XP/Flying

[Xorith]

While it'll probably take money and resources to do this...

Allow dragons the ability to use certain flight abilities. Not all abilities on the ground would work well in the air, so there is need for another set for in-flight combat.

Create flying NPCs, and more of the range ones. An in-air dragon wouldn't be able to do much but swoop and flame at an archer on the ground. It's group would have to help out in that regard. However, just as the dragon in-flight couldn't do much for the ground-to-air assault, they could very well take out the air-to-air assault, and air-to-ground assault. (Bird-like creatures, swooping and pecking at group members. A mage would be able to try, but the bird could easily swing high out of range.)

Combat would be based on per-action as suggested. The dragon would get little to no experience for things killed on the ground, however they would get most if not all experience for things killed in the air.

This would also reflect back on bipeds. Unless a ranged attacker, they would not be able to harm air enemies, and thus would only get experience for what's on the ground.

One big thing that would be needing correcting, however, is healing and other spells. Simple enough to register actions done against an NPC during combat. Not too simple to register things such as heals, augments, and other spells that help out during a fight, but don't directly harm the NPC. I also don't think distance should play a factor, unless the biped is completely out of range. That would no doubt be unfair to cloth-wearing bipeds that need to stand back else they become a nice meal. Lastly, getting hit should be consider "action" in a battle as well. That way a tanking melee would get credit, even if he's not able to do much more aside from get beat-on.

-- Xorith

[Draygon]

Interesting. While I had heard of the proposed exp change regarding dragons in flight, this is the most detail I've encountered on what that change will entail.This is also the first time I have definitively heard that dragons cannot attack (or do pretty much anything) while flying. Indeed, most everything on the dragon race I had read prior to this led me to believe the opposite was true.

Which is, I think, the final sandbag to snap this dragon's spine. On top of the other issues this game seems to have, if the great benefit of ascending toadulthood is becoming a floating target in battle, well that just doesn't make a lot of sense. Picture, if you will, a team of dragons swooping down for the kill. Only instead of unleashing firey death from above, they have to land, re-orient themselves, frog-leap over to the enemy, and then attack. Please, please correct me if I'm mistaken but that's certainly what it sounds like so far.

In my opinion, combat experience should be based largelyon participation. And this should include healers and mages working their spells as well as the fighters dealing damage and learning to roll with the inevitable blows. Group experience should be but a small fraction;from a role perspective, either the experience gained by working together as a team, or the insight gained while observing a more experienced character battling.One might even devise a clever way of capping the latter based on the difference in levelwith a max of about 10 levels; for example, a level 1 character might understand some of the tactics of a level 10 character but would be overwhelmed at the skill and power of someone in their 20's or above.

[Dragoniade]

Interesting. While I had heard of the proposed exp change regarding dragons in flight, this is the most detail I've encountered on what that change will entail.This is also the first time I have definitively heard that dragons cannot attack (or do pretty much anything) while flying. Indeed, most everything on the dragon race I had read prior to this led me to believe the opposite was true.

Yep. All the talk about dragon attacking, healing in flight, doing fire raid... were all player suggestion should TG decide to give flying dragons something to do.

If a dragon is in flight and get attacked, the only thing he can do is fly higher and get out of range. He can't counter, and if it is targeted by a group of caster/archer, by the time it land and engage, it got most of its hp drained. You can't even fly faster toward the attacker, like a ground based (sprint) could do to decrease the ranged attack period.

[Lumineux]

I think a key point that has not been brought up here is how little (IMO, of course) this will impact a honest dragon player. I've run from fights, sure. Most often in a situation where I did not intend to be fighting in the first place, or got overwhelemd by adds. But I do not recall enough times where I saved my own ****** in a group battle that this could have any significant impact. Why is everyone so worried about it?

[Draygon]

I think a key point that has not been brought up here is how little (IMO, of course) this will impact a honest dragon player. I've run from fights, sure. Most often in a situation where I did not intend to be fighting in the first place, or got overwhelemd by adds. But I do not recall enough times where I saved my own ****** in a group battle that this could have any significant impact. Why is everyone so worried about it?

