why should I stay?

[lise]

Apart from the obvious question "Where else would you go, EQ2?" (to which the answer would be a smack in the mouth), why should I stay with Horizons? I haven't been playing much for the last 2 months and each time I log in I look around and find nothing much has changed and that there's nothing really for me to do.. i could level up another 50 times but I got sick of just levelling for no apparent reason and stopped playing. there certainly seems a lot less people around in the world (especially real new players, not just alts), which I'm taking to be a bad sign. The news page on the logon screen hasn't seemed to conatin any new items for weeks, so I'm guessing that means nothing has changed at all in the game for ages.

The "event" seems to be the same green one we've had for ages as well.

All in all i'm not getting any positives for staying with the game. Can you all post your thoughts on why you think people should stay? what's so good that's just around the corner that matters to hopeless non-hardcore players like me that might keep me on?

[Peaches]

I believe the dev team to be working hard on making our world better. I am patient to give them the time they need to make it even better.

Setting aside some issues on Order currently, I still have that exciting feeling of logging into the game, and having fun. I have seen new players come in, and having fun also, per talks with them.

Just my two cents.

[gusi]

What are we working on for Horizons today? The following are additions that are coming to Horizons between today and the end of January. In addition, we are constantly working on reported problems, improving performance, new quests, equipment, structures, events and land. Due to the move to the new offices, some of these have taken longer than we had originally planned. Blighted Equipment: in an effort to equip their forces with better equipment, the Withered Aegis have begun arming the Undead with blighted weapons, armor, scales, and other equipment. Players will be able to loot blighted equipment from the Withered Aegis forces and turn them against the enemy. Ancient Rite of Passage for Dragons: Adult Dragons will be able to begin the Ancient Rite of Passage and upon their completion of this difficult series of tasks, assume their most powerful form, the Ancient Dragon. Dragon Claw slots: Dragons will be able to equip claws that can be techniqued. Dragon Lairs: Dragon plots will become available which allow the underground construction of player configured Dragon Lairs. Blight Anchors: these most recent invaders, sent by the Withered Aegis will continue to evolve and attempt different tactics to drive the Gifted from Istaria. New Crystals: Crystals will once again begin to be discovered in Istaria. These crystals will provide valuable powers to properly techniqued items. Racial Quests: New quests will be introduced which provide additional bonuses to the different races of Istaria. Vault Capacity Quests: the demand for larger vault storage has lead to additional methods of increasing how much a player can store in a vault. New Tutorials: the existing tutorial does not properly explain to the novice player how to play Horizons. We are building two new islands, one for Dragons, and one for Bipeds, which will do a better job of explaining the mechanics and the ideas of Horizons. These islands will be able to be visited at any time in order to review the lessons and to engage the content found there. What will we work on immediately after that? New Racial Structures: with Humans and Dragons having their architectural styles covered, we will continue to develop racial structures for the other races. Raising Schools to level 120: Players will be able to take their favorite school beyond the current cap of 100. Ancient Dragons will also be able to advance to new powers. We have already begun this work, and had expected to be able to be able to complete it by this time. However, the complexity of the task was not fully appreciated and we are going to take more time in order to do this well. Structure and Community Customization: We will be initiating systems that allow for the player built furniture, structural modifications and additional environmental modifications by players.



This is what DB sent out in an email about a week ago (I've cut some parts off that weren't really relevant to what you're asking).

Hope this satisfies your needs! [:)]

[Peaches]

That sounds like a menu for us staying? Does for me too!

[lise]

Thanks Gusi - next time please don't use yellow - i can't read it on the grey background of the forum.

Just to clarify some things. I never made it past level 50 in any dscipline with any of my characters because I never saw any reason to continue the levelling treadmill. The monsters are mostly the same only harder with different colours. I was always more interested in the world exploring quests as a low level player than the new trophy system, which to me reinforces the whole "do this task for xp and money" treadmill. Those darkstaff quests and the related ones you picked up from the people he directed you to early on were really fun and gave you a godd sense of the history of the world and of interacting with it, but that whole experience seemed to fizzle after level 20 when it becomes kill crush destroy tasks for the next 100 levels. There's no real point to those quests, and I find the repetative nature of them tedious in the extreme.

Player modifications to structures sounds good, but I've been hearing and wishing for that since about this time last year (or very close to).

I'm not a dragon. I don't intend to play a dragon.

The economy seems all over the place still. I bought a full suit of teched plate iron armour for 5 silver direct from a player, and found out that other people pay an amazing amount for the same. Guild all seem to build stuff for each other at no cost, so there's no real way to judge how much to make stuff for. And since all the crafters have gotten so good, I can't seem to compete in crafting. I can only make armour for deconstruction, which actually is BORING after the first hundred items. Nobody wants my stuff because I can't compete with the realy good people, who can make it for a pittance because they don't seem to need the money for anything.

