Blight Update Notes for July 12th, 2005. - modified -

[Vlisson]

Additions/Changes/Fixes:


Construction Update - The least efficient construction contribution ratio has been changed to 3:1 rather than 5:1. The optimal ratio remains at 2:1.

does it mean if i have the minimum skill for example cobalt i dont have 5:1 anymore? instead i have 3:1?

why this? i love to see my improvements, the help of teched items to gain some points of skill wont improve the ratio like before? and the exp?

will 3:1 be the same exp like 5:1?

[Death-knell]

[img]/Web/Themes/Generic/images/icon-quote.gif[/img]Manga wrote:

Additions/Changes/Fixes:


Construction Update - The least efficient construction contribution ratio has been changed to 3:1 rather than 5:1. The optimal ratio remains at 2:1.

does it mean if i have the minimum skill for example cobalt i dont have 5:1 anymore? instead i have 3:1?

why this? i love to see my improvements, the help of teched items to gain some points of skill wont improve the ratio like before? and the exp?

will 3:1 be the same exp like 5:1?

Testing on blight so far has shown you get less XP; see previous page notes by Kulamata. But Manga followed that post that they are currently monitoring that and it may change.

[Death-knell]

[img]/Web/Themes/Generic/images/icon-quote.gif[/img]Death-Knell wrote: Vlisson,
You have not done a very good job of scouting, marble is closer to a real town then mith, it has a jman stonecutter right close by also. The swamp isn't that far, have run there more times then I care to count before becoming big. Theres no reason to screw metal crafters just because ironsilk/shining are a little farther to run to.
You should be arguing for changes to help the swamp runners, not whining because another group has it a little better. Lobby for plots near by or something like that.


ok sorry to left topic but there has been a comparison between metall and the other resources and so i posted my standpoint about this

@ontopic why are you against this change, i heared 1 argument i can understand.

simplification

why change this unique metall system and make all similar and simple?

i understand that mithril will combined with one other resource to fit to the concept of t2-4

but why change t2-4 too?

Hmmm....lets see.
Tier 1 copper and tin= bronze 1 node
Tier 2 iron = iron 1 node
tier 3 iron and nickel = steel 2 nodes
Tier 4 steel and cobalt = cobalt? huh?

And yes, why should metalworkers be able to reap the same reward for the same amount of work. Metalworkers should have to do more running around and combinations just to make their basic product. I mean they get all those extra benefits from their work <scratches head> they do?

I don't give a ratz arse about simplification, I'm looking for equality. Any metalworker whose ground their way through tier 3 and 4 has done a significant amount of work as compared to other craftsmen on the same tiers.

[Jael]

This change has me absolutly furious. I can see being upset that people PL thier way through all metal classes by grinding out tool, so why not attack the actual problem instead of hurting everyone. I am a builder, I work in the mithril fields alot to try to get my guilds t5 fitting work done, and I have a ton of t6 metal work to do. We have a bunch of expert shops planned, and now with this change you have changed a already tedious process into even more frustrating time consuming process.

I am going to use a expert leather shop as a example, it needs
90 adamantium joints and 120 sheets. So to apply that many joints and sheets at optimal I need 7200 adamantium bars. To make thoseI need 72,000 mithril bars and 7200 shining orbs. Under the current system thats 144,000 mithril ore gathered. This is more than enough to make it a very difficult undertaking.

Now with the 2 new systems proposed I would need
1- (2 mithril ore + 1 cobalt ore) 144,000 mithril ore and 72,000 cobalt ore

2- (3 mithril ore to make 1 bar) 216,000 mithril ore


Working T5 & T6 fitting is already difficult enough, these changes are entirely unneeded. If you want to reduce the grinding of metal tools to raise so many classes then only give tool making exp to the classes that are meant to make tools. The problem is not the smelting of the metal, the problem is way too many classes recieve exp for things that shouldnt be associated with thier classes.

[Joaqim]

Ironsilk is the hardest T5 resource in-game.

There is ONE TINY SPAWN at the Tower of Spirits, with Blood Skulks, T5 Gruoks, and T5 Purple Spiders roaming around. You can clear them and they will stay gone IF no one hunts them across the water. There is NO distaff ANYwhere close. The closest town is Lerena, and that is a good 15 minute Tarbash Disk drag over two rock spans and through more mobs.

Not fun.

Hmm maybe I did something wrong when I did the last18 lvl to Tailor 100 there. Yes the walk isn't very short (I think it was something like 25Minutes for a complete run from Lerena and back to machines with a discload of Ironsilk). Yes there are also Blood Skulks and Spiders around on s3vral areas of this Island.I prefered to look for a more Mob free area andwithin all my crafting sessions I needed to kill not more then one Mob within 2-3h, because it was coming to close and I don't like to unexpected aggro while gathering.
I never use this rock spawns, as the area I use is better reachable while walking through the water - and on that way you usually don't meet any mob.

[evilkarl]

Metal is a more difficult material to work with than wood or or cloth. Perhaps this is why its more difficult to use in game?

