Countdown

[Oakleif]

Philosophical question here, and I'm trying to leave out the whole flame-bait conversation that already happened between Unity players and some players on Chaos about the fairness of tokens for players of one shard vs. another. Lets look at this from the perspective only of players from Unity:

When Unity shut down, many of the European players came to one of the US shards, and have been waiting for plot reclamations to start up again. Many others came to US shards when VI took over. All before character transfers have been enabled.

How is it fair to those players from your own community to hand out plot or lair tokens when they have been gathering cash for the day when plot reclaim happens, to just hand out tokens to the remainder of that community? Keep in mind that plot tokens are an "I win" button in any plot auction... they are not "coin value" in the regular auction process. So you are really asking for the ability to trump any coin bid in the auction. Shouldn't the players from your own community who have been playing and gathering coin on the US servers have a better chance at a lair bid because they have shown dedication to the game as a whole?

In my opinion, it belittles their commitment to the game and the communities that you are joining when you ask to be given a plot or lair token, even if they also get one. You all had the opportunity to come start characters on the live server, start to gather cash, learn the community, and join guilds with old friends and new.

Now, if plot reclamation happened before the transfers, I'd agree that you have a great deal to yell about. But all of your beloved main characters and alts from Unity, their gear, all the items stored on your plots or in your lairs (including stacks of resources or novians you had stored), and all your coinage (which is part of your inventory despite fear-mongering in this thread to the contrary) are being tranferred to a US shard of your choice.

The only proposal I've hear in this thread so far that I'd support, without a great deal of convincing, is that plot owners might be given the sale price set on the plot when Unity shut down as extra cash. That would let them participate fairly in the plot reclamation and auction process.

As far as novians, the novians that you get back when deconstructing a structure are based on how many resources you put into the structure, not how many resources it would currently take to make that structure. So for lairs, which recently had their construction materials drastically reduced (except for halls), you'd be getting back an overabundance of novians, which the devs *may* have felt was worse than not returning novians. I can't speak for their decision making process, but can offer a possible line of thought.

Finally, in case anyone reading this thread hasn't been paying attention to the other forums, please note that my title of Emissary does not mean I am a developer, or even an unpaid intern. I am a player who has elected to help convey opinions of players expressed in-game or on non-VI forums to the developers, and bring answers back to the those players if given permission. Nothing said above represents official policy, only my own opinions.

[fireblade]

what does anyone think of this http://community.istaria.com/pg.php/unity_transfer

im not exactly sure what to make of what will and won't be transferred in regards to plots

while i don`t think ill be that bothered if i don't get a token, im going to be rather irritated about not getting at least the value of my old plot, and somewhat irritated about not getting anything for what i had built

[Velea]

(Merged Firestorm's thread in to this one, as it is on the same topic)

[fireblade]

As far as novians, the novians that you get back when deconstructing a structure are based on how many resources you put into the structure, not how many resources it would currently take to make that structure. So for lairs, which recently had their construction materials drastically reduced (except for halls), you'd be getting back an overabundance of novians, which the devs *may* have felt was worse than not returning novians. I can't speak for their decision making process, but can offer a possible line of thought.

that may or may not be true, personally i don`t think it would be hard to take the number of each type of novians and then divide it by the ratio between the old and the new building requirements (or the lowest ratio if there is more than one), and round to the nearest whole unit

[Oakleif]

Fireblade, some of each transfer has to be done by hand, from what we've been told on these boards... that sounds like more hands-on time spent in a) trying to configure the already tested automatic parts of the transfer, or b) time spent manually updating characters. Either way sounds like more delay in the process to me... wouldn't you rather be playing?

[fireblade]

at this point personally, can`t speak for anyone else, the time it took to build things (an earn enough to buy my lair in the firstplace) probably would be longer than the extra time to transfer, i don`t have huge amounts of time to play and id rather not spend the time i do have redoing something ive already done once if i don`t have to

[Fidri]

How is it fair to those players from your own community to hand out plot or lair tokens when they have been gathering cash for the day when plot reclaim happens, to just hand out tokens to the remainder of that community? Keep in mind that plot tokens are an "I win" button in any plot auction... they are not "coin value" in the regular auction process. So you are really asking for the ability to trump any coin bid in the auction. Shouldn't the players from your own community who have been playing and gathering coin on the US servers have a better chance at a lair bid because they have shown dedication to the game as a whole?