[gusi]

Thanks Gusi - next time please don't use yellow - i can't read it on the grey background of the forum.

Sorry about that, the email had default yellow. And it did not allow me to change to black for some reason.

The economy seems all over the place still. I bought a full suit of teched plate iron armour for 5 silver direct from a player, and found out that other people pay an amazing amount for the same. Guild all seem to build stuff for each other at no cost, so there's no real way to judge how much to make stuff for. And since all the crafters have gotten so good, I can't seem to compete in crafting. I can only make armour for deconstruction, which actually is BORING after the first hundred items. Nobody wants my stuff because I can't compete with the realy good people, who can make it for a pittance because they don't seem to need the money for anything.

I've been seeing more and more people asking for the 'lower' tier stuff, and it's just a real pain for us 'higher' lvl chars to go back and get no exp and next to no coin for doing the job. (( Btw, I'm on Order shard.. ))

I'm sure people would still need your crafting services, just need to advertise.

[Peaches]

Ahh, gusi, it don't matter to me on whether I get experience or not, I will do the task, whether it be building or making items. I am on order shard too.

[CeroBostwick]

Same here...xp, coin, it's all of no consequence for me. I am just as happy to make a suit of bronze as I am mithril, but then again, I don't charge a copper for either. So, any of you brave souls on Order find yourself in need of armor, do feel free to get hold of me..

[;)]

[Vahrokh]

On Unity if a newbiewill need spells (dragon or not) or armor (dragons only) I'll usually ask him to dig the basic resources (for some reason I hate feeding people so I always want off them to feel like they have to workfor an objective) and come to me and then I'll make them for free.

If it's an alt the thing changes completely and I will ask market prices off him, but still I'll make the thing.

[Akuluxtraxas]

Great list but how much will be a reality and how soon are my questions. Lairs etc have never been working so i must admit ill believe it when its live

[lise]

It'sw great that you all would be happy to create anything as is asked for - whether you get the people who can't do this for themselves to collect you the resources, or are simply happy to make the items for a pittance because you don't need to the money, but in my opinion this is exactly what is trashing the economy. And without a useful economy system there's no point crafting for sales when most people do it for other reasons.

There's no way for a new crafter to gague the economy, and find the value of items. Pawnies are basically useless. I see resources on various consigners at a huge variety of prices - from the few cents people put on the rarest of resources because they just want to be rid of the things but make a little off them if they can, to the ultra-optimitic persons who belive that adobe clay really should be 3s each - and of the the funny thing here is that some people have way too much money to care thay they pay this much (hehe: from experience). There are way too many consigners and no way of finding resources on them.

I won't pursue crafting any more if theres no reason to make anything. People won't buy the best armour I can make for the price I want if they can get a better version with all the techs and all for free or 1s and in less time. So why would I want to compete in a market like that?

To find someone capable of making a suit of armour or some food or tools or weapons I have to ask in market or one of the other chat rooms. There's virtually no other way to get stuff. The consigners are basically full of resources whereas long ago they used be full of armour and spells and weapons and crystals, with hardly any resources. I can't use consigners and buy my way through the game anymore, I have to do that forever-a-role-playing thing of sitting in a chat room.

[CeroBostwick]

Really? I have always just done a quick player search and sent a couple friendly tells..*shrugs*

[Crazyfingers]

I dont know

Guess you could come over to Chaos and hang out with me, at least u could make the Herald's Most Wanted.

I do have ideas but they dont seem to go very far, almost like 4 old drunks sitting at a bar babbling on about how great thetavern used to be and all the goodtimes they used to have. Then making suggestions to the toothless bartender on ways to improve the bar to its old glory. New CD's in the jukebox, dollar beer nights, better pooltables. The bar tender just shakes his head and passes them another beer.

[evilkarl]

Ive never been able to find exactly what I want on consigners however saying they are empty is untrue.

Aug, kion and sslanis consigners have always had stuff as has dalimond. Last time I checked NR did as well.

I do agree there are too many consigners in the world and no easy way to search all of them in an easy manner. You are right the economy is all over the place and its difficult to guage prices but this will always be a case when the economy is made up of individuals who can decide prices on a whim.

Re not crafting lower tier stuff due to no xp or not enough cash..you suck :P. The only thing I can understand not wanting to make of a lower tier is cobalt and perhaps steel items just because it is such a pain in the arse.