Metal is also the backbone of empires army, most gifted have metal in some form or another on them at some point. Even if you are a cloth wearing enchanter (pointed out earlier) you probably have jewelery. Metal is by far the most common material used in istaria and it is also one of the hardest materials to work with.

I don't dislike Snow's suggestion (mixed nodes) but at the same time I'm not for it either.

[Joaqim]

Half of the game's craft schools can be leveled off this single resource.

There are seven schools that share the smelting skill skill: fitter, miner, blacksmith, jeweler, weaponsmith, armorer, and outfitter. There is also tinkerer, which can be easily leveled with metalworking gained from fitter, blacksmith, or weaponsmith.

Who cares? Isn't that much other with Marble!

There arefive schools that share Stoneworking skill:
blacksmith, mason, miner, scholar, spellcrafter
And Tinkerer, can easily lvled with sculpting, gained from blacksmith, mason, scholar or spellcrafter.

[imported_Zayin]

Working T5 & T6 fitting is already difficult enough, these changes are entirely unneeded. If you want to reduce the grinding of metal tools to raise so many classes then only give tool making exp to the classes that are meant to make tools. The problem is not the smelting of the metal, the problem is way too many classes recieve exp for things that shouldnt be associated with thier classes.

I agree 100% this is really the root of the problem is it not?

[cattoy]

What is the hardest resource (metal, wood, stone ect.)to level 1 to 100 as it stands today?

Clay.

[Brassandyn]

The people contributing to this thread are the same people who contribute to all threads, even those few who say they may quit. Tulga, those aren't the people you should worry about (including me... I'm perfectly capable of a whine).

Tulga, you need to worry about the several hundred (thousand) other peoplewho don't participate on the forums and who will one day have a change dumped on them that will make them angry, confused or simply to asking "why was this done?" Those are the people who will take their mining picksto other worlds.

Don't forget the silent majority. They will perceive this asa NERF, no matter how well you package it.

And (for the record) leave the construction progression the way it is. I liked to watch my growth from 5:1 to 2:1 in construction schools, and I never worked tools to level any of them.

Thank you for your support

[imported_Silveron]

For those of you obsessed with how easy it is to work a second class up off a first lv 100 class with T5 materials...

Remove all raw to useable processing experience. ie Slabs to Bricks, Ore to Bars.

Boost finished product xp by an appropriate amount to keep the xp gains similar.

This will help with some of the cross overs but would still allow a few combos like blacksmith/weaponsmith to complement each other.

So, step 2:
Tweak schools to work more in line with how salvaging functions. You have to be in your highest ex: "weapon crafting school" to gain from making weapons.

The first proposed changes eliminate some of the iron needed for cobalt pain.. but aside from that its a finger in the broken dam.

[Vlisson]

For those of you obsessed with how easy it is to work a second class up off a first lv 100 class with T5 materials...

Remove all raw to useable processing experience. ie Slabs to Bricks, Ore to Bars.

Boost finished product xp by an appropriate amount to keep the xp gains similar.

This will help with some of the cross overs but would still allow a few combos like blacksmith/weaponsmith to complement each other.

So, step 2:
Tweak schools to work more in line with how salvaging functions. You have to be in your highest ex: "weapon crafting school" to gain from making weapons.

The first proposed changes eliminate some of the iron needed for cobalt pain.. but aside from that its a finger in the broken dam.

yes good idea! i like it

@ontopic i fear Tulga dont know what they change! think about a tinkerer who needs a lot of different resouces already! because of this change he will need more storage

[Sarpedos]

For those of you obsessed with how easy it is to work a second class up off a first lv 100 class with T5 materials...

Remove all raw to useable processing experience. ie Slabs to Bricks, Ore to Bars.

Boost finished product xp by an appropriate amount to keep the xp gains similar.

This will help with some of the cross overs but would still allow a few combos like blacksmith/weaponsmith to complement each other.

So, step 2:
Tweak schools to work more in line with how salvaging functions. You have to be in your highest ex: "weapon crafting school" to gain from making weapons.

The first proposed changes eliminate some of the iron needed for cobalt pain.. but aside from that its a finger in the broken dam.

Just one little (big) problem with your step 1. If you remove processing xp, it's impossible for Miners and Gatherers to gain xp except by salvaging, basically ruining those two schools. I like the step 2 though... if you're not currently in the school that 'owns' the skill used for making the finished product, you get reduced or zero xp. This would need a bit of tweaking still, since blacksmith, scholar, outfitter, miner and gatherer don't have any 'unique' skills.

[Nalrach]

Like usual Hal, you got a different eye on things,

This change is nothing more than a game balance issue, and whenever there needs balancing, there's going to be give and take, people are going to be upset when it's announced, only concentrating on the take, then a month later everyone will forget about it and we'll have a more balanced game for the future.

In the old world cobalt was 'pretty tough,' but after merge players became spoiled on easily accessable craft experience, and suddenly cobalt was a nightmare, and to even think about doing fitting work with it was to go mad with madness. After merge, we got mithril, and from a crafter's perspective it was awesome.