In my opinion, it belittles their commitment to the game and the communities that you are joining when you ask to be given a plot or lair token, even if they also get one. You all had the opportunity to come start characters on the live server, start to gather cash, learn the community, and join guilds with old friends and new.

Okaleif, you almost make it sound like if the players from Unity which did not start over on a NA shard, are not committed to the community and to the game, because they could/would not make a substitute for their original character(s). I am sure you did not mean to imply this, as it would be quite a bold statement.

As far as novians, the novians that you get back when deconstructing a structure are based on how many resources you put into the structure, not how many resources it would currently take to make that structure. So for lairs, which recently had their construction materials drastically reduced (except for halls), you'd be getting back an overabundance of novians, which the devs *may* have felt was worse than not returning novians. I can't speak for their decision making process, but can offer a possible line of thought.

As you put it nicely yourself, "the novians that you get back when deconstructing a structure are based on how many resources you put into the structure". If the difficulty of making the resources for lairs have not changed, and only the amount needed to complete a structure, I would see absolutely no reason why "getting back an overabundance of novians" would be worse than returning novians. You would still have done the exact same amount of work, only on Unity it completed less structures. Could you maybe explain yourself?
As for biped plots, I cannot think of a community related reason to not give back novians for work already done. Even if 80% was given back, that would still safe me months compared to getting nothing.
Though as I am typing this, it pops to my mind this might be a very twisted way to stimulate world economy. Nono, it must be a technical reason.

[Oakleif]

Okaleif, you almost make it sound like if the players from Unity which did not start over on a NA shard, are not committed to the community and to the game, because they could/would not make a substitute for their original character(s). I am sure you did not mean to imply this, as it would be quite a bold statement.

The opposite of stating that a group has shown dedication to the game is not the statement that anyone else has not shown such dedication. The opposite of "all are" is "some are not", and the opposite of "some are" is "none are". I'm sorry if that distinction in English did not carry over to any foreign speakers.

However, I will go so far as to state that anyone who chose to not make a character on one of the US servers has not yet shown dedication to the community they will be joining upon transferring their character. Again, however, that does not preclude their showing such dedication after the transfer.

Though as I am typing this, it pops to my mind this might be a very twisted way to stimulate world economy.

Oh! There's a thought.

[LOVWYRM]

Please Unitarians, remember that:

It was NOT VI who killed the European server, it was NOT VI who nearly killed the whole game.

But it IS VI who saved us, giving us the opportunity to play, or play again, even with our old chars.

Just wanted to point out that.

Considering Oakleifs statements: As he said it`s his personal point of view, based on his experiences.
I am not goin`to discuss that here (I´ll send you a pm Oakleif, as soon I find some time today)

[Takora Drakan]

However, I will go so far as to state that anyone who chose to not make a character on one of the US servers has not yet shown dedication to the community they will be joining upon transferring their character. Again, however, that does not preclude their showing such dedication after the transfer.

I think with that you goo abit too far and you should rethink it. With that you give all a stamp now ho did not pay Vi and maked a char until now as "not hz lovers".

I'm surprised that so much unity players even bother to come back after more than a year in the void to be honest.

[Fidri]

The opposite of stating that a group has shown dedication to the game is not the statement that anyone else has not shown such dedication. The opposite of "all are" is "some are not", and the opposite of "some are" is "none are". I'm sorry if that distinction in English did not carry over to any foreign speakers.

You are right, I should have paid more attention in logic class. My bad.

However, I will go so far as to state that anyone who chose to not make a character on one of the US servers has not yet shown dedication to the community they will be joining upon transferring their character. Again, however, that does not preclude their showing such dedication after the transfer.

Your statement is clear, thanks you. I must say it does not make me feel particular welcome. But it does not apply to me anyway, since I did have a 6 months grandfather subscription, and now 3 active subs.

Anyhow, I wonder how long it is going to take before we will have the first Unity characters dropping in on Chaos, Order or Blight. Since the official email went out, I hope to hear additional official statements soon

[Hitachio]

I personally think it takes quite something to come back to a game, what you didnt play anymore for a while as us old Unity players regardless if you played on US shards or not, you couldnt play your old main character.