Personally I'm more concerned about the implications this raises than about the actual XP change. Frankly, yes, if the dragons cannot take any action mid-air then it makes perfect sense to eliminate experience gain while in flight. This change is entirely understandable given the current state of the system.

At the same time, this could be perceived as yet another nail in the coffin for those anticipating some development in regards to aerial combat. The message is not "While the flying stuff is still on the backburner we're turning off exp because it just doesn't make sense yet." and far more "Here is something else we're chopping because it could be abused.". And that's the crux of it, is it not? This abuse can only come about by consent of the remaining group members actually doing the work. Is it really too much to expect thata group leader should take notice when one of their teamis leeching off the others? In this instance I would still support the change for the reasons given earlier, yet I question how far one should go in modifying the system to prevent its mechanics from abuse when such could be monitored by the players.

[Dragoniade]

Personally I'm more concerned about the implications this raises than about the actual XP change. Frankly, yes, if the dragons cannot take any action mid-air then it makes perfect sense to eliminate experience gain while in flight. This change is entirely understandable given the current state of the system.

And frankly, I still defend that if someone start sprinting or get out of range, the experience should be eliminated for them, dragon or biped. You start sprinting, then you definetly want to leave the battle and get out of range. No Xp. Like a dragon taking of to leave the battle.

You get out of range? No Xp either. You're not following the battle so you shouldn't get any Xp either.

[Seranthor]

I'm of the opinion that if your in flight (where a mob cant get to you) then you have no right to any of the exp... :)

[Levity]

Why should you lose all xp for a fight if you have to bail out at the last? Does not a savvy warrior know when defeat is imminent, and not just stand there to be slaughtered? XP = /Experience/ points, and veteran fighters are those who have learned from experience. Defeat teaches lessons just as much as does victory.

I say that if you help kill the thing, you should get a representative amount of xp. If you tag it with one hit and then flap skyward, maybe you only get 1 or 2 xp -- but if you are slugging it out to the last and have to flee rather than die, then you should get a fair share if it falls to a companion of yours, or, even better, to the lingering effects of your own DoT.

-Levity/Myrthwynn

[Dragoniade]

I'm of the opinion that if your in flight (where a mob cant get to you) then you have no right to any of the exp... [img]/Web/emoticons/emotion-1.gif[/img]

My opinion is you should get Xp based on how long you've been in a fight. Otherwise, penalize everyone who's been inactive or escape the fight for any reason.

And since when monster can't reach us in flight? Ever heard of Archer, mage and mid range abilities? Flight isn't an invincible mode: it's a transportation mode, just as Sprint. It shouldn't be penalized as being the same as perching Otherwise, penalize EVERYONE who went farther than 40 meters from the battle fields.

[Valornyx]

Since dragons cannot attack or do anything to the mobs whilst in the air - they do not get any xp for the timne that they are in the air .. as already explained by the devs - they get xp for the damage done whilst on the ground - as long as they are still in the vicinity of the mob when it dies...

Flying is an extremely useful escape from combat - since it immediately gets you out of range of most mobs - some can still get you - and debuffs can still kill you - but most mobs cannot hit you..

Flight allows dragons to do hit and run killing - which is extremely effective in hitting mobs on satyr islands - or aegregors etc..

Yes - it would be nice to have in flight combat - but that would require an enormous amount of work from the devs .. and be very hard to balance. What would bipeds do when attacked by a flying mob - if they were not an archer or caster?

I can't honestly see why people are complaining about a "nerf" - unless they are the lazy type who wants to sit in flight over a fight and get PLed by someone else doing the work .. on the ground - even 40 meters away - you have the chance of getting agroed - in the air - you do not..

Get on the ground and fight instead of complaining about the small amount of xp you might lose through having a handy escape from battle function. You will lose a lot more xp through dying and having to recall and fly back to the fight.