Half of the game's craft schools can be leveled off this single resourc

When I started fitter, people told me why dont you take miner and get to Mithril and then get your fitter up. Now that you pointing it this way why did I not. Because I was short minded mind and only cared about being t1-t2 self-sufficient. And I could see the devs trying find a way to stop this speedy levelling we are seeing after somone can easily do mithril.

Plus .. like he said are we in a situation where the candy is removed and the child react to the candy be gone.

Bronze was no trouble, iron was easy, but steel and cobalt were nightmares with the 2 or 3 materials needed being in completely different fields, usually completely different cities, and requiring a huge drag or several portal/recalls to get a full disk of bars.

I have a friend that I always ear her saying she needs to fill a silo of theis and then taht so she can make this final product. She seems not to mind too much, true she has 5 diffrent plot across the shards and various possibilty for storage and she has a dragon doing the dinng anf flying stuff around. This is my limited involvement with metal basher's .. but I can understand if you only have one plot, and no other mean to get stuff to your plot but portal and recal to be a drag. Maybe Hal has a point again.. are the fact that resources are way off beat path or far from each others, but is thata stopper for metal crafters to stop enjoy levelling .. I'm not so sure.

[Nalrach]

Ilove modern society, when it doesn't work let's go from an extream to the other.

For those of you obsessed with how easy it is to work a second class up off a first lv 100 class with T5 materials...
Remove all raw to useable processing experience. ie Slabs to Bricks, Ore to Bars.
Boost finished product xp by an appropriate amount to keep the xp gains similar.
This will help with some of the cross overs but would still allow a few combos like blacksmith/weaponsmith to complement each other.

Yes I agree that xp for final product is way too low, wspecially for construction builders, for a strange reason we stop getting experience for construction work way before we stop for processing raw ore.

You proposal has merit if fact you want to increase the final product xp, but often the only xp we get is for processing the raw material. The solution is not cut the xp on raw ore processing, because we would have a huge hole with no xp, because xp for final work stop real soon. This is a reason why I don't level on construction xp. Okay, if you want too balance the two, but not cutting the xp on the raw material. And doing so you will have to extent the time construction worker get xp for their work.

SO PLEASE dev's going from one extreme to the other is a bad idea.

[gusi]

Remember, Nalrach, that exp is given out according to base skill. Thus, since construction schools get 9 processing and 10 finishing (not including toolmaking), their exp for making/application does run down quicker.

There is an exception, however. When applying the exp given is based on current skill. So, as a lvl 100 Fitter (for example), I can still get exp for Bronze applications. Effective? No. But for players still raising their skills, it is a very handy piece of information.

[Nalrach]

[img]/Web/Themes/Generic/images/icon-quote.gif[/img]Silveron wrote: So, step 2:
Tweak schools to work more in line with how salvaging functions. You have to be in your highest ex: "weapon crafting school" to gain from making weapons.Just one little (big) problem with your step 1. If you remove processing xp, it's impossible for Miners and Gatherers to gain xp except by salvaging, basically ruining those two schools. I like the step 2 though... if you're not currently in the school that 'owns' the skill used for making the finished product, you get reduced or zero xp. This would need a bit of tweaking still, since blacksmith, scholar, outfitter, miner and gatherer don't have any 'unique' skills.

Wait a second ... doing this you will stop some crafter school to the poor man land for levelling xp. As a fitter I find the xp for sheeting to be not worth my effort for the resources required, so I level on making tools. Shure I don't get xp for deconstructing tools because I'm not in the rigth school (and that I accept). But you want to cut my xp for making tools, because I'm not in the main school that makes.

I think I'm missing something and not reading rigth, but this seems a slippery road.

[gusi]

You should be getting exp for tools in the respective construction schools IF your current skill used to make said tool is higher then your current Salvaging skill. It's nothing to do with the Fitter school that you don't gain auto-decon exp.

[Machivelli]

>>incoming personal attack, moderators get ready to smite me<<
Whoever canceled his account because of a Blight patch note is a bit silly. It's a test. It's not live. They want to see how it works before they make it part of the game. Clearly, given that Smeglor has reassured us by saying they have alternatives in mind, the devs are actually paying attention to how the players feel. So be an adult and stop overreacting to things that may or may not even happen.
>>end personal attack<<

The point some of these are making is that why in the world are you even testing something like this when there are serious matters that should be addressed first. Why are you devoting the resources to "Changing" the way metal is worked when Conf STILL do not have what they need to be a legitimate school. If you can't understand that these people are making a stand on principle, well then you need not post more of those feeble personal attacks against them. They are making a stand the way they think is best, do you have the right to judge them and call them adolescent?

[Death-knell]

What really gets me is that mith and how its processed isn't the problem. The problem is none of the Devs bothered thinking....hmm, if we put player plots close to this resource what will happen?
I mean, with the exception of 2, maybe 3 resource fields they all have beginner machines nearby. Some even have player plots nearby with processing equipment.