Some players could bring it up to start on the US servers and start from bottom up, some couldnt wether it was because of payment options or the will. That still doesn't mean that players are not supporting the game anymore, or not loving it.

If you imagine what we all went through, before the servers went down. I won't start a list about this because it would get way to huge, and we better look forward what is about to come and not what is behind us.

[Takora Drakan]

Anyhow, I wonder how long it is going to take before we will have the first Unity characters dropping in on Chaos, Order or Blight. Since the official email went out, I hope to hear additional official statements soon

I asked that in a support ticket and they told me it should not take more than a few days to make a transfer, but don't quote me on that. It's sure difficulter if the owner dont remembers all and VI has to search in the database the chars and such.

[Sigi]

Please Unitarians, remember that:

It was NOT VI who killed the European server, it was NOT VI who nearly killed the whole game.

But it IS VI who saved us, giving us the opportunity to play, or play again, even with our old chars.

Just wanted to point out that.

Very well said Lov

[Terao]

I can life with the fact we do not get novians - even if it's lot of work rebuilding a complete plot. My guild owned 4 plots 80x80 with two complete sets of JM shops, around 50 silos and handfull houses... But at least I'd like back the value in coin we've spend for those plots...

[Arietna]

As an ex-Unity player, and a current Chaos player...

If any other ex-Unity people want help to rebuild what has been lost, there's a very active "Construction Jobs" channel with a lot of builders on it. I'm sure that (as well as me) there are other builders willing to help out for little or even nothing, to welcome you back and make the loss feel less of a problem.

Once the plot reclaims have been done, I think there will be plenty of plots for people to rebuild and replan.

[Amarie Ancalimon]

I've just posted a thread on the announcement forum, but wanted to repost here so that it is in context for those following this thread:

There's been some questions floating around regarding Unity Transfers and our decisions / status regarding plots and the structures on plots. The decision to not give a plot token and not give novians for structures were separate.

Plot Tokens: We are not giving plot tokens in order to put everyone who has been waiting for a plot or lair on even footing when plot reclaims begin. We do understand that Unity players who are transferring over lost their plot/lair on Unity, but we also felt that players who have been playing on Order or Chaos over the last 18 months, waiting for a plot or lair to open up, also deserve a chance at purchasing a plot/lair. They, too, are homeless and have been for quite some time. We do feel that once plot reclaims begin there will be enough available homes for everyone. If it turns out we are wrong and there are not enough to go around, we're committed to working to add more plots and lairs to Istaria.

As an alternative to the plot tokens, we will include the coin value of any owned plots as part of the transfer. This value is based on the starting price of the plot, not the asking / last sale price. This "Home Equity Reimbursement" will give players who have lost their home a starting point with which to purchase a new one, but not provide them with an extreme advantage over current Order and Chaos players.

Novians: The decision to not give novians for structures was more of a technical one. As I indicated in one of my previous messages, we have to come to a point where we decided that people from Unity had been waiting long enough, and we'd worked out as many of the problems with character transfers as we realistically could in a given time frame. That time frame was actually extended a few times, to the point that we know delays were starting to "wear on the patience".

Please help us to spread the word and have your friends join us. We're excited to finally offer a new home for Unity players and are looking forward to seeing you over the next few weeks. We've ironed out all the little details, and people are sending in transfer requests at a rapid rate. Players on Chaos and Order should be prepared to welcome the Unitarians to their new homes as early as next week - if not sooner.

With that said, please allow me to be among the first to say "Welcome Back!"


-- Amarië AncalÃ**mon
Community Manager

[GalemThawn]

We're exciting -- Amarië AncalÃ**mon
Community Manager

I don't know you personally, but OK if you say so. You are an exciting group.

[Fidri]

Thank you for this official word on a lot of unanswered questions, Amarië. I think these were exactly the questions we needed answered, and I think the choises VI has made make sence.

*bounces around excited*

[Amarie Ancalimon]

I don't know you personally, but OK if you say so. You are an exciting group.

Trust me, we're bundles of exciting all wrapped up tight in a small package.

(But what because what I meant to say is excited, I editted... darn that whole "tense" issue.)