[Krald]

I think the economy in HZ is fundamentally flawed. Its largest problem in my opinion is that there are no money sinks during the actual production process so the only costs in crafting are up-front costs for formulas, and whatever else and while these may move money around the economy briefly perhaps, eventually people will get all the formulas they need until a new tier comes in and then they can just give stuff away for free or extremely cheap and feel perfectly happy about that. However those who are up and coming and want to make money will have trouble - they cannot very easily from craft if there is competition giving stuff away. This can be demoralising. Now I know others were refering mostly to re-sold teched stuff in an earlier post and thats a seperate problem, but still :p

What a game needs is money and item sinks all the way along the process. So everywhere you go you are both losing and gaining money but never at too fast a rate either way. This gives money and items a definite indesputable value.

Now I don't expect them to ever make radical enough changes to change the HZ economy but I'm just saying, in an ideal world (for me at least) how I'd like things. I don't actually see how it would even work for HZ as it is set up now, I mean if you put in say some kind of item you need to buy to craft another item people would question why you can't just make or gather that one yourself....

[PJ]

Dunnno Krald, Vielo are doing a pretty ******** good job sucking money out of the economy.

[lise]

PJ: The vielo suck money out of the higher levels - many people aren't high enough level to bother the veilo yet.

Crazyfingers:"I do have ideas but they dont seem to go very far, almost like 4 old drunks sitting at a bar babbling on about how great thetavern used to be and all the goodtimes they used to have."
If the tavern used be good and now it isn't, most people will go to a different tavern.

EvilKarl: I'm still a long way away from being able to make even cobolt armour, but to you (and most crafters) it's a peice of cake, and it's cheap for you to make and there's always a market because people prefer things cheap, potent, easy and fast - which are the thing a low level crafter can't always do. P.s. I didn't say "they are empty" - I said they used be full of one thing (armour, spells, techs) and now they are full of another (parts). Not good when you want to sell something and work out a good price.

Krald: At the risk of starting yet another flame war, a great money sink would be item decay on armour and weapons, and a "use by" date on foods. This would mean there would be a sink for the money invested in armour that is on connies, etc - the items decay, the person who put them there loses money. It would also mean that there's always people looking for all level of items: I'd say that demand would outstrip production and that's always a great thing for shifting money in an economy, plus decay would mean that items aren'tproduced until there's demand for them. Unfortunately it's one of those "radical change" things that piss people off.

[Hex]

Apart from the obvious question "Where else would you go, EQ2?" (to which the answer would be a smack in the mouth), why should I stay with Horizons?

Quite simple you shouldn't. If you enjoy playing then stay, if you don't then why pay for a game that you aren't able to enjoy.

[evilkarl]

PJ: The vielo suck money out of the higher levels - many people aren't high enough level to bother the veilo yet.

Depending on the player they can suck money out of you your entire career as you can buy tech comps from them. But I agree for the most part this is high level content.

EvilKarl: I'm still a long way away from being able to make even cobolt armour, but to you (and most crafters) it's a peice of cake, and it's cheap for you to make and there's always a market because people prefer things cheap, potent, easy and fast - which are the thing a low level crafter can't always do. P.s. I didn't say "they are empty" - I said they used be full of one thing (armour, spells, techs) and now they are full of another (parts). Not good when you want to sell something and work out a good price.

I'm not a crafter I don't make anything other than bars, bricks and cut gems :). However cobalt is never a piece of cake to make due to the fact it requires 3 tiers of resources and numerous ports/travel time. Last time I checked a consigner (about a week ago) there were several pieces of armour weapons and spells on them. Admitedly not all types were present but there were swords, axes, maces, plate chain scale and ring armour.

[gusi]

Re not crafting lower tier stuff due to no xp or not enough cash..you suck [img]/Web/emoticons/emotion-4.gif[/img]. The only thing I can understand not wanting to make of a lower tier is cobalt and perhaps steel items just because it is such a pain in the ***.

I used to do this. I used to make lower people's armor/weapons/tools for free or at a very low price.

Then I got told off because there's no challenge for a 'nooby' player if they get everything for free.

So, essentially, I stopped doing it. And I agree, there is no challenge for the new player if they get everything for free.

I try to keep out of their business because:

- Half the time they'll want one of the new dye techs, and buying ~26 dyes from an alchy will end up in me having to pay.
- I don't have many I and II techs, and don't plan on acquiring them all.
- Something for free is boring, meaningless, no fun.

If somebody wants something of lower tier, generally I will ask them to gather *everything* and then bring all the stuff to me. This way they aren't actually getting something for free, they have to work for it and saves me from having to port around to collect the resources.