and coordinating defenses or attacks, I would be doing more for the Empire (world) then a level 100 bad ****** incarnate who dominates the field once a month. Not only that, but crafters, I know plenty of crafters that are flat out hardcore in many crafting classes, yet lower level then myself, so for them guys, joining the army will do no one good, so make a crafting guild or society if you will that would better focus on what their part is in this fired up war. Anyway, heres the link to my post that will explain what I thought up.

[link]http://community.istaria.com/Web/ShowPost.aspx?PostID=79939[/url]

-Ein Morbane
-Kithantryx

[arseovrteakettl]

That would be a very nice start, AAO. I hope the devs will give the idea serious consideration.

[evilkarl]

That system sounds good and well thought out one thing I did notice is there is no mention of what happens if the gifted allow all the fortresses to fall. Will the WA lay seige to the nearest player town or will they stay confined in their ED?

I look forward to seeing boss mobs and hoardes of undead so long as they are balanced unlike the insane bosses we have seen so far with 3k aoe attacks or 700+ pt damage regular attacks yes they should be stronger and more resiliant but 700+ pt regular hits seems a tad insane to me.

Bonus providing emblems sounds like a good reward for quests as does the idea of rare loot. I'm assuming these fortresses will be mostly t4/t5 construction materials? How do they plan to stop mobs charging through the walls of the fortress when we are defending it because some lowbie comes to see what all the commotion is about when it is finally built?

[imported_Twelvebagger]

Thats good stuff!

[Aamer Khan]

I love this idea!

It gives us ALL a valuable part to play, lets us use all our various skills, craft and adventure.
It will also provide a truer challenge, because we can fail and have to start all over again... much like the machines during the satyr event. Another thing this does, and probably the most important part, it gives TG the needed breathing room to actually tweek, adjust, ADD and fix all the issues we like to tell them about. [;)]

[Thalak]

you mean like a real war? say it isn't so! hz meets capture the flag.

[AA0]

Penalties for failure, thats interesting... I always sorta thought the WA will reclaim and you have to push back, but there could be large attacks on towns, and such. Possibly at a failure point not only do we lose all our construction work, but quests get eliminated, and maybe it could trigger a large invasion force onto various targets... maybe anchors cover our resources, towns attacked, etc.

I would guess that t4/t5 resources for the starting bases, then the later ones might use t5/6 when it gets put in, the details are for devs of course, they'd have to make the balance work.

As for the bosses attacking, I picture them like SoG, let them be hard, hurt us, make us pay for slacking off. It isn't supposed to be easy. The T6 WA out there are tough, and as normal mobs will be a good challenge for us being capped at 100 right now.

As for collision detection, thats a problem I didn't think of. The same would be true for archers and mages being perched. I'm sure there are ways around it.

I was also thinking, when our machines or fortresses are damaged, they should be repaired. They should be unhealable, but repairable from crafters, so after a big attack, if our base only have 600/20000 health left, then it will require a dynamic set of materials and all crafters are to be included. It will need armour sheeting, and other materials that uses skills from every class (but construction) to repair, this will give us a sense of urgency, instead of the normal grind

[Kael Morbane]

hey, you perfer endless grinding, or would you rather have a purpose in this life (there is life beyond Horizons? :P j/k) like smiting countless WA, defend your cities, and further along the story of Horizons. I'd be alot happier to be a perminate level 28 and doing this stuff then a level 100 with nothing to gain by anything I do. Which btw, I saw a flaw in that plan, what about the lowbies? We wants precious warfare too, ya know. :p Any talk about that direction?

[AA0]

Lowbies don't get an endgame, they get a full game to deal with.

[Kael Morbane]

like that will stop me, if this idea like the elder game going on was running, and I have nothing but soloing planned for my day in order to level, I'm trekking over to ED and becoming a part of the action...because solo leveling is very boring. Oh SUURE i'll die in ED, many times, i'd be dissapointed if I didn't, however, at least my gaming experience was well WORTH the costs.

[Khoal]

Let me pitch in a few ideas that might help add motivation for players to become involved in Front Line combat.

1) Provide a way to give dynamic feedback to the shard in general of the exploits on the Front. This could take the form of an in-game newspaper (The Istrian Times, Imperial Enquirer, Istarian Evening Post)or simply more functionality from the Town Cryers. Players, who may be low level, or have been away from the game for a while, will want to catch up on what's been happening on the Front; this is how they do that. If a player, a fortress, or perhaps a guild does some great things on the Front (repel an attack, capture a fortress, single-handedly defeat a named mob), they get mentioned by the Town Cryer / Newspaper.

2) The Fortresses should be equipped with a shrine, no doubt. But perhaps they could also be equipped with a travel gate and arrival pad. These would have to be built/repaired separately. By providing this choice (fix the battlements or get the port up and running?) it forces the players to have a strategy. By repairing the travel port and activating it, the defenders of the Fortress could bring in needed supplies quicker. It would also allow lower level players to get a taste of the Elder Game. Motivation to achieve.

3) The method of applying pressure on the defenders of the Fortress could take many forms.

3A) One, as AA0 mentioned, is the periodic assault. This could be accomplished using a random WA mob group spawn system that creates combat troops beyond the visible range of the Fortress. These troops then march to the Fortress and engage the defenders, or the structure itself. Such "BVR" (beyond visible range) mob spawns open the possibility of letting players form combat patrols that intercept attacking forces before they reach the Fortress.

3B) The second could be atiered system within the mobs, which I shall call Red, Green or Blue force mobs. Red force mobs are purely attackers. When they have a target, they fixate on it, unless there is a direct threat to them. These mobs go after structures or large player groups. Green force mobs support the Red force mobs with heals, buffs, and cast debuffs on the defenders of the Fortress or members of large player groups. Blue force mobsprobe the front lines. They attack players outside of the Fortress and try to lure those players into more dangerous areas. They are the WA's pullers.

4) When a Fortress is complete, an NPC ImperialGarrison could spawn. These NPCs guard the Fortress and provide some form of backup for the Gifted players. Think of them as sentry guns. Archers manning the walls, with clerics to heal players or other NPC guardswithin theFortress.

5) If, or when, the WAcapture a Fortress, and there is a travel port activated within it, the WA can use that port to attackthe various racial towns. Again, motivation for the players to succeed.

[Aamer Khan]

Khoal, in ref. to the blue mobs, if they would offer incentive in the form of much better loot than normal, like a grab bag of t5 rare comps, or some other truly worthwhile form of reward, then you can be assured that players will actually go after them and get lured away.

They will have to be on par with a multiclassed players abilities, and have enough AI to drag players back to a dangerous group once ingaged.

I would LOVE this! ;)

[Kael Morbane]

keep them ideas coming, I'm going to LOVE this. >:)

Yes, We are barbarians that wants war, =)

[AA0]

I like the idea of a reporting system of the front lines, I was thinking earlier about maybe a new structure to be built in Harro, when it is completed, it could send out messages about certain events, such as a fortress built, captured, defeated, defended... it could mention names as well as an added bonus.
It could also act as a warning system for large assualts, or assualts which originate in the deadlands against town attacks, etc.

[Khoal]

Khoal, in ref. to the blue mobs, if they would offer incentive in the form of much better loot than normal, like a grab bag of t5 rare comps, or some other truly worthwhile form of reward, then you can be assured that players will actually go after them and get lured away.

They will have to be on par with a multiclassed players abilities, and have enough AI to drag players back to a dangerous group once ingaged.

I would LOVE this! [img]/Web/emoticons/emotion-5.gif[/img]

Better loot for Blue force mobs? Yes, that would certainly provide motivation to chase them into the danger zones...and waiting Red and Green force mobs. [:D]

[Vandellia]

why not move into the unexplored continetn ? why not creating an event to rebuild a destroyed portal that has a requirement of 80+ adv/craft to use place destoyed settlements that can be rebuilt and crafting structures put in constant raids on these towns new mobs etc that would be a lot more fun. it would definately move the camping of mobs to the new areas, I would prefer that some mobsdont get spawnedto attack the town/trade center till after its completed